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Public Program. Porchester Hall, London (UK), 13 June 1983.
Shri Mataji: Is it for the loudspeaker? Yes.
We can wait for some time more to organize. It is so unfortunate that it was not published in the newspaper properly, that day – it’s very unfortunate.
Yogi: Excuse me Mother, I think to get this microphone a little closer to you.
Shri Mataji: Eh?
Yogi: Do You want to get this a little closer to You?
Shri Mataji: [The microphone] I’ll have it in My hand.
Yogi: You’ll take this in Your hand?
Shri Mataji: Yes. [Yogi: Okay.] Then that won’t slip out, you know.
Yogi: Ah, okay. That’s ok, this. This is the one…
Shri Mataji: When we say in the newspaper or in an advertisement that you come to such and such hall for your Self-realization, I don’t know what people think about it. Perhaps they think that it is another hocus-pocus or some sort of a cult or some money-making proposition.
But there are some who may not think that way, but they want to have their Self-realization and they come here.
But one must understand that the attitude we should have towards our Self has to be really very earnest.
To raise your Kundalini is not so difficult and to give you so-called realization also not difficult, in the sense that you can feel the cool breeze of the Holy Ghost coming out of the fontanel bone area, you can get your baptism.
But I call it “so-called” because the journey later is the difficult thing, you see.
If the attitude is not earnest, then you just lose it in no time.
So where the people are very ego-oriented – I should say, convex personality is there – it is even difficult to give realization to begin with, and even if you give realization, to maintain it and to make them grow is even more difficult, much more difficult.
Now sometimes Sahaja Yogis ask Me, “Mother, how is it that in India You may give realization to thousands and they all stick on, while here when You give realization to people they just come and go away, are all wasted as described in the parable of Christ of the seeds, that some seeds just were lost on the rocks?”
So why it happens here? I would not blame them, but I would say that they have had no knowledge what Self-realization is, how difficult it is.
If you read Patanjali’s “Yogashastra” you’ll be surprised how they were taught how to lead a good, righteous life after marriage; what was the relationship of a husband and wife; what was rhythm of sex life; how they should treat their children; how to develop their attention towards God every day.
All these things are absolutely missing from the lives of people who have turned their backs to God. Now, whatever you may try to turn your backs to God or to your Self, to your Spirit, it exists and it asserts its own existence in you. It does. Even if you try to defy it and deny it, it comes up, and so people are seeking and seeking.
The tragedy of the whole thing is that very great seekers are born in the West where people have no knowledge what is Self-realization and what one has to do to achieve it and what a great blessing it is to have it.
This is the biggest problem we face all over and now as I am going to America I also dread the same problem there.
Now the thing is, people have full idea as to the value of a diamond. They know if the diamond weighs so many carats, it means this. If it is flawless, it means this. If it is purest blue then it means this. But they don’t know the value of their spiritual life; they don’t know what it is to be spiritual.
Under these circumstances, naturally, what happens that when even they get Self-realization they cannot stick on to Sahaja Yoga and go further with it. Not that they lack in quality. I would say it is not so. I would not say that they are the people who are good for nothing, they are not good for spiritual life.
So all the Sahaja Yogis must have a very compassionate and understanding attitude towards them, that when they come to you they have no knowledge about it. They are not trained that way. They are not taught that way.
I wish the people in the countries where they have lost themselves in the material gains should again read some of these books into details and try to find out what kind of life human beings were supposed to lead and what kind of life we are leading now.
Now the word there is yama niyama, is a word in the Patanjali Shastra, yama and niyama.
The niyama are the rules for yourself, what rules you have to observe.
And what rules you have to observe for others is yama, where – how to deal with others, what should be your relationship to your wife, to your children, to other relations that are there, and how you must respect particular things and to prepare yourself for Self-realization, the ascent.
All this balance has to be there if you have to ascend in life. Even to lead a proper good life you have to be like that.
I tell you, if you go to India you’ll find the country hasn’t got any sanitation whatsoever, hasn’t got all the food that you have, hasn’t got any of your railways or any one of these your telephones as they are. And when I go to India I forget that there are telephones existing. They never use this for Me there. Everything that is so dislocated, mismanaged, all kinds of funny things are there. Sometimes there is a drought. Sometimes there is a flood. All these things are there. Despite that, people are existing only because they know how to lead a proper life, to adjust themselves to natural things.
Now the new disease that has come up in America, AIDS, has really upset Me very much. And I know that it was to come, because today, according to predictions it is not Kali Yuga anymore, it is Kruta Yuga. Is the time when things will happen, Kruta Yuga means when the spiritual powers will work out.
This is the time is already – you know that in our books it is written that the Kruta Yuga has started about sixty years back, and that is how it is, that now the spiritual powers are going to react.
It’s easy to say, “What’s wrong? Who is God? We don’t believe in God.” You’ll have to pay for that. If you go against the nature you’ll have to pay for it. If you do things according to your own ego, you’ll have to pay for it. This is the time that has come. This is for our good. This is not for our bad, because it has been told many-a-times not to do certain things.
Of course, in the Western countries where Christianity is followed is precisely told not to do this, not to do that. But then people say, “Why they have said it?” The only difference is that in the East it is explained why not to do this, why not to do that, what happens. It has gone into the details of it.
But I must say here also people know that this is not to be done. But when you talk about these things, “This is not to be done”, they will brand you as Victorian, or they’ll mock at you, laugh at you, make fun of you. But when they face all these things happening to you, then they don’t know where to go, what to do and how to face up to it. This is the time where the spiritual powers are going to work out; they are going to prove the existence of God. They are going to prove the existence of Divine laws and their operation.
They are going to prove all that is said in all the religions, their unity, and their integration. Everything is going to be proved now today.
Even if you say this many-a-times, many people will not pay any heed to it. They will say, “Oh, Mother is just brainwashing us.”
That’s what people told Me when I came first to England. That I said, “This is not the life human beings should lead. Even for animals it is not suitable. How can you dare into these things and get involved into problems? Later on it will be showing results .”
But nobody was willing to listen to Me at that time and everybody was angry with Me. They said, “This woman is matronly.” There are certain words in English which are very condemning. Like first one of them is Victorian. If you are Victorian you are a gone case, absolutely, that you are branded on; then you can’t talk. But I would say even Victorian was better, where there was some hypocrisy I agree. Hypocrisy is a bad thing. But shamelessness is much worse. If you become shameless the thing spreads like fire. There is no protection. Hypocrisy is at least a little protection from the spreading of it.
And everybody today thinks what’s wrong in it, and I, when I came here, I had such a shock.
I couldn’t believe that human beings could go to that extent to ruin themselves.
This is ruinous, absolutely ruinous it is.
And when a person like Christ, who was nothing but purity, said that, “Thou shalt not have adulterous eyes”; to that extent, to that subtle extent of purity He talked – I was amazed how people have denied Him completely and how all other people like Jews, like even Hindus here, Christians, every sort of people didn’t think what they were professing, what they were claiming and what they were.
Today again, one-by-one you will see more results of wrongdoings to yourself.
This is because you have crossed all the limits of niyamas, how you should be to yourself.
Everyone seems to be sick today, either mentally or physically. Why? Why are they mentally sick there?
This is the physical side of it.
The mental side is, they can run into any sort of thing like witchcraft, like spiritualism, like any guru who comes and talks about God, without finding out the credibility of it, without finding out what others have achieved by it.
Not only that, but I have seen people after being harmed very much, who have been tortured by these gurus, who have been completely made beggars by these gurus, still profess, still fight for those gurus, as if they have lost all their freedom, all their independence to fight it back. The other day one lady came to tell Me that she went to a relation’s place to stay with her, and the relation was so funny that she wouldn’t even give them full food to eat, and in the house there was limited food, and she would lock up everything and they really starved themselves, you see. But she – I knew her very well – so she telephoned to Me.
I said, “You come along to My house,” and just called her and I was amazed why these things happened in the life of that woman. How could she do it? She had no conscience! Somebody starving next door to her. The reason was she was a drunkard. She used to drink a lot. Her husband used to drink.
Now with the amount of money they earn you cannot drink. Is a simple thing, leave alone all the other side of it.
And she was drinking, her husband was also drinking. And they, whatever money they have, they don’t eat much, they just drink, and they were waiting for this woman to disappear. Because once you become enslaved to one particular madness like this, like drinking or anything, then you forget all your relationships with all your other duties that you have to perform. It’s like one madman, you see, doing work like mad, has no consideration of relationships or any duties that he has to perform with others. Then also he has no time to think about the duties towards himself. He becomes such a dry personality that he has no conscience even. And he just shuts up his mind from all that is gracious, all that is sublime, all that is compassion. He is just busy with himself. He wants to drink. He wants to drink, that’s all. Very seriously he’ll say, “Yes, I have to drink now. I like it”. So it doesn’t matter if his dog doesn’t get the food or if his children have to starve or if they have to work on the streets. He doesn’t mind because he has to drink.
Then there is another thing, like today I saw so many people enjoying cricket – I Myself can enjoy cricket very well and I understand cricket very well. But how much time do they pay to themselves in the sense they are just enjoying what is something entertaining. But what about the entertainment of your Spirit? Have you thought of your Spirit at all?
Have you ever peeped into yourself and found out that there is Spirit, which has to be satisfied and entertained? And once you entertain that Spirit you don’t need any entertainment. If you have it, well and good, if you don’t have it, well and good.
That is the highest type of entertainment. That’s the highest type of enjoyment. That’s the highest life that one can ask for.
So all these things come to a level where, “What’s wrong? What’s wrong in this and what’s wrong in that?”
So the nature is now going to show you what’s wrong. Because intelligently you understand, rationally you understand, logically you understand it is wrong. But still there is somebody else who says, “What’s wrong?”
So now, experiencing it you understand. That’s the only way left for nature to make you understand: now experience it, suffer it.
There is another way, is that you can experience your Spirit. Also it’s possible only this Krita Yuga can do that, that you can experience the enjoyment of your Spirit.
Both things are there. When it does one thing, it does the other way also. It also gives you the experience of reality, the experience of truth, the life that is eternal, and that’s what one has to look forward to. But enslavement has to be brought down to a proper shape, little bit.
That also it does. I was amazed some people who had been drunkards and alcoholics, in Sahaja Yoga they came; next day they left it. It does that.
Enslavement of any kind, of any habit, is detrimental to our growth in Spirit.
It is detrimental, but doesn’t matter: if you have some habits they just drop out, as you have seen. Sahaja Yoga is such a kind, compassionate happening that it really makes you a different person who is a master of himself; no more enslavement. All this slavishness goes away. All this fear disappears.
You become master of yourself and in that mastery you are the master of love, master of compassion, master of wisdom. This should happen to all of us.
You are all due for it. You are created for it. You all have evolved for it. You have to have it. But there are so many misidentifications in us with which we are drawn to wrong things, to things which are anti-God, which are anti-Spirit.
So many things are there which divert your mind to that because you have drawn certain conclusions about reality. You think this is the reality. You believe that this is the reality and you want to stick on to that.
But that is not so. I tell you, you have to understand that reality is what it is. You should face it and enjoy it. Don’t try to put your ideas on it. Don’t try to organize the reality. It is what it is. And once you decide within yourself, “So far I have not known and I have to know,” with that humility, you’ll get it.
It doesn’t mean that you have to surrender your money or anything, your self-respect or your freedom. On the contrary, you have to enter into that area where there is supreme freedom, supreme freedom.
You are not free. If you think you are free, you are sadly mistaken, because we are still slaves of so many things.
But once a person is free he is not bothered about anything. Nothing can make him habituated to anything. Nothing. Such a person lives like a king, whether he is in a hut, on a street or in a palace. He is not bothered. Whatever it is he is the king. He doesn’t want anything anymore. He gives. He gives. He’s so rich that nobody can give him anything. He gives and gives and gives. And only thing that it can do is to give; it cannot take anything. The capacity is such that he cannot take anything from anyone. No more these attitudes, how to save money, how to save your labor, how to save your chairs, your powers, your positions. Nothing remains there, because you are the master of everything. Nothing is more important than your own Spirit, which you enjoy, which manifests.
It’s so fortunate that you are born at a time when it is Krita Yuga, and you have taken your birth deliberately to get this realization. That’s why you are here. But how many realize that you have to come to terms with many things?
You have to seek the truth and not the untruth. You don’t have to run after people who make fools out of you or those who try to pamper your ego, or who put spirits in you, and make useless cabbages.
You have to become something greater, healthier, mightier and loving, affectionate, compassionate. That should be the picture of the personality that has to evolve out of human beings. Otherwise we cannot save this world. With the kind of people we have we cannot save.
They are all compromising, they are all manipulating, maneuvering as if they are all getting drowned, and everybody has to somehow or other pull out the person ahead of them to come up. All funny things happening in this world. That is only because we are so insecured. The insecurity will all go away once the light – the light of your Spirit shines.
Let the light shine through and see your beauty and glory and your strength of that great power of love of God within yourself and then you’ll be amazed what it is.
As you know, Sahaja Yoga is not one lecture, is not two, can be hundreds, but the happening takes [a] split of a second. It should happen. Once it happens you can achieve your realization in such a way that you won’t even feel it.
But afterwards you have to put in deliberations. You have to look after yourself. You have to respect yourself and go ahead with it.
There’s no use arguing about it. Even if you argue I can take you up to a point because this is the realm beyond the mind, because mind is a limited thing.
We have to achieve the unlimited and for that a happening has to take place.
We can’t promise you that it will take place. If it takes place, well and good, we can help you in a way to achieve it, but we cannot be sure that it will happen.
So be in a receptive mood and be kind to yourself and achieve your realization.
This is the last time I’m speaking now in London. For quite some time I won’t be here, maybe in November if I come for a short time; I may be in London, may be outside London, somewhere in England; I can’t say.
I hope all those who are today should decide that if they have to achieve their realization as a permanent blessing from God, then they have to go further with it. You cannot just stop it at this meeting. You have to go further with it with greater enquiries.
You have to go to different ashrams and centers that we have; you have to work it out. If you are a big man, like the other day somebody came as a managing director and tried to be funny, I said, “If you are a managing director this is not the place for you.” God doesn’t understand. You may be the king. You might be the president. You might be anyone. God doesn’t understand these man-made positions.
God’s positions are different and if you have to enter into the Kingdom of God come as a humble person. Give up all your ideas about your big positions and big education and all that. Be a humble person.
If you are humble then it will work out, and not only that it will work out but it is the only chance we human beings have to change the whole world. There’s no other chance I can see. I hope all of you will pay full attention to it and ardently, with full devotion, seek your Self and its ascent and its establishment.
May God bless you all.
If you have any questions you can ask Me today. Yes.
Seeker: Shri Mataji, could you say something about collective and the need for people who have been realized to be together?
Shri Mataji: What did he say?
Yogi: Mother, could you please say something about the collective and the need for realized souls to be together?
Shri Mataji: Oh, all right. That’s a very nice suggestion. I would like to say something about collectivity.
So far as you know, in the history of spirituality people have got realization. Many people have got it.
One after another, many people got it but I would say one in a million, one in a ten million, like that, because we have to have some people to talk about it, to begin with.
We always see what was written in the past, you see, but those people who got realization single-handed suffered a lot, and they could not transmit what it was needed to be given to others in a way that would be acceptable.
Now as you see, any discovery is made, like that people can benefit individually.
Every person can say, “Oh, I have got it. So I can have it in my house,” you see; but it is of no value. It is of no value, I can tell you.
I would say a personality like Christ came on this earth. We had Christianity; what have they done about it? I mean, it’s a sad affair. I mean, to think such a personality to come and what a great job He has done to establish Himself on Agnya chakra, what people have done out of it, you see. The reason was He was seldom; He was alone. It was not a mass thing.
That was not the time, because He had to establish this center [points at Agnya].
Without that it could not be mass, all right?
It could not be an en masse realization but He talked about, “You have to be born again,” and all that. But the whole thing fizzled out because they could not get to the essence of it.
One person of that caliber coming on this earth found it impossible to convince people and talk about it.
So one has to understand that anything that is evolutionary first happens to one or two persons only, but then it happens to many people.
Now in Sahaja Yoga there’s another problem apart from that, that it is happening to many people, it is there, no doubt. Thousands are getting realization, it’s no doubt. It’s working out that way, that now the evolution has come to this stage, as I say it’s the blossom time, many flowers are there and they have to become the fruits.
But now why is it necessary to have collectivity when people are getting realization like that, is a very important point one has to understand.
The thing is that now, when you are getting realized, what is happening to you? You are getting related to the whole. Our microcosm is getting related to the macrocosm. Say your body is there and you are sleeping. First you get a little awakening. You open your fingers, all right? Then you open your, another finger.
Now there is a little trouble on your finger and you can’t see anything. So you open your eyes and you pay your attention to your hands. So that trouble may be all right but you need another hand to help me. So you want the another hand also to be awakened to that point, like that.
So when the Sahaja Yogis are getting awakened more and more, you see, the problems that are facing us, we can solve them better, because so many people are working out the problem.
Do you understand My point now? Together! When we are together we understand now there’s a problem, now I’m going to America. I’ve gone in 1970 – 1973 first, I think, yes. 1973 I went first. I was alone! I mean, I gave them very good lectures, we had very big halls filled up and everything – but everything fizzled out.
The reason is the people who got realization didn’t have anybody to look after them, there was nobody to support them, give them assistance, so they got lost.
I mean, they are there, some of them are here and there. Now what has happened now? Today when I’m going to America everybody is praying. In Australia they are praying. In India they are praying. Like attention, you’ll be surprised some people are coming from India to go down to America. Some are coming from Australia to go down to America. Some are coming from France, some from Switzerland. They are all rushing to America. Now the job is in America.
All right, so, like the attention you see, as soon as somebody pricks Me here, My hand goes there, My head goes there, everything works it out.
So the collective working-out effort is going to solve the problem. But supposing if this finger is fighting with this finger, can I write anything? Or if they are secluded and alone, can I use them?
All this body has to become absolutely in concord with each other. But so many are still sleeping. Those who are awakened at least must stick together. Otherwise Sahaja Yoga cannot work out.
Today I find it much easier to give realization, much easier. I was struggling with six people for four years in your London.
Four years, six people. But once they got realization it started working faster and the more people we get – because the channel that is to be used is like nerves in the body.
You become a nerve of that body which is awakened, and once the nerves start working out together realizing that there’s one force that is flowing through them, all of you have to work it out together with understanding of the Divine. It works faster. Any person whose all nerves are at work will be much more dynamic than a person who is half-dead or is full-dead.
So you can understand how collectivity is important.
Then another thing is that going to a very enjoyable part of it, that when the Sahaja Yogis are collectively there, they really enjoy.
Because for the first time you start enjoying human beings, first time. Before this you never enjoyed them. You enjoyed flowers, you enjoyed everything else, but not human beings.
Pure enjoyment of human beings starts coming when you become fully realized.
I’ll give you an example. We went to Calcutta for one day and I was in a room in one hotel and there were three, four Sahaja Yogis in another hotel – another room, and one gentleman came to Me for his realization. And when I raised his thing, the Kundalini, you see, they all got vibrated and they all rushed to My room to know “What has happened, suddenly how is it we got such joy within ourselves”.
They came to see, and this man was there. He was a great soul and they felt the vibrations, tremendous, you see.
So it is not the happening of an individual. It is the happening of the whole. And the individual effort is going to be absolutely useless. It will be all neutralized. If you sit at home, do your meditation, it won’t work out. You won’t go very far. Because the whole has to come up. I’ll give an example that when you churn the butter – in India, I don’t know, we don’t do that way; we do it very naturally – you put a little butter inside that and then again you start churning.
So the butter starts gathering round that butter, all of it comes together. But some particles are left out. They stick to the sides, stick to that. They are no more as butter; they are thrown away as buttermilk. Is as simple as that. You see, the more you gather together, you really enjoy the spirit of friendship, spirit of mirth, spirit of love in pure form.
So far the love is biased. There’s sex, there’s lust, there’s money, there’s this, there’s relationship. This is, “You are British; so I must love you,” “I am Indian; so I must love you.” All these nonsensical barriers are there. There you love a human being because he is a human being and he is a yogi, speaks the same language.
Now today I have attended a wedding party and the bride and the bridegroom said, “We are coming to Paris with you, Mother. There are hundred people coming to Paris, because we have to change Paris”, you see. “But,” I said, “you are recently married. Now better enjoy your honeymoon.” They said, “What are we going to enjoy? We’ll enjoy there our honeymoon”, so they are coming up there. (She laughs)
Even if I tell them, “You don’t come,” they won’t listen. They will enjoy their honeymoon there only. I never said, “You come”, on the contrary, I’m saying, “You go away. I will give you money to enjoy your honeymoon wherever you feel like.”
They wouldn’t go, because they know where enjoyment lies, with their brothers, with friends and sisters. It’s absolutely so, I tell you, that the enjoyment of human beings has not been there.
Now there are people who live in India, who live in Australia, who live here, all over the places, but when the Sahaja Yogis go to India you should see them, the way the Sahaja Yogis in the villages, the way they embrace them, the way they feel the oneness. Never they have felt like this for a white skin. If they saw a white skin they would just run away and hide themselves under this thing, you see. And even now people are sometimes frightened to see a white skin in a village. They say, “Oh, God, they have come just to destroy us!” or something like that.
But now that’s over. Now it’s a human being, a human being is coming. They are all embracing. For there is nothing like a black or a white or anything left now. It’s such a love that grows and an understanding.
That’s only possible if you learn how to live collectively. And collectivity also teaches you where you are. Very important it is.
A person who has not lived collectively cannot understand.
I have seen people who have their own families, live with their families, they are Sahaja Yogis – but once they come to the ashram they know they are not yet there.
Because you have to adjust, you have to learn to adjust, you can’t have private bathroom to yourself, private room to yourself. All right, you can have if you want to have, but you should also know how to adjust. As you know, I live very comfortably Myself, but if it comes to living I can live anywhere, I have no problem of comfort or anything.
In the same way we are not barred from enjoyment. Because of all these things, the way we carry our bathrooms with us, we do not enjoy life.
[You] see, [you] want to have everything absolutely first class that has, say, that even when we go to the picnic we take all the metropolitan with us. In the same way we cannot enjoy life. We cannot enjoy nature. We cannot enjoy anything as long as we become just an individual, “Oh, I am the one who is going to get it.” The last of all we must know by individualism we become malignant.
I don’t say become communist, because that’s another malignancy; but by becoming individuals we become malignant.
What is malignancy? That an individual cell takes up upon itself, “I will grow, I will grow.” It doesn’t know how to grow with the whole. It has no coordination with the whole.
That’s why you say it is a cancer. Cancer is nothing but is a malignant cell which is alone and is saying that, “I have to achieve it. I can do it, I can manage it”. And once it starts growing like that, whosoever it touches, that person becomes the same. All these ideas – we are higher race or we are greater people, we are moneyed people, we are something special, we are of this club – all this disappears. It’s all nonsensical.
We are identified with nonsensical things and making ourselves miserable and others also miserable. And then you give up all that. Suddenly you find, “Oh, what enjoyment!”
You don’t want anything, you just want to be in the company of Sahaja Yogis. I have seen people, ambassadors, very highly placed people, just getting lost with the Sahaja Yogis.
The other day I had a businessman from Bombay. I took him down with Me to a place called Gurai; and it was all in a mess, in the sense there were no proper bathrooms, there were… It was just like a God-forsaken place, I tell you [She laughs]. And there weren’t even places to sit down properly, only the beach and the palm trees and all sorts of thing was there.
And the man got lost into that, absolutely lost. And he said, “I never wanted this day to finish. Is the only day I’ve really enjoyed myself thoroughly”.
Because there was such spontaneity, such spontaneous love, such attention and such purity in the atmosphere. To enjoy that purity you have to be in the collective.
Sitting down in the room, you can’t understand, there is no reflection of you. You can’t understand where are you, how far you are going. Collectivity is the most important thing, and those who try to break the collectivity are doing anti-Sahaja activity. [You] see, we call it a-Sahaja movement or you can say a-Sahaja activity. You have to be one with the whole. Those who have tried to separate themselves, all of them go down in Sahaja Yoga.
Try to be one with everyone, to share and enjoy everybody’s being, because God has created you so beautifully.
You are so beautiful. And the enjoyment should not be lost because you have certain barriers; like some people can’t take out their shoes, I mean, just imagine how much they are identified with their shoes. They can’t take out their shoes. To that extent they are stupid!
[You] see, all this kind of stupidity drops out once you meet really wise people around you. To get rid of all these nonsensical ideas, which have really haunted your head all these days, you get rid of them and you really enjoy everyone, whether he is a doorman or he is a chairman, all of them are men for you. It’s nothing more than that. All that drops out and you start enjoying your Self.
That’s why collectivity is the only way I can work out Sahaja Yoga. I can’t think I can work out through the people who are separated, divided. It is said, Christ has said also that… They said, “What have we to do?” He said, “When you love each other you have done the greatest justice to Me”. It’s true.
And when I hear the loving conversation of the Sahaja Yogis I feel the happiest. That’s the greatest happiness for Me, that all of you should love each other in purity, without any return, only for love’s sake you all should love each other. And that is what it is!
And also Krishna has said, “Wherever people are there gathered together in the name of God, I reside within them”.
So in that joint – so-called joint, because you are all one, moving with one rhythm, with one understanding, with one language, so you all should always meet, call each other and have rapport with each other. It’s so beautiful. It’s musical. It’s poetical. Do you understand that?
May God bless you.
And see for yourself when you cut out your collectivity. Just abuse yourself at that point.
That this is one thing you are trying to teach Me now, I’m not going to listen to this nonsense. We are collective being otherwise also. I mean, we cannot, people cannot take even drinks without somebody being there.
You can’t take your food alone. In so many things, I mean, if you are not absolutely a recluse you can’t live alone.
Then in religion, in the seeking, especially in the realm of God, how can it be?
You all have to be there.
I think it was a very good question, rightly asked. This individualism must be given up. That doesn’t mean you all should dress up like military people – that’s not necessary – or you should all behave in the same manner – that’s not necessary.
Variety brings all the beauty. But that doesn’t mean that if I say it is East you should say it is West. That’s the main trouble is, I think [She laughs], isn’t it? That you can’t agree to each other.
What’s the problem in collectivity, you think. I can ask the question.
Must get out of individual limitations.
I think everybody should for some time go and live in an ashram, is a good idea.
But ashram must be such where there is collectivity. In the ashram if they are fighting and quarrelling – then what’s the use of being in the ashram also? But I leave it to you. It’s all freedom to you. You just decide yourself. I have not put any rules and regulations on you much, because I want you to use your wisdom and put everything right yourself.
You are all very wise people but must have concord. Listen to others. Talk to them.
Find out what’s the problem is. On small, small things people fight. It’s a very wrong thing.
Moreover, you have to have one person as a leader to whom you should listen to. If I find that fellow is useless I’ll throw him away. You know that very well. Throw him away, not in the way people throw away, but he’ll just get out of Sahaja Yoga. You know that very well.
So there should be no problem. But everybody should not try to dominate each other.
That’s a wrong idea. Try to change your attitude. As I would say, how far can you adjust? How far can you accommodate? Let’s see that way.
You have to learn that from Me, isn’t it?
You must find out ways and methods of accommodating yourself with others. Just try to learn. It’s not difficult. That’s the whole attitude of life, is of competition and this and that – should be changed.
You must compete in loving, compete in doing good things, compete at working for others.
Like “I’ve opened the door, now I’ll not take the phone”. Is very common. “I’ve washed the things this morning, then I will not wash in the evening”. Then people start taking advantage as this. Let them take advantage; it is a disadvantage for them.
Actually, if you see the other side, compete in service, compete in love, compete in good things, of saying good words, of communicating in a sweeter way that others feel happy, making others happy. Try to change your attitude towards others and you’ll really enjoy, I tell you, you’ll enjoy.
That’s the way. You know, if you say something to hurt someone and upset someone, it must be upsetting you definitely.
You may not show but it must be, because whatever you do to others comes back to you. Straightforward march, I tell you.
It doesn’t stay there altogether; it comes back to you. So just try to be kind to others.
You may say that the other may try to harm you, doesn’t matter. Nobody can harm you because you are the Spirit. Who can harm you? You are the Spirit.
So just try to understand the person.
I tell you, after some time you’ll find that person will become very soft.
So many Sahaja Yogis have become like that automatically. They all are here for seeking God, isn’t it? So to help them you have to be patient. Give up your old methods and ways, I must tell you: to be curt, to be stern, to be angry, there’s no need at all! [Shri Mataji laughs]
I’m telling you from My experience. I’ve tried all these things. It works, isn’t it?
It does work.
And you have to have faith in them and faith in their ascent, in their quality. I like people who praise others to Me. I don’t like people who criticize others. Try to support each other, help each other and never talk about their past or anything like that; it’s very sad.
Sometimes I’ve seen people are very hard and in anger they say things which one should never say. It’s not gracious. It’s not in the mannerism of Sahaja Yogis. You should never say these things. Do I ever say anything like that to you about your past? When you write to Me, even if I know everything about you, did I ever mention those things to you at all? Then why should you say things of the past? I have heard these things people just rake it up and flung it back.
I have heard this kind of thing that they bring it on other people, it’s not good. One should be very gracious, very kind, and understand that everybody has tremendous potentiality.
Respect, respect and respect. Respect yourself and you’ll respect others.
I hope now you won’t have problem of collectivity after this lecture, and if you have, you can listen to this lecture again and again; and My special humble request that try to curb down your angles.
Automatically other angles will calm down. But if it is a non-Sahaja Yogi then you all should fight it together. All should join together if [it] is a non-Sahaja Yogi.
Nobody dare torture you or trouble you. Those days are gone now. None of you will be troubled. These are all satanic forces and they can work through you also. You must know when they give you such ideas to fight and to quarrel. Understand that this is anti-God. You are doing God’s work.
You have to move towards more understanding, more coordination; because this is such a tremendous work and of such a sublime nature, that we have to be sublime ourselves.
All right, now is there any other question? [It] was a very nice suggestion but don’t give Me such big suggestions that I have to speak for half an hour. [Laughter, She laughs]
Sahaja Yogini: Mother, when you say collective consciousness, does that exclude all the people who are not Sahaja Yogis, so does that mean that Sahaja Yogis are isolating themselves from the 90% of the people who are not Sahaja Yogis?
Shri Mataji: What is she saying? I just couldn’t hear. Can you come? You come here and tell Me. Yes, it’s all right.
Sahaja Yogini: When you are talking about being collectively conscious, that excludes the people who are not Sahaja Yogis and therefore the Sahaja Yogis are isolating themselves from the people, from the majority of the other people.
Shri Mataji: Oh, that’s it. No, no, no. She says that when collectively Sahaja Yogis become one then those who are not Sahaja Yogis are isolated. It’s not so. You see, Sahaja Yogis have to be strong enough.
Now take it like this, that there are people, say, who are in the water and some people are in the boat, all right? Now the people who are in the boat are in the boat, so they are in a way different from the people who are in the water. That’s the situation is, all right? Now the people in the boat have to save the people who are in the water, all right?
So what I am saying that those who are in the boat must first of all be united, and then with full strength pull them out.
Why this collectivity? Is just to pull out the rest of them. This collectivity is just to achieve their emancipation, their realization, all right? It doesn’t mean that they should exclude.
Actually the whole collectivity is to bring those people out. But, you see, there are lots of anti-God activities going on in this world, you know that.
For example, there’s a guru who makes lots of money, all right? And he has destroyed many people. Now they come to Me and they are saved. So he may send somebody here paid for a job just to disturb us.
Then the duty of all the Sahaja Yogis is to get together and see that, to tell him that, “You see, now you are doing wrong. Your guru has done wrong to us and he is going to do wrong to others. Why do you join with that?”
On that point everybody should be one. But if they are not strong and if they are not one, they cannot pull out others.
You see, My point is like that. Not to exclude – is all, collectivity is to include everyone inside. All right? I mean to say, there is no specialization in Sahaja Yoga, in simple words. Everybody is a doctor of everything. [Laughter]
I mean to say that all the Sahaja Yogis must form a strong group by which they achieve enlargement of Sahaja Yoga, getting more people into Sahaja Yoga, more people benefitted by Sahaja Yoga, all right?
All – anywhere I have seen, wherever there is collectivity, like I would say, Australia has the maximum collectivity, or India of course it has, but Australia, in all the European countries, or I should say the western-styled communities, Australia has the maximum collectivity and they have achieved the maximum results.
Only in Sydney, today only, Warren told Me that the halls like this get packed for programmes. Melbourne, there is no room for new people who are coming, and it’s such a big compound I’m amazed, I mean, how many must be going there. And it is because of collectivity. And as soon as I went there it started gathering up. But before that the people were fighting among themselves and many people ran away from Sahaja Yoga because they thought, “These people are fighting, what are they going to give us?”
Maximum is in Australia, I think. Then is Austria is having some problem there, and as soon as the problem came in, the whole thing became a very small group.
Again that problem is over now; positivity has come; the people have joined together; again it has flourished. It happens here also, we have seen. Why Labor Party lost? If they had not quarrelled they would not have been so badly off [Shri Mataji laughs, laughter]. Is absolutely a simple equation, “United we stand,” isn’t it?
Is there any other question? All right.
So how many are new people today here? Can you raise your hands please? One, two, three, five, six. All right. Can I request you to come to the front seats? That will be better, will help Me better too, because you are so much here and there, all right? Just come, please. Be comfortable. Yes, come along, all of you. Just be seated. Yes. Be comfortable.
Now get some more chairs. Can you get some more chairs here for the front seats? Douglas, can you put them in a line? They cannot be lifted; they are fixed, are they? All right.
Now for all the new people I have to say one thing, that, you see, you cannot argue it out. It has to work within you. It has to work within you. It’s a happening. There is a force within you which we call as Kundalini, which is the pure desire of becoming one with the Spirit. All other desires are impure. That’s why you are never satisfied.
Now this desire is not yet awakened within us.
This power of desire, or energy of desire, resides in the sacrum bone and it has to be awakened, and when it is awakened, it rises, passes through six centers, subtle centers, comes out of your medulla oblongata into the brain and then, out of this part which was a soft bone in your childhood, and you start feeling a cool breeze coming out of your head, and a cool breeze coming out of your hands also afterwards.
Now this is a living process, as you cannot force a seed to sprout. It sprouts by itself spontaneously, but you have to put it in the Mother Earth. In the same way it sprouts. It sprouts spontaneously and when it happens then you have to see for yourself.
One can help because if there is an obstruction on any chakras, especially if the Nabhi chakra is caught up, then what happens that on that center the Kundalini tries to push and you can easily see with your naked eyes the pulsation or the movement of your sacrum bone just like a heart, just like a heart.
These things you cannot maneuver, you cannot attain by effort. Is a thing already settled there within you and this has to be awakened.
Now what we can do is to try to remove the hurdles that are there during the ascent of the Kundalini. That’s all we can do. But if it doesn’t work out, we can work out again and we can work out again. But you have to have patience with yourself and you have to have understanding that you will get your realization. It’s not so difficult.
All of these people who are sitting here have got realization and most of them are settled down with their realization. They know what the chakras are, what are the obstructions, how to remove the obstructions and how to raise the Kundalini. All this you will also know. All this mastery you will also have, but you have to, as I said, you have to have that earnestness and that kind of assiduity by which you’ll achieve it.
So it is for us to raise your Kundalini and it is for us to help you to achieve it. Then once you have achieved it and you have mastered it, it is for you to teach others and to give realization to others. It is as simple as that.
So I’m sure it will work out tonight and that all will work it out. We should all cooperate with each other. Now some people who are frightened, I have to tell them there’s nothing to be frightened in Sahaja Yoga. Thousands of people have got realization without any difficulty. Or those who are still discussing in their minds, must stop it now, because they have not found it; better prepare yourself to have the realization. It is not to be paid for. You cannot put in any effort. Nothing can be done. It has to work out, all right?
With this understanding let us see that few things, whatever I tell you, you try to cooperate with Me.
One of them is a simple thing, is to remove your shoes. Please remove your shoes. There’s nothing in the shoes, you see. If you remove the shoes, you’ll become relaxed, little bit more, and also I feel that it helps the Mother Earth to suck in problems very well.
It’s a very simple method by which it should work out.
So I would request you to put both your hands towards Me, just like this, and close your eyes. That’s all. Just close your eyes. You will also know why I asked you to put your hands towards Me later on. So don’t think about it. There are five fingers and six centers – [She corrects Herself] – and seven centers all on your hands, and when you put your hands towards Me the message goes to the Kundalini and it rises. It’s your own, everything is your own. Only thing like one enlightened light enlightens another light, I’m just enlightening you and then you can enlighten others exactly the same way.
All right. I would request you also to take out your spectacles if you have any, because it helps your eyesight also. It helps your eyesight. Just take out your spectacles. Any other obstacle, anything that is little bit uncomfortable, you can reduce the pressure on your waist if it is very tight; or anywhere you feel the tightness you can reduce. Put both the feet on the ground, little separate from each other because both feet have different problems, are to be attended to differently.
Now please keep your eyes shut and I would request you not to open your eyes till I tell you, because if your eyes are open the Kundalini refuses to rise up to Agnya.
So please keep your eyes shut. Just with complete faith in yourself you just wait and it will work out.
If it doesn’t work out, we’ll try to tell you how you yourself can work it out by awakening your own centers.
You have to sit quietly. Please put your right hand – don’t open your eyes – please put your right hand on your heart.
Because the left hand is the hand of your desire so it should be kept where it is now throughout. Only you have to move the right hand because the right hand is the hand of action.
Now at this stage you have to say – if you are wearing a coat put it from inside the coat, would be better – hand on your heart and left hand towards Me on the lap, comfortably.
Now you please in your heart, with all sincerity you have to ask the question thrice, “Mother, am I the Spirit?”.
Now why I say that you call Me Mother, because you have to call Me Shri Mataji, which is a tongue twister and I think it will be difficult. So to make it easier, I say “Call Me Mother”.
Please ask the question, “Mother, am I the Spirit?”. Because the Spirit has to come in your attention; you have to become the Spirit.
Many people think if you pray without being realized, God will do what you want. He won’t, because you are not yet connected.
You have to be connected to God. That’s why Christ has said you are to be born again. That’s not an artificial thing, it’s a reality. Now as the Spirit is your guide, it is your guru, you don’t need any guide anymore, put this right hand down on the stomach on the left hand side again, and push it a little.
On your stomach on the left hand side put the right hand and left hand towards Me, and push it a little bit and say – you must put your hand on your stomach, stomach on the left hand side and press it a little bit because there lies – the right hand, the right hand, take it to the left side and put it on the center on the left side.
And now you ask the question, “Mother, am I my own guide? Am I my own master? Am I my own guru?” Ask the question ten times because there are ten sub-plexuses within us.
Later on your own guru, which is your own Spirit, will guide you because you’ll get vibratory awareness, a new dimension in your awareness.
You’ll become collectively conscious. You’ll become, again. It’s not just a lecture but it is a happening. Please ask ten times, “Mother, am I my own guide? Am I my own guru?”.
Now again put the same right hand on your heart and now you can assert by saying, “Mother, I am the Spirit”. Just say that. On the heart, on the heart, put it on the heart, the right hand on the heart, where the Spirit is, where it resides, is reflected in your heart.
So just say, “Mother, I am the Spirit”, with full assertion. You have to say that twelve times.
Now as the Spirit is guiltless, it never commits sins, it is blemishless, it is absolutely spotlessly clean, sparkling diamond within you, you have to raise this right hand at the base of the neck on the left hand side. We have to move on the left hand side, throughout. At the base of the neck on the left hand side.
This is a very important center, very important center for the Western people is through the neck, at the neck on the left hand side.
You put it on your shoulders on the left hand side. Just take it from the front, will be easier, yes; and press it hard. And at this center you have to say that, “Mother, I’m not guilty,” sixteen times, because if you are the Spirit, how can you be guilty? But really you must say, “I’m not guilty.”
Get away from all ideas that you have done this wrong or that, you have committed this sin and that sin. “Mother, I’m not guilty.” Say it sixteen times, please. You are not guilty; you are just thinking like that.
By thinking you have made yourself miserable. There’s not to feel guilty about anything.
Now raise the same hand on your forehead. Across. On your forehead across.
At this point you have to forgive others.
This is the center of Christ. He forgave the people who crucified Him. In the same way you forgive everyone. Forgive everyone. Please forgive everyone.
People say it is difficult to forgive, but if you don’t forgive, actually what you are doing is you are harming yourself, and not the people who have harmed you. So just say, “Mother, I forgive everyone.” From your heart. Whatever you are saying, is working out. So please say, “Mother, I forgive everyone.” If you don’t say it from your heart, it will have no effect.
Now put the hand on top of your head, where you had a soft bone, press it hard with your palm. And just move it a little bit, sideways if you put it is easier, in a clockwise manner – your head, your scalp – you can say.
At this point it is the liberation point, is that point where you get your moksha, where you get your realization. And I can’t cross your freedom. At this point you have to say, “Mother, I want my realization, please give me my realization”, at least seven times. Say it seven times.
[A] lot of a heat is coming out. That’s a good thing. Let the heat come out.
Now raise the hand and see if there’s a cool breeze or a hot breeze is coming out. First the heat will come out. You can change over your hand and see with the other hand.
With the right hand towards Me, with the right hand towards Me and [the] left hand on top and see if there’s a cool breeze coming out. [Shri Mataji bends towards the public and puts the microphone onto Her Sahastrara]
You may change again your hand, whenever you feel like you can change your hand, and see if there’s a cool breeze coming out. He’s got it. He’s a born realized. No problem with him. He is! Let him feel yours. Just feel him.
On top, yes. He’s got it? Their certificates are correct. If they give you the certificate. You have got it, long time back. [She laughs]
Have you felt it? Not yet. Don’t open your eyes. Keep your eyes shut. It will work out. You exchange your hands one by one and see for yourself. Put your attention there and see. You have to work it out yourself. Don’t get disappointed and don’t feel bad about it. Just go ahead with it. It will work out.
Now I’ll ask some of the Sahaj Yogis to come and see and help you. Please come along. At the back of these people, you know, those who are sitting, can you see for that – this little one can find out about everyone. [She laughs]
Now here, keep your eyes shut. It will work out. Don’t you worry and don’t feel disappointed. It has to work out. It has to work out. Did you feel the cool breeze? Good. You have felt it already. Good. What about you? No?
Why, why are you so dejected? It will work out. John? Just try this gentleman. Now, don’t think about it, just you keep in meditation. He’s got it. The first one has got it. [The] second gentleman.
[Video interruption. Then video resumes with children around Shri Mataji on stage. Shri Mataji is distributing some food to them]
Shri Mataji: Now, what’s your name?
Shri Mataji: Anna.
Shri Mataji: Let’s have him here, let’s have him here. She’s going to America now, she’s going to America. [Indistinct]
Hello, William, come along! Come up, come up, come up. Take some chana. Be careful! Be careful. Come along. William? Come here. What about his teeth?
Yogini: Yes, he’s already got two big teeth coming, Mother.
Shri Mataji: But how can he eat this, he will eat? Can he manage? All right.
Come from this side, all right? For you may fall. Now come from this side, all right?
We’ll keep this one there. All right, now. Now. You take this. Do you want to have? Do you like it? Good! Will you have some more? Will you have some more in your hand? All right, you have it. What about you? Will you have some more?
Shri Mataji: More? Where is it going? In your stomach?
Now come along, come along. You have it. You go then digest it there. Digest it. Will you have this, first you eat that. Hm? Oh. Take this, take this.
Throw it away. Now, just come here. Come, come, come. Who is that? … You all stand there… should not fall out.
Elizabeth? Will you have some more?
[End of video]
H.H. Shri Mataji Nirmala Devi