Picnic, How To feed babies

Lane Cove River Tourist Park, Sydney (Australia)

1983-03-19 Picnic Camera 2 Lane Cove Australia DP-RAW, 142'
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Advice to Sahaja Yogis in Lane Cove Park, Sydney (Australia). 19 March 1983.

Shri Mataji: What a beautiful place you have!
Warren: Let’s sing Mother’s mantra.
Shri Mataji [to a baby]: Hello!
Beautiful place.
What a beautiful place, he? Beautiful place under the sun.
Sahaja Yogini: It’s been in the flood and it’s muddy.
Shri Mataji: Yes.
It’s a nice shady place also.
Shri Mataji [to a child]: You’re playing, did you go on the river?
How can you all be sitting there, it’s so muddy.
[Cut in the video]

Is that a nest?
Warren Reeves: No, that’s a dead branch Mother, just a dead branch hanging down.
Shri Mataji: Hm.
Warren: It’s a little bit like mistletoe.
Sahaja Yogini: In this part, there are mistletoes all around.

Shri Mataji: This is the eucalyptus.
Sahaja Yogi: Yes. [conversation unclear]

Sahaja Yogi: There are flowers and then they become nuts.
Shri Mataji: The one we saw? These are the same?
Warren: The same flowers that You saw in– where is it- in Adelaide.
Shri Mataji: The ones which are like Ganesha’s flowers?
Warren: Yes, yes, yes, Mother.
Shri Mataji: The four petals?
Warren: But it has a much bigger base.
Shri Mataji: Let Me see.
Warren: Much better base. There are all different shapes and sizes but the one we saw had definitely, had four sections on it.

Shri Mataji: These are all different things that have eyes sorts of things. Is that the one?
Warren: [Inaudible]
Sahaja Yogi: That was a banksia nut actually Mother.
Shri Mataji: Hm?
Sahaja Yogi: That was a banksia nut, the one You.
Warren: It was in Perth, was it?
Sahaja Yogi: That was in Perth. It might be in four little slices.
Shri Mataji: Yes, that was another one. That was just like Ganesha.
Sahaja Yogi: Yes. Western Australia is famous for the flower.
Shri Mataji: Great.
Warren: In fact, in the spring time after the rains, Western Australia is just a blaze of wild flowers. It’s famous all over the world for that.
Shri Mataji: There are six, you see? Six. Yes, these are six. So, these are more Swadishthana I should say. The fragrance is different from what we get in our India.
Warren: Yes. It’s a whole range of fragrances, there are many. There are lemon scented and peppermint and –
Shri Mataji: I think one which is that is Indian. Can you get a leave out of that? Let’s see, have a look.
Warren: I think they are bringing You a selection of leaves, Mother.
Shri Mataji: In eucalyptuses.

Children are very happy in the nature. They are so full of joy, children!
Warren: They’ve all been down in the mu, in the river.

Shri Mataji: Come along!
Sahaja Yogini: [Inaudible]
Look at them, look at the children. How they feel one with nature immediately, you see.

Thank you. This too has six. They are so rich.
Thank you, Mother.
Warren: They make a lot of eucalyptus oil from these.
Shri Mataji: Yes. But I feel our is very strong, Indian one. This one is not so strong. It is more chlorophyl than eucalyptus oil.
Warren: Yes, yes. Some of these branches are not so strong.

Warren: It’s the same, I think, that one Mother, it’s not the strong one.
Shri Mataji: Same, same.
Warren: There are no lemon scented ones around at all?
[Conversation between SY inaudible]
Sahaja Yogini: I’ve got a weaky one here, but there’s absolutely no scent.
Shri Mataji: This one, yes. This is the willow, weeping willow, I think.
Sahaja Yogini: No, no it’s a weaky type of [unclear] but it has no scent at all. The lemon one looks similar to that but has a beautiful scent of lemon. Not like that, that’s useless.
Shri Mataji: But this doesn’t have.
Sahaja Yogini: No.

Shri Mataji: So, this has, not that it does not. But very faint.
I think, on the whole, India has got great qualities of –
Warren: Perfume, perfume trees.
Shri Mataji: Yes.
Warren: Flowers.
Shri Mataji: Flowers, everything, even Chandan is growing there. And once, I talked to a lady, a Japanese lady, I said, “I enjoy Japanese garden”. And she said, “But it hasn’t got the perfume that you have in India”.
Warren: Yes, that’s true.

Shri Mataji: We have trees with this Parijata [Nyctanthes arbor-tristis] otherwise, why don’t you bring next time when you come, that Parijata? Very small flowers, you must have seen with a red stem.
Warren: Red stem?
Shri Mataji: Parijata. Next time, I’ll show you if it is there. We have so many scented flowers in our country. One of them is this, of course. But we have another one which we call as Mogra [Arabian Jasmine] which comes to you somehow. You can bring all these here.
Warren: From India.
Shri Mataji: Hm.
Warren: Yes, they should grow here too.
Shri Mataji: Yes, there’s another one called Bakula [Spanish cherry, medlar, or bullet wood]. Bakula is a -looks like more like a wood like thing. Little, little flowers they have. But it’s a huge big tree and the whole place gets filled up with that.
We have so many like that! If they allow you to bring. Do they?
Warren: Well, they don’t. But if we use it discriminately, I think it will be all right. We just part it away in our bag. I mean, there’s no danger, it’s just that some people bring some dangerous seed, they become pest or become source of infection.
This is the type of tree, Mother, that we use for timber. Very, very straight.

Shri Mataji: But this is a very light wood, very light wood.
Warren: Yes. No, no, it’s a hard wood actually.
Shri Mataji: Is it? Is it very hard?
Warren: It’s heavy, weight hard wood.
Shri Mataji: all right. In India, you don’t get them hard.
Warren: In fact, it is so hard that it won’t take a nail easily.
Shri Mataji: Hm, that’s great. It’s another variety. What we get is just a waste, you see.
Warren: Mother, if you like a coke or something?
A girl: Apple juice, Mother, instead of coke?
Shri Mataji [to the girl]: I’ll have little chana first, he? Then bring anything whatever you feel like. A coke would be better.

So, yesterday was a good day.
Warren: You missed a great program, last night. Yes, amazing.
Shri Mataji [to someone else]: Did you hear about it, what happened?

Sahaja Yogi: Yes, Mother, we’ve been questioning people all morning about this advance of the last few days.
Shri Mataji: Tremendous.
Sahaja Yogi: Tremendous work.

Shri Mataji: We have got rid of the evil effects of mister Terence. And he is out, for ever and ever. And I have to tell all of you, who are leaders, I was telling yesterday, that we have to take very mild ways. Especially the leaders have to be extremely mild. They should not be strict, they should not get angry, they should not shout. But a very patronizing way should be. Because that’s the way they can appeal to people. All the time getting angry or disciplining is not a good thing, and judging others. That’s what he did and then he started on jumping. First, he started judging others, correcting others. Then on firmer grounds and firmer grounds.
And also, I think he did not allow it to spread to other places, because he wanted to control, this is the main thing.
Warren: Yes, this is true, he wanted it in one place.
Sahaja Yogini: Mother, it’s apple juice [unclear].

Warren: Even, that is part of the reasons why the ashram at [inaudible] failed Mother, because he basically did not want it to be.
Shri Mataji: Yes. He has had a very bad influence on everyone, very bad influence. Floaty [unsure] influence but of a very bad nature.

And egoistical people is that. But John was like this sometimes and don’t try to get rid of. But John must learn a lesson now, that all kinds of ego must be dropped. Thought he is drop out of Sahaja Yoga, he and his wife, permanently, they have nothing to do, nothing to do! The amount of damage he has done to Sahaja Yoga, you can’t imagine! So many people came in the party- I mean, in the hall- up to the [?] and told Me that because of Warren they left Sahaja Yoga.
Sahaja Yogi: Because of Terence.
Shri Mataji: Because of Terence.
Shri Mataji: I still combine him with you.
Warren: I don’t mind Mother.
Shri Mataji: Yes, because he was so much identified and he just used my name under his name.
Warren: Yes, he did Mother.
Shri Mataji: Very nasty fellow. Very rotten person, rotten to the core and the way he behaved, did they tell you? It’s very shameful to behave like that.
And I could telephone to his father-in-law and the father-in-law told Me there were very ashamed of themselves, this, that. I said, “This is a permanent [unclear] now.” You do what you like and then just you say, “Sorry”. Nothing doing, we are not going to have any more of that.
And she [the wife] is a liar. She has told him lots of stories. She made a big thing out of him as if he was something special. She was – not at all! In India, she is not regarded as even a Sahaja Yogini. So many people don’t think her to be a Sahaja Yogini. She was out of Sahaja Yoga for five years for misbehaving. And she thinks no end of herself. These dream and all those businesses, you should all forget these nonsensical things that she told you. That, “This is the dream we are having” and “Dreams, they came and told me”. Carry [unsure], I’m rather worried because you have been with that horrible fellow. Better beat him with shoes and that, every day. Can you go and do it now, nicely?

Horrible fellow.
Actually, I never though him anything good, much. But mister Warren was rather anxious that he should be pulled in within. And when I said that, “Warren is you leader”. He said, “You should also take the name of Terence”. I never thought him to be something good. But it was a nice thing that he came down, it allowed Me to see him, he was exposed, and that’s how we got rid of him properly.
Warren: That was the idea. Mother that’s why. We wanted him to go away.
Shri Mataji: To go away.
Warren: So, everybody could see it, not just Sydney ashram, or Melbourne or somewhere.
Shri Mataji: Really good [unsure].

He has done nothing for Sahaja Yoga, nothing so far. So many marriages he’s broken, so many people he’s talked rude, he’s talked roughly. Isn’t it? And some of them are not willing to come back because of this. He said horrible things, you know. Maybe your wife also, maybe one of them, I don’t know. Just find out. Christine told Me that it is him who created a problem for her. He’s been- Christine took that ego behaviour.

Warren: Christine mainly.
Shri Mataji: Christine. Hm. Not only Christine, yesterday Michel’s mother was here to tell that her husband is not willing to come to Sahaja Yoga anymore. She is there. She told Me the same thing.
Warren: Who is it Mother?
Shri Mataji: So many of them.
He’s very dangerous. She has got married by [unclear]. At least she’s got a good father-in-law whom they can hinge [unsure] very well.
[to a child]: Kamala!
But then I had to declare, but one lady who was there was a reporter. She reacted very strongly. And we have to now deal with her on Monday.
Warren: On Tuesday.
Shri Mataji: Or Tuesday perhaps, Tuesday morning. She’s coming to Sydney. It’s terrible.

Better now, much better.
Sahaja Yogini: I feel Left Swadishthan. I feel it’s very strong and Left Nabhi.
Shri Mataji: That’s it. That is him! Give bandhan. Useless fellow. I think best is to give yourself a bandhan so that he does not attack you.
Some sort of a cancer, I think. Yes.
Sahaja Yogi: Like the false gurus Mother, it won’t be easy to get them out of the brain.
Shri Mataji: [Laughter]. You should be them with shoes. You have to put Me in your brain, first of all. Just put Me in your brain. Just say, “Mother, you are in my brain”. That’s all. That’s a mantra.
All right? Seven times. Just say that seven times.
Sahaja Yogis: “Mother, you are in my brain”. [seven times]

Shri Mataji: Hum. Nirvichara.

[To a Sahaja Yogi who took a photo]: You’d better hide! [Laughter].

Warren: Everything becomes peaceful.

She is better now. Good?

So, now, Warren is coming with Me. And who eels is coming?
Warren: Matthews is going and-
Shri Mataji: Matthews.
Warren: Matthews and Albert.
Shri Mataji: Albert is going. So, and we are going to fix up for our next trip to India. I may not be able to come next year. I don’t know whatever is the situation because I’m going to be rather busy building up ashrams for you to travel in India.
So, I don’t know what will be the situation next year. But in any case, you all are coming and we are thinking of making it one month and one month. So, some people who want to come in this month, come in the first month and others in second month. And that will reduce pressure because we will be having more people now. And these rips also may come to an end after some time [Laughter]. Because it’s, you know, it is very difficult to manage the whole stuff with so many people going. And I think you are very much uncomfortable also.
Sahaja Yogi: Touring with You, Mother?
Shri Mataji: Yes. [Laughter].
Sahaja Yogi: We’ve talked about it a number of times in Sydney. Most of us have felt that the most enjoyable part of the Tour, apart of course of a beautiful climate in Delhi, was main Maharashtra. And, You know, we all seem to recall affectionately that the buses and the dust and the moving. But we did miss that, Mother, when we got to Delhi. There was a great joy in meeting those people and sharing programs.
Shri Mataji: I can take you to a dense forest this time, if you want. The thing is that in month, you’ll have to do Maharashtra. Three weeks, it will be Maharashtra and one week, it will be lapped, overlapped instead of [unclear]. Like that you know about what- ah, no. Four weeks will be in Maharashtra, one week in Delhi, overlapped.
Warren: Yes.

Shri Mataji: For about two, three days, if you want to get married or also talk with us [unsure] you see. So, we can have about three days overlapped.
Warren: So, it will be a four weeks Tour and one week overlapped.
Shri Mataji: No, one week overlapped, we can’t have so many people in Delhi. You see, double [unclear].
Warren: Yes, I see it’s impossible.
Shri Mataji: Impossible. So, what we can do, we can have a group of people will go from here, for one week in Delhi. And the others will be coming for another week in Delhi. But in between, we can have three days, three days which could be overlapped. Only three days, it could be easier.
Warren: Maybe one group could stay in a temple or something like that, Mother.
Shri Mataji: One group can stay in the temple for two nights, it’s all right.
Warren: Also, those that had to go home early, could always leave from Bombay again and go back, if they could only stay for one month.
Shri Mataji: Yes.
Warren: They don’t have to come up to Delhi for the extra week.
Shri Mataji: Yes. Those who want to come to Delhi can come. Otherwise, they need not. Because Delhi will be- mostly, you’ll be staying with other people and not with Sahaja Yogis also, isn’t it?
Warren: Yes.
Shri Mataji: That’s a good idea. Because you enjoyed it very well.
Warren: That was the best part of Delhi, Mother.
Shri Mataji: Hm.
Warren: The part of your programs, that was the thing.
Shri Mataji: That was the thing you all enjoyed. So, we’ll have hundred people for the first week and hundred- first month and hundred for the next. Because this time it was hundred forty together. It was too much. So, we’ll have two groups.

Sahaja Yogi: Sahaja Yoga leaders of the world will start battling, Mother, I imagine, anytime now, for their quota.
Warren: The only problem with our list, Mother, is that You are going to be in two places at once.
Shri Mataji: Yes, that I’ll have to do all this.

Shri Mataji: Two months, I can give for all this. It always took too months for any [unclear]. So, we can manage with two months. But then we’ll not have many programs in Bombay. And for fifteen days, or fifteen and seventeens days, eighteen days, I’ll be in Delhi. So, we can have eighteen days programs in Delhi. In Bombay, we can have about three days here and three days there. That, we’ll have to adjust.

Any other suggestions you have?
Warren: People can start working on the assumption that they will be going about what time, about Christmas time?
Shri Mataji: Yes.
Warren: Before Christmas, Mother or?
Shri Mataji: Before Christmas
Warren: Just before Christmas.
Shri Mataji: It’s easy to arrange that time.
Warren: Yes.
Shri Mataji: So that it will be January and February. And we are again back in March.

Shri Mataji: Is she crying? Which one?
Sahaja Yogi: [Inaudible].
Warren: No, it’s the other one.
Has anyone got any suggestions or anything that-
Shri Mataji: Yes, that’s better to tell –
Warren: Mother is just asking. Or any ideas that they want to put up a map of the trip in India? Don’t be shy.
Sahaja Yogi: [Unclear]
Warren: Can we have a visit to a silk-mill to see how saris are woven?
Shri Mataji: For that you have to go to Benares [called Banarasi or Varanasi] to see the saris woven. That’s done in Benares most of the silk saris. You don’t find them in Delhi or anything. But –
Warren: But once in Dhulia, in Dhulia we saw saris being made.
Shri Mataji: Yes, yes.
Warren: But they were cheaper ones.
Shri Mataji: Cheaper saris. But for these special intricated ones, you see, it has a fold. Silk. Mostly you can find cotton ones being made here but not silk. But this fellow who gave you dhotis, you can go to this place and see.

Warren [to a Sahaja Yogi]: Did you bring the trunk? Can you bring it over? Mother can look at those things right now. Take a couple of people to help you.

Shri Mataji: What about the presents that Dhumal has sent for you?
Warren: They haven’t arrived. 25th, they’ll arrive.
Shri Mataji: Very sad.

Warren: Did you see them all, Mother? You saw them?
Shri Mataji: Oh! Nice things. We brought it with such love for you, you see. Just, what a shame! Really.
Shri Mataji: So, what about your ordering for the juices, you were saying. Juice machine or something.
Warren: Somebody is looking into it more carefully. Mister Fy [unsure] is the only one who did it in Bombay. I want somebody else to know a little bit more about it. They cost about, from about fifteen hundred up to about three thousand. Three thousand for a bigger one which has capacities to roll about four or five stalks at once.
Shri Mataji: That’s a better one.
Warren: I want to wait now until we get Queensland open, because the cane has not begun until the north cost of Queensland- of New South Wales. So, only when we get Brisbane open, should we start that project.
Shri Mataji: That’s a very good idea.
Warren: Because there’s no cane down in this area. That will be maybe a next year project now. Mother, should we start up Brisbane ourselves in the next few months or leave it?
Shri Mataji: Yes, yes, you should start. It’s all right.

Warren [to a Sahaja Yogi]: I was wondering how is Albert, is he here? [Conversation between Sahaja Yogis]

Shri Mataji: Well, you’ll get a lot of people from other cults coming. That should be the problem and maybe you might feel it rather embarrassing. But take it slowly and tell them that, “You see, now you have to give up your gurus. We have no quarrel, nothing. But we can’t work it out with your guru. So, please, give up”.

Warren: I think if they start gently up there and then do it too.
Shri Mataji: Yes.
Warren: It could be getting slowly better.
[Conversation between Sahaja Yogis about the dhotis.]

Shri Mataji: So, how are we going to distribute it?
Warren: I think they’ll just have to be very common sensible about it because there is not enough for everybody.
Shri Mataji: If you had told Me, I would have asked him to put some more. But how many did not get the dhotis?
Warren: All the men that did not get dhotis, put your hands up. The ones who did not get the dhotis. Yes, put your hands up? Ah, it’s not many, very few.
Shri Mataji: Must be some of them who are cooking. Just find out from them.
Sahaja Yogi: Mother, three men who are cooking were in India, [unclear].
Shri Mataji: They must have had. All right. So, how many did not get? Please, raise your hands?

One, two, three, four, five, six, seven, eight. So, we have to have four dhotis. So, for two persons. These are for two persons.
Warren: Come on and get them, quickly.
Shri Mataji: I think they are even better so let’s look at these first. They are better quality. These are better quality. For two persons. This is for two persons.
Warren: We cut it in half.
Shri Mataji: Yes, exactly! [Laughter]

[Conversation with Sahaja Yogis about the dhotis].


[Shri Mataji works on babies].

[Cut in the video]

[1:53:48 old video] Sahaja Yogini: What food to give to the baby, at first?
Warren: At first, when they are born.
Sahaja Yogini: No, in the first stage following.
Shri Mataji: [Inaudible] Milk and all that.
Warren: It’s not very proteinic, though.
Shri Mataji: I would say, chana. Chana-porridge, it’s a good idea.
Warren: Chana-porridge.
Shri Mataji: It is chana, is it? It’s a soft one, it has to be a little bit roasted and made into powder. And that is the best, if you can give chana-porridge, it will be good. Little bit or any other porridge. You can start with say, oats and things like that. Simple porridges, you should start on for the baby. But in the beginning, if you give salt, then they will not like anything sweet. So, salt should be avoided in the beginning. But when do you start giving anything to a baby like that?
Sahaja Yogini: Six months.
Shri Mataji: Food?
Sahaja Yogini: Food.
Shri Mataji: Yes, we can make porridges and things like that to begin with. But after say, a month or so, you must start them on liquids, like soups and things. [1:17:43 new video]
Sahaja Yogini: One month old?
Shri Mataji: Yes, you should start. A little bit soup, it’s all right. Nothing wrong.
Warren: Strained.
Shri Mataji: Strained, absolutely strained, just water but, little soup and little things like that would be good for them.
Warren: Some barley water, some barley soup and –
Shri Mataji: Barley water little bit. Barley water is very good. Barley water, or you can start with juices, if you like, and then go to soups and then to, I mean, they, the system must get used to that, you see. Gradually you must bring round children to food. Not suddenly the heavy food.
Sahaja Yogini: Adrian is six months. He hasn’t had anything yet because we got the message that you said that it was six months that they should have food for the first time.
Shri Mataji: Food is different, I mean. Not below six.
Warren: Clear, liquid.
Sahaja Yogini: But, you know, that’s the way we –
Shri Mataji: No, no, no, no, no. ‘Food’ means ‘solid food’. Solid food. You see, what you can give them, rice and dahl cooked together, make it very, because it will train up the system properly. First, you start with juices. Then come to soups and then come to solid food, in the sense that it is semi-solid. You can cook rice and dahl together, make a ‘kitcheree’ [split mung beans, rice and digestive spices, often vegetables]. She knows that, how to make it. Thin it out and give it to the child. That you can do, but not this dahl. Mung dahl. Mung dahl, mung dahl and rice, you can cook together and start with that, after six months. Food means, when there are solid parts. But juices and soups you must have.
Sahaja Yogini: Yes.
Shri Mataji: It’s important.
Warren: And water.
Shri Mataji: And water, you should start immediately. After a month, you should start water, boiled water, you must have. But I saw your child getting, isn’t it? Your child was having water all right?
Sahaja Yogini: Yes, Mother.
Shri Mataji: Yes. What is her age?
Sahaja Yogini: She’s ten months now, Mother.
Warren: Ten months.
Shri Mataji: Ah, ten months, achcha [OK]. But when you started?
Warren: At what age?
Sahaja Yogini: They always had water, right from the very beginning Mother.
Shri Mataji: They have had water.
Sahaja Yogini: Yes, Mother.
Shri Mataji: That’s good. So, they had water.

Shri Mataji: All right. So, what you do, six o’clock, you give him one feed, all right? And nine o’clock, another one. You can feed him one more in the night, so they won’t be hungry, but in between you can give a massage on the body. Say, about seven o’clock you can do the massage. All right? So 7.30, then, he goes to bed. Nine o’clock in his sleep he must have, in his sleep, and then in the morning he’ll get up at about five, that’s all. Very simple. Five or six. But I think you people don’t massage the body so much as prescribed. You have to massage it twice in the beginning, twice: one in the night; one in the daytime. All right? Now what else?

Now what else you wanted to know?
Sahaja Yogini: The baby’s waking at night, Mother. What do we do to get them out of waking up at night-time?
Shri Mataji: You see, they are – because they’re wet, in the night. That’s why they get up, isn’t it? Or for no rhyme and reason?
Sahaja Yogini: Yes, for no rhyme or reason.
Shri Mataji: All right. So, what you have to do is to massage their body with oil and massage their head with oil and put a lot of oil in their heads, you see. And then put some powder and clean it up. Give them a massage in the night. They will sleep very well; they won’t get up.
In the night you should give them a massage in case they are restless in the night or something like that, before sleeping. You give them their last meal, say – about what time you give them last? Eight o’clock, or six o’clock?
Sahaja Yogini: It depends on their age. Gabriel and Luke have their dinner at about six o’clock. Adrian has, he goes to bed at about, he has his last meal at about seven thirty, eight, eight o’clock.

Shri Mataji: All right. So, what you do, six o’clock, you give him one feed, all right? And nine o’clock, another one, you can give like that one more in the night, so they won’t be hungry. But in between, you can give a massage on the body. Say, about seven o’clock you can do the massage. All right?
Sahaja Yogini: Yes, Mother.
Shri Mataji: So, 7.30, then, he goes to bed. Nine o’clock in his sleep he must have. In his sleep, and then in the morning he’ll get up at about five, that’s all.
It’s very simple, five or six. But I think you people don’t massage the body so much, of the child. You have to massage it twice in the beginning, twice: one in the night; one in the daytime.
Sahaja Yogini: Yes, Mother.
Shri Mataji: All right? Now what else?

Warren: When do they stop breast-feeding, Mother?
Shri Mataji: Ten months. Gradually, they should take to bottle. Ten months, they can stop, then twelve, you see. In India they used to stop after three years. Nobody is bothered, but it’s better to stop it by ten, eleven months or so.

Warren: If they don’t get the mother’s milk, say, they have to cut it short –
Shri Mataji: Of course, of course. You should take to bottles. No harm in giving bottle milk. Do it properly. But, you see, if you do not give the nipple in the mouth of the child, of the bottle, from the very beginning, or say about one or two months or three months at the most, they won’t take it easily. So, best is to give once, one feed, after three months. Start giving them one feed. When the child is sleeping you give one feed, then the child is used to the nipple, you see. You have to understand the child has to get used to everything. Then they easily move. But otherwise, you suddenly [cut in video].
Sahaja Yogini: Yes, yes, Mother. They were started at six months but then they just didn’t want to eat the food that we’ve given them. Some of the other babies, they have been eating solid food for a while –
Shri Mataji: Because the food is not tasty.
Sahaja Yogini: It’s not tasty.
Shri Mataji: You must make it tasty, and you see, you must put proper salt. Salt must be properly put and a little taste must be made, little bit of butter, little bit. You see, you must make it tasty. Otherwise, the food is not tasty. They don’t like it, on the tongue, just like us.

Warren: I tell them, Mother, in Sydney, they must have salt in their food and they must have-
Shri Mataji: Oh, this is a very funny idea, not to have salt. Do you all suffer from high blood pressure?
Warren: In Melbourne they refused to put any salt in food –
Shri Mataji: You see, without salt you cannot do your respiration. Ask any doctor. If there is no sodium chloride in your blood, you see, your respiration will go down. These things are essential for health, but not too much of everything. Salt is needed for food. I mean, these are all funny ideas that are coming up. But the worst thing is that you are so naïve, just like children! I mean, if anybody tells us, “Don’t take salt”, we’ll just be saying, “Oh, you must be coming from lunatic asylum!” But if you are suffering from high blood pressure, if there’s a problem of that or something, then it’s different. Salt is very important for teeth, for everything. To feel relaxed, is the best way to reduce the blood pressure.
What else is there?

Warren: There’s also a belief that if you give children sweet foods, as a small baby and child, that it will grow up and have blood sugar problems. So, they give very sour, sour lemons, sour fruits –
Shri Mataji: You see, I told you that, you see, that how blood sugar comes in because of diabetes, isn’t it, not because of sugar. It comes only because of diabetes. Diabetes comes because of thinking too much.
If you make your child agitated all the time, you want him to think and do this very well in the school. At the age of five years, if you want him to do “O” level, then what will happen? [Laughter]
You see, she wants to make the child into a competition. What is left over by you then? Take it easy. Let the child study as well as grow normally.

Warren: There’s also a belief that if you give children sweet foods, as a small baby and child, that it will grow up and have blood sugar problems. So, they give very sour, sour lemons, sour fruits –
Shri Mataji: You see, I told you that, you see, that how blood sugar comes in because of diabetes, isn’t it, not because of sugar. It comes only because of diabetes. Diabetes comes because of thinking too much.
If you make your child agitated all the time, you want him to think and do this very well in the school. At the age of five years, if you want him to do “O” level, then what will happen? [Laughter]
You see, she wants to make the child into a competition. What is left over by you then? Take it easy. Let the child study as well as grow normally.

Warren: Is it wise for the baby to sleep in the same bed as the parents? And up to what age, Mother?
Shri Mataji: For very small, six of age, not every time, it’s not proper. I don’t’ think it’s good all the time. But a little bit, a while, and then the child must sleep in the, always be sleeping in his bed. Always, sleeping in his bed is the best, but in the same room, not in some other room. But then you should take the baby with you when you are nursing or anything. For a while, that’s all. But mostly the child should be in the bed. It’s not with the parents, it is sleeping between the two parents to be crashed. [Shri Mataji laughs]

Warren: Until what age should young children be kept in the same bedroom?
Shri Mataji: I mean, even now my children sleep with me! So, what can I tell you? You see, we are different type of people. We don’t undress ourselves when we sleep. That’s the problem with you. I hope Sahaja Yogis are not sleeping like that. Please don’t sleep without clothes. The bhoots will enter into you. You must wear your cloth and then you’re asleep. I’m telling you, don’t sleep without clothes. The bhoots, that’s the best way the bhoots enter you. What is the need? I don’t understand.

Sahaja Yogini: Mother, some of the babies have been experiencing a lot of pain while they’re cutting their teeth, when the teeth are coming through.
Shri Mataji: There’s a very old medicine, called “Steagments [unsure] powder”. “Steagments powder”, write it down.
Warren: Yes, I know that one.
[Cut in the video]
Shri Mataji: … To get some ivory rings, they are very good for children. Ivory ring.
Warren: Teething rings.
Shri Mataji: Yes. Ivory rings. You get them in India. You get your plastic ones. We get ivory ones. You get some of these rings, these are very good for children.
Warren: Albert, you’d better get this.
Albert: Yes, what is that?
Warren: Ivory ring, ring. Teething rings.

Sahaja Yogini: Mother, another question. What do You think about dummies for the babies?
Shri Mataji: Dummies?
Sahaja Yogini: Yes. You know what dummies are?
The little rubber thing shaped like a nipple, to an extent, and –
Shri Mataji: You see, they might develop their, their teeth are coming out, you see, if you give too much of that.
Sahaja Yogini: Yes, if you give too much. But a little bit of, maybe to settle the baby down to sleep.
Shri Mataji: It’s all right, a little bit is all right, but try to keep it away. The best is to give Vishuddhi treatment and not have it. Otherwise, the teeth will be running parallel and you will have a lot of problems settling them back. But a little bit you can give that. They are called as dummies, are they?
Sahaja Yogini: Dummies, they’re called, yes. Dummy nipples.
Shri Mataji: Oh, all right. There’s no harm.

Warren: They want to know about toilet training, Mother.
Shri Mataji: Now, what is that?
Warren: How to stop the baby from wetting the nappies, and using the pot, basically.
Shri Mataji: About at the age of only two months or three months, you must start touching the bottom of the baby to a pot, you see. Keep a little pot like that. And try to, say, make some sounds, “shuu, shuu”, like that, and all that. The child starts peeing and he gets used to the touch, you see, of the thing. Then we know that’s an impulse, you see, in him, that acts as a message. And you can do, it’s very simple.
Sahaja Yogini: Very early, then.
Shri Mataji: Very early you must start it. Very early.
Sahaja Yogini: We don’t do that.

Shri Mataji: That’s it because you have these dry nappies that’s why.
Warren: Mr Freud said we shouldn’t do it, Mother.
Shri Mataji: Why?
Warren: It will give you a complex.
Shri Mataji: Why?
What is the complex?
Sahaja Yogi: It is mister Freud who said you shouldn’t do.
Shri Mataji: A complex? We all Indians do it, we don’t have any complexes, I think. Why? The one who has given you a real complex is Mr Freud himself.
What complex can be? [Kya o ga]. I can’t understand. Beyond my mind, it’s.

Warren: All this nonsense is about how you were toilet trained and if you, if you – it explains why you behave in a certain way when you’re grown up and according to how you sat on the potty and – [Laughter] Really, it’s true, Mother.
[Big laughter from Shri Mataji]

Shri Mataji: You don’t even know what you see. What a thing you all now said!
Sahaja Yogini: Another question, Mother.
Shri Mataji: That’s why you people are very addicted to bathrooms also. [Inaudible]
Warren: It is, it’s true.
Shri Mataji: We are not. You see, we are there hardly for five, ten minutes, have a bath, get out of it, you see.
The addiction comes from that kind of a thing. You’re very ‘bathroom cultured’, that’s why.
Warren: All this graffiti business is-
Shri Mataji: Graffiti?
Warren: Graffiti, writing on the walls, all this stuff. It’s all coming from that.
Shri Mataji: On the walls?
[Big laughter from Shri Mataji]

Writing on the walls. You know, the best thing if you are constipated, take a newspaper. That’s all, it’s a simple thing. [Inaudible]

That’s how I’ve seen some people have treated them. They said, “We get constipated”. I said, “Read a newspaper in the morning. That’s the place you should read newspapers”. Actually, nowhere else.

That is its worth [unsure], nothing else, you know.

I would do that. When I don’t get any chance or anything, I would say that, “I’d better read the newspaper, in the bathroom”. That’s the place, you see, because such filth is there.
No, no, no, no. He is, I tell you, he must be a sweeper in his last life. Must be something wrong with this Freud, I think, he must have been a sweeper.

Warren: Twelve years ago in England, Mother, there was a man called Dr Alex Comfort, who’s basically a descendant of Freudian psychology, who said that you should have contraceptives available in the marketplace for children to buy, as from the age of twelve. So, that’s how far we’ve gone.
Shri Mataji: For what?
Warren: Contraception, you know the –
Shri Mataji: Oh, I see! What? Where? Oh, no!
[Big laughter from Shri Mataji]
This is another joke. I thought it must be for constipation and things.
Warren: Maybe that, too. That’s instead of the newspaper.
Shri Mataji: Here boys don’t even understand these things.
Warren: They do here, Mother, in the West.
Shri Mataji: In the West, maybe, here they are over grown.
You don’t allow them to be natural, putting all these ideas into their heads. Twelve years boy!
Always these nonsenses …

Sahaja Yogini: Mother, I have some more questions. What should mothers do about constipation in the babies?
Shri Mataji: You see, they should not have constipation themselves.
Sahaja Yogini: Well, they do when they’re on the formula mixtures.
Shri Mataji: Yes, so we have so many ways of removing in India. Like you take that ‘adjwain cartura’ and all that, all the time when the little baby [Cut in the video]
Black grapes, dried ones, raisins, black raisins.
Sahaja Yogini: Black raisins.
Shri Mataji: Yes and prunes. Prunes with the orange juice. Orange juice is very good. And also milk, boiled milk in the night.
Sahaja Yogini: Cow’s milk?
Shri Mataji: Hm, very good.

Sahaja Yogini: That’s another thing, Mother. When they’re weaned from the mother’s breast, are they weaned on to cow’s milk?
Shri Mataji: To what?
Sahaja Yogini: Cow’s milk.
Warren: From breast to cow’s milk, or from breast to formula mixture?
Shri Mataji: I mean, we give cow’s milk, because this formula, nowadays, I don’t know what they make-
Warren: It makes black stools, it’s very –
Shri Mataji: If you get cow’s milk, better is to remove the cream, put the water in it, and boil it. Remove the cream, and that’s the best for the children. But boil it together, not separately. Always boil the milk and the water together, never separately.

Warren: So, all these mothers on formula should transfer to cow’s milk?
Shri Mataji: Uh?
Warren: All these mothers who are feeding their babies on formula, on this mixture, on this powdered stuff, should change to cow’s milk?
Shri Mataji: Yes, I mean, if the children can digest cow’s milk, nothing happens if they can digest it. But you must know what is the amount of water you should put for it.
Warren: Proportions.
Shri Mataji: Because that’s more natural to take to cow’s milk.
Sahaja Yogini: What about the age group?
Warren: Well, you’re supposed to be feeding them off the breast.
Sahaja Yogini: If you can’t feed them off the breast?
Warren: If you can’t feed them off the breast that’s when you go to –
Shri Mataji: No, but what we do then, you see, for some time, you can take formula because it might be a bit better according to the age group. But, say, after ten months, you can take to cow’s milk, all right. But little bit, one feed you should start, by the time they are about three months, before they are conscious. You must start one feed. Is she giving one feed at least to the baby, or not?
No, not yet. No, no, not her. I’m saying – Barbara?
Barbara: Yes, Mother.
Shri Mataji: Is she giving one feed to the baby?
Barbara: No, Mother. Only breast milk. Only breast.
Shri Mataji: No. You should start now, all right? Otherwise, again he’ll be very angry with the bottle.
Sahaja Yogini: He is, Mother. I’ve tried him on the bottle before.
Shri Mataji: See!
Sahaja Yogini: He doesn’t like it.
Shri Mataji: So, better start earlier always. One feed you must have earlier. Say, one month, you can start, because children here are very adamant type, you see.

Sahaja Yogini: Another thing, Mother.
Shri Mataji: What other things?
Sahaja Yogini: Medication for children, Mother. A lot of Panadol’s given to the baby.
Shri Mataji: Panadol?
Sahaja Yogini: Yes, Mother.
Shri Mataji: For what?
Sahaja Yogini: For temperatures or irritability, teething, when the baby’s crying or upset.
Shri Mataji: No. I don’t think Panadol is a very good thing, horrible!
Warren: No. It contains-
Shri Mataji: It’s not a very good thing, you see.
Warren: Paracetamol.
Shri Mataji: It can make the child very bad later on, the after effects.
Warren: Liver problems?
Shri Mataji: Oh, really, it’s not good. You see, for- say, a child is irritable or anything, you see, you should find out what is exactly the trouble is. Is it due to the stomach trouble or anything? Then according to that you should give.
But there are natural things that you should give to the baby and not unnatural. Say, a child has got a diarrhoea. All right? A simple method is to boil these fennel seeds and mint together. Boil it. Keep it ready and give that with little sugar or candy sugar, and give that to the child twice, thrice, the child will be all right.

Simple things like that, I can give you so many medicines.
Sahaja Yogini: Yes, Mother.
Shri Mataji: Very simple. You should see why the child is sick. This Panadol is something like a sleeping pill only.
Sahaja Yogini: Yes, it is.
Shri Mataji: That’s very bad, as that it.
Sahaja Yogini: Another question, Mother. One of our – [Cut in the video]

Warren: What about Gripe Water, Mother? Do you use that?
Shri Mataji: For the baby it’s all right, but what about the mother? Mother has to take it up, ‘ne’? What else for wind, what you can get here? You must be having some medicines for wind?
Warren: Oh, just the usual ones, Mother.
Shri Mataji: Antacid or [unclear].
Warren: What do you use?
Sahaja Yogini: Is it water, water or the Gripe Water has [unclear]?
Warren: It’s fairly innocuous, isn’t it? But, did they boil the alcohol off it?
Shri Mataji: What is that?
Warren: It originally has some small volume of alcohol.
Sahaja Yogini: Yes, four percent.
Shri Mataji: What is it?
Sahaja Yogini: Four percent alcohol.
Shri Mataji: In what?
Sahaja Yogini: In Gripe Water.

Shri Mataji: No, we don’t give Gripe Water for the children at all. We give this adjwain water to the mother. There’s another way is to – adjwain is the only thing I know very well because – I’ll find out for you if there is something else you can use.

Sahaja Yogini: Should mothers have a diet avoiding wind-producing food?
Shri Mataji: Ah, of course! They should not eat rice at all. They should not eat rice. They should not eat anything that is grown under the earth. Potato, also, they should not. Anything like that. Rice, potatoes, all these things must be avoided.
Sahaja Yogini: Yes, Mother.

Shri Mataji: You don’t know these?
Warren: No, but they are not basic-
Shri Mataji: Rice, Rice is never given to a woman who has got a baby. Till about ten months, she must avoid taking rice.
Warren: So, any wind-producing food should be avoided in the mother.
Shri Mataji: Everything that comes from the Mother Earth, in the sense, from the down below Mother Earth, and also milk. Milk gives wind, very much. Milk also. But milk boiled in an iron pot, you see, made out of steel, but not the stainless one, the other one, doesn’t give.
Sahaja Yogini: Milk boiled in a steel pot, cast iron, cast iron, doesn’t give wind?
Shri Mataji: So, you should boil that milk with the water, whatever it is, together in an iron pot.
Sahaja Yogini: Yes, Mother.
Shri Mataji: So, milk should not be taken like that by mothers directly, at all. If she has to take milk, then take it with some sort of a porridge or something, at the most. She has to take milk, no doubt. So, she should take it with the porridge, or these Crispies or something like that.
Sahaja Yogini: Yes, Mother.

Warren: What about nappies, Mother? Some of the nappies make their legs go out at forty-five degrees.
Shri Mataji: Oh, that’s a terrible thing that you make the children wear, I’m really against it. It’s very handy, but it’s very bad. Poor- this girl has suffered so much. Even now she has problems, you see. It’s plastic stuff. But we don’t use plastic stuff, you see.
We use cotton ones, nice cotton ones and we put little- what you call- absorbent cotton.
Warren: I think we call them flannelette napkins here, Mother.
Shri Mataji: And then we remove the cotton. If the napkin is also wet, we remove the napkin. It can be washed. You see, we can have about twelve or, say, twenty-four, kept like that. It’s very simple, how to make it. I’ll show you.
This is the thing, it’s the nap. [Shri Mataji takes a paper towel].

So, you, get a soft cloth, some sort of a [unclear] something. In India you get such a lot of them ready-made.
Now, what you do is to make it like that [triangle]. All right?
Sahaja Yogini: Yes, Mother.
Shri Mataji: Now, let’s start. Not a thing like this. It’s for a little baby. But you can have soft towelling in flannel [unsure] that works.
Warren: Flannel.
Sahaja Yogini: We get, we get soft towelling.
Shri Mataji: Very soft and thin, all right? Now what you do, you just stitch here, this portion is to be stitched, that’s all. You put the baby down here, [in the middle of the triangle]. Put the little cotton on top here. Put it like that, bring it through this. All right? And make a knot here. It’s finished.
Warren: Standard.
Sahaja Yogini: It’s the standard way. Many of us do it that way.
Shri Mataji: All right. And then you must wash them. Hardly, it takes any time for you to wash. Say, in a day you take about, in the beginning they are small and you need more numbers. Later on, you don’t need them. But you don’t have all these problems of the plastics for the baby. And the child is allowed to breathe, his body grows well. Otherwise, they have, the backside is so pushed in, funny figures. And they also have- what you call- the legs going like that.
Warren: The hip joints go –
Shri Mataji: It’s very bad. It’s very strong and should be avoided.
Sahaja Yogini: You mean the disposables. So, do you mean?
Shri Mataji: The disposables are not good things. Only if you are going out somewhere, you see? This kind of a cloth is the best. This is a soft one and this is very good. Still, for a little newly born it’s thick for us. You see, we don’t do all this, we don’t seam it, not to seam it at all. It’s hard. You see, just take, open it out, just like that.
Sahaja Yogini: Yes, Mother.
Shri Mataji: We don’t seam it.
And now, put it down like that. It’s too big. For a big child, it’s all right.
All right? Now, that’s all! Even if you want you can put like this for a big boy, here a little fold. But normally, for a little baby, it’s all right.
[End of talk]

H.H. Shri Mataji Nirmala Devi