Workshop

Finchley Ashram, London (England)

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WORKSHOP, Finchley Ashram, London (England) November 18th, 1977, Part -1

All the prostate gland and all these things are involved because of overactivity. The whole nervous system is ruined by this kind of an overactivity. I mean are you nothing but a sex point. We must respect our personality. You are not only a sex point. I mean even animals are not that. How could we be only our sex point? But that doesn’t mean that you should become like those people that you can’t look at women. Why can’t you? You can look at women, if you are that clear in your eyes, you should. Everyone will look, you see, we never feel that way about it. Not at all. But your eyes are not clear you see, they are dissatisfied eyes. They are adulterous. That’s why they are not satisfied with one person, from one to another they are moving. What mistakes your parents have done you are not going to do those mistakes or do you? Or your grandparents have done. It spoils everything. The whole society is based, the whole society, is based on one small point, is how far you understand sex and its sanctity. See we all are sitting down as brothers and sisters. Everybody knowing who is whose husband, whose wife it is. Supposing tomorrow an idea comes into somebody’s head that alright I’ll have a nice time with somebody’s wife or somebody’s husband. The whole society ruins and if it were not wrong then why do you get diseases with that? Rate of impotency is the highest in America. Now what do you say to that? Russians are better. 

Sahaja yogi: But they are alcoholics.

Shri Mataji:  That’s the thing, they have not seen to the alcoholic compensation. They and China both are competing in alcohol I think, Competing. Now how can you justify alcohol I can’t understand that. You see it every day what is alcohol? (Not audible) It’s better now. It’s clearer. You see on the points of confusion you must know why (recording breaks here) why do you come to me? What are you seeking? First, understand yourself. Then second point should be what we should expect, as a seeker? what should we get? Even the psychologists are talking about collective unconscious and collective consciousness, alright. All the big sages have talked about this. All the prophets, all the incarnations have talked. Did Krishna say that you stand on your head and do all this, did he say so? Did Rama say so? Did they discuss sex anywhere any time? Christ also. Anyone of them has said it? Then who are these new great people who have come suddenly from where, collecting all our money. See the responsibility on the modern people and the younger people is much more than on the older generation, because they were the people who faced war, they were tortured by war. And naturally they were nervous people. They were not so normal. But you are saints, and you are born under conditions which are not that abnormal. So, you have a double advantage. Only what you have to do is to connect yourself with right understanding.  Right understanding of the problem. What are you expecting out of your spiritual search? Now to say that everybody must get God’s realization, it’s too much. If you read ‘Patanjali’ you will be surprised how many years, how many lives, he has described one has to take, even to raise the Kundalini and is an impossibility. So, if you see somebody’s Kundalini rising then you have to accept. First of course Sahaja yoga, it helps you.  It takes your kundalini up. It touches the right point. It makes you feel aware of this. You get separated, alright. That happening takes place. But then again, the mixture starts coming up. Now if you are not careful at this time, what happens? You can be again mixed up. But now you will go down much more because the more you rise the more you go down. So, one has to be very careful at this point to see for yourself, know I did touch a point. There was something like that. Now why am I not there? What is the reason? Why have I lost that height? Was there some weight attached to me that I have come down? What is that weight? First of all, the confusion, what is it about. You will be amazed if you rationalize it you will understand that you are just playing on to words. you are seeing now here. There is no business going on, nothing. I cannot just say that David you are alright when you are not. When you have a problem, everybody says that he has a problem here. Everyone says. There’s nothing against you these people have. When they have a problem, they also know they have a problem. But you must try to help yourself. And do not confuse yourself to that extent, to that extent that you completely get lost. See you can get lost. I must tell you. You have to be very careful. We have had some people who were lost to us. Of course, they have not forgotten us though, they write to us for Ivan is (sahaja yogi laughs) today Ivan of all the sahaja yogis, just think it? He was a doctor with RCG. (Shri Mataji laughs) He asked questions after questions and all, but he got realization and today he is sending me a Diwali, after so many years. He has gone to Australia, he has not forgotten. (inaudible) Nobody forgets me that I know because the kundalini is still working. But God has one aspect which one should not forget. No confession forgetting it, no human being should forget it that he punishes you. You cannot get away with it. He will give you one chance, two chances, ten chances but then he punishes you. Be careful, he does punish you. Punishment is a part of your (inaudible) you cannot get away. Punishment is every minute if you see. If you smoke, you get cancer. If you look at women, your eyes become unsteady. You have to wear glasses much faster. You may develop some sort of a trouble in the eyes. Or maybe your attention becomes very much shifty. If you drink you get a bad liver. If you take drugs, you get a (not clear) Any habit you take to you become enslaved or you become a slave of that. You see nature is every minute punishing you and keeping you in the centre, every minute. Say now for example someone says what does it matter, I can go away. I can do whatever I like. Nobody can live like this. You leave your children say and go away, run away with some other man, leave and go, you leave your husband, go away or your wife. It comes back to you as a punishment. There is a punishment which is an aspect of God which works after some time. It gives you a chance, quite a lot of chance and the worst punishment is spoiling your chakras. If by wrong methods by which you have gone, you have been punished, it is more necessary that you should come back to the center and achieve your goal. Much more working is needed for such people I am telling you specially. But God should have patience for you, because you see the another side of it which I told you is punishment and what is the worst punishment than to be dropped out of sahaja yoga. I cannot think of any other punishment worse than that. Cannot be because then what is left for you. There is no other path, there is no other way out, there’s no other way out. This is the way one has to get in, there is no other way I promise. I am not saying it in any ego or anything   but that’s a fact. A door that stands and says this is the way, is not egoistical but because that’s a fact. It sounds egoistical but that’s the fact and one has to say that. When Christ said, “I am the light, I am the path’. Was he egoistical? No, because what he said he, it was a fact. It was the truth. He was the light, and he was the path, no doubt. I don’t say that bluntly about what I am, but you’ll find out yourself. And don’t commit more mistakes as it is too many mistakes happened. All your group has been to that horrible that ‘Mahisha’ and then another is this one, two horrible things you have got, say like from frying pan to fire. After that I am pouring my water on you. Now, at least keep steady, keep steady, receive it. Alright try to receive it. What they are dependent on? Did they, did they look after you? Nothing, I have to work very hard. Ask Gordan how much I have worked on you. Hours together day in and day out I have worked on all of them they know that. And you know how terrible it is. They know, they run away, o god Eris, burning that I have been doing. They are having relay races, but I have been running the marathon. Not here, all over the world you see. Now just to help me because it’s helping me. You are part and parcel of my being.  So, when you are alright you help me, try to be alright. Tell your mind now it has been too much. Now will you please shut up for a while and let me take to this and achieve what I have been seeking all my life. Alright, be patient about it. You see they even mock at things. I have seen. They will come inside and make you mock at things and laugh at it. But this is just the way you escape, you see. I have seen some idiotic people coming to my programs always, especially in India. If they were smiling or laughing people would ask them, they would say they are coming from the lunatic asylum. (Shri Mataji laughs) They would be the first to laugh at Sahaja yoga and some used to shout also, and they would be direct from the lunatic asylum, imagine. What do you say to that? Can you imagine what a tallying it was? Thank God we are not getting any lunatics here. Otherwise, it would have been better to tally and then people feel Surprised how we are like. Now what do you say about that, in vibrations? (Shri Mataji asked some Sahaja yogi) (inaudible) Some girls were nice and innocent. But some of those they brought later on, they (inaudible) Both the hands burning as if they had cancer. Both the hands burning, and I was trying to give them you see this then my husband said I must say your patience and your aspirations are great. These women are models.  How do you expect them to get anything? 

(One line of Shri Ganesh Aarti and then recording breaks) 

Shri Mataji: Need to pay more attention individually.

Sahaja yogi:  In his interview Sadat said, Mr. Biegun recommended by three people, three presidents, first was President Carter, second was President Koshescu from Romania and third one was the president of Israel himself. (Sahaja yogi laughs)

Shri Mataji: Just imagine and you cannot imagine this, because Israel is, also the president does not know how to explain to his people you see that this negotiation is possible, so they are working out among themselves, you see, that you come, you come “tu mara baghoyam “ (Marathi language words)what is it, you call me something and I will call you the same.

Sahaja yogi: You scratch my back, you scratch my back, you scratch my back and I will scratch your back.

(Sahaja yogis talk amongst themselves) (not clear)

Shri Mataji: I am going to India now. On our way back (inaudible) From Egypt how far is Algeria?

(Sahaja yogis talk amongst themselves)

 Sahaja yogi: Forty thousand miles, one thousand miles. 

Shri Mataji: forty thousand miles!

Sahaja yogi: one thousand miles

Shri Mataji: One thousand miles?

Sahaja yogi says something, not clear.

Shri Mataji: Is it, by plane how much it is?

(Sahaja yogis talk amongst themselves)

Shri Mataji:  Why not? At least on my way back, I can. From there, there is a direct plane to London?

Sahaja yogi: Yeah, two hours twenty minutes. Two hours. Sahaja yogis discuss amongst themselves.

Shri Mataji: From London to Algeria? 

Sahaja yogi: Yeah, to Algeria.

Shri Mataji: You mean from here to Egypt is how many hours? 

Sahaja yogi: It should be longer three and half hours to four hours. 

(Sahaja yogis talk amongst themselves)

Shri Mataji: It is in between?

Sahaja yogi: Not in between, it’s like a triangle you know, and London is at the top and London is (inaudible)

Shri Mataji: We can do, I will talk to him, at least I can come (inaudible) is a good idea (inaudible)only one hour journey, you think so? Well like Delhi, from Bombay to Delhi, that’s it. 

Sahaja yogi: I think its two hours, more than two hours.

(Sahaja yogis talk amongst themselves and with Shri Mataji which is not audible.)

Shri Mataji: You have so many brothers and sisters apart from me, good. You will now feel the oneness of (not clear word) of all these people that are around, isn’t it?

(Sahaj yogi says something and all laugh)

Shri Mataji: You feel lost in that case. I mean you don’t know. I have never told you that you give up your friends or anything, never. Did I say? Never. On the contrary I wanted you to go and meet them, but you came back. But you cannot enjoy them anymore, want to run away. What is there to talk about? The level has changed so much, just see that. The level has changed, absolutely.

(Sahaja yogis talk and laugh amongst themselves)

Shri Mataji: o I get so fed up sometimes.

(Sahaja yogi says something and laughs.) How much money do you get?

Shri Mataji: What is your pay? When are you going to get your promotion? 

Sahaja yogi says something inaudible.

Shri Mataji: I mean in a way, I mean there’s no change of course. See once in a while is alright, but every time, every moment if that is that, and nothing beyond, you cannot just enjoy that life. Your whole thing is different now. Pattern is different. I don’t think Pat will be coming today because he has gone somewhere, Pat? Why do you come so late why?

Sahaja yogi: He is in training.

Shri Mataji: Training of what?

Sahaja yogi says something (inaudible)

Shri Mataji:  What training is he doing? 

Sahaja yogi: Selling. 

Shri Mataji: Selling training. Selling the bread.

 Sahaja yogi asks another yogi are you working in a bread department? 

Shri Mataji: For you (inaudible) I am looking some job there (not clear)

What happened? Did they (inaudible)

(Sahaja yogi says something to Shri Mataji, not clearly audible)

Shri Mataji: Sharda told me she saw you.

Sahaja yogi: Yes, that’s right.

Sahaja yogi says something to Mother, not audible.

Shri Mataji: Now you are looking normal. Isn’t it? How do you feel? Do you still feel weak? 

Conversation with a yogi (not very clear)

Shri Mataji: Left heart. So, sugar you are taking or not?

Sahaja yogi: I am taking sugar, yeah. 

Shri Mataji: what else, milk? 

Sahaja yogi: I don’t take much milk. (inaudible)

Shri Mataji: Milk you can take. The other milk that you get, skimmed milk.

Sahaja yogi: I take maybe two or three ounce a week. 

Shri Mataji: No, no, milk you can take, skimmed, any amount you like. Because you see as long as you do not burden your liver too much, is alright. Because you have both the problems left and right both.

Sahaja yogi: Yeah, Mother, today I had chapatis today. I had Atta. 

Shri Mataji: Atta, Chapati? (Both are Hindi language words for wheat bread) Is all right, I mean you have to take some carbohydrates. You should not be that rich also, an extreme sort of a thing that only proteins. Absolutely proteins is not a good thing. You must take sometimes something.

Sahaja yogi hmmm. (not clear) If I am doing something in my house…(not clear)

Shri Mataji: No that you should not do. (inaudible) 

Sahaja yogi: I have good practice and mmm I have good practice.

Shri Mataji: Good what?

Sahaja yogi: I have a good practice.

Shri Mataji: what do you have for breakfast?

Sahaja yogi: um, well recently I have been making roti (inaudible)

[ It sounds as if Some Sahaja yogi brings some present for Mother]

Shri Mataji: For me?  Oo that’s too much. You have come is more than sufficient. What is this? Why should you buy that? Alright, so may God bless you. You know you will be surprised today I saw this in a shop, not today, yesterday. Same colour. Yesterday absolute. May God bless you. And I told my husband if I have one like this, I would hang around…(inaudible) Is it alright? If you want, I think it’s alright. May God bless you (inaudible) very pretty, see, just see this, very nice.

Conversation amongst Sahaj yogis and Shri Mataji not clearly audible.

Sahaja yogi: this type

Shri Mataji: this type what? There is no art in this. You see just whatever is available. This is art. There’s no art. Beautiful (inaudible)

Sahaja yogis talking to Shri Mataji something, not clear.

Shri Mataji: They’re still carrying on with the handicrafts here. Thanks that we are not so much overdeveloped that all handicrafts are lost. And then this small little thing just have a look. hmm

Sahaja yogis say something (inaudible)

 Shri Mataji: oh, I see, oh I see. Pull it down like that and then you pull this thing

Sahaja yogis laugh.

Shri Mataji: You see the, all delicacies were added by Muslims, Mohammad Sahib (inaudible) 

Beautiful. (inaudible) I never saw her. Did you see her? 

Sahaja yogi: (not clear) there was a French lady. (not clear) She was facing you and she was sitting with her right hand (inaudible) I was working on Andrew’s system.  (Conversation between Sahaja yogi and Shri Mataji is not clearly audible)

Shri Mataji: Horrible, how do you find her? 

Sahaja yogi: I didn’t spend lot of time with her.

Shri Mataji: Such a complicated person. She is (inaudible) They have any secrets in the country. Because she was living with somebody as a wife who had a wife and a child for fifteen years and the wife never knew that he was and this fellow is known as a Ronnie driver, his name is. He is a big rich man. And much. This lady is as the same age as his daughter. And for fifteen years she lived with him and (not clear) and she has two daughters from this man and the wife never knew. How is it possible? So, she said because here you see if you ask men where have you been or what did you do, they shout at you. So, they just give up some women. Some women are like that some men are like that. You just do whatever you do. And she did not know that he was carrying on. Then after fifteen years now she fell in love with some young man. Naturally he must be an old fellow fifty-five years old whatever. Now she has fallen in love with somebody. She married that man and she has a little, she is going to have a baby now. And she has those two daughters with her. He gives them money, he spoils them, the father. And she is staying with him and now she feels guilty she said about that man whom she has left. I said very nice. And that’s why she is sulking. She has developed all these things on the face, and she is very unhappy. I said she doesn’t feel guilty that the man whom she has married now, who is so nice and such a humane person. Who would marry such a woman? But he is extremely kind to her. And she is trying to torture his life. Not guilty about it. She is not guilty about the wife being tortured there or a daughter being deprived of the father. She is only worried about this horrible fellow who also has got five, six girl friends. (Shri Mataji laughs) Real Asahaja case (not clear) Gaudin the great he says Mataji give it up. Its Asahaj complete. Shri Mataji laughs

Sahaja yogi: Asahaj.

Shri Mataji: Absolutely, just imagine. I mean how can I have any sympathy for her. I cannot and how can I have sympathy for that Ronnie driver. They are not human beings. They have no feelings for women.

(Sahaja yogis say something, not clearly audible)

Shri Mataji: And there will be many such cases coming up. If you want, you can blackmail them. 

Sahaj yogis laugh. 

Shri Mataji: Make some money for sahaja yoga. It’s a common affair here they say. They have a wife here, they have a woman, they have keeps here.

Sahaja yogi: First wife not wanted to know, very often the wives don’t want to know

Shri Mataji: they don’t want?

Sahaja yogi: They don’t want to know. It’s like marrying for the money and they don’t want to know his other things. They don’t want to get upset. (Not clear)

Shri Mataji: no, no, no, it’s no question. You see they were married long time back. And if a wife

WORKSHOP, Finchley Ashram, London (England) November 18th, 1977 Part -2

Shri Mataji: What I liked about in it the deep colour and then light blue is there. Really you cannot say which is the background colour. The whole thing is light. you cannot make out which is the,

Sahaja yogi says something (not audible) 

Shri Mataji: Yes absolutely, it’s a beautiful thing, absolutely beautiful. I myself have been admiring it all the time (Sahaja yogis laugh) Really beautiful I tell you. I saw this and I bought this. Told my husband this is for Gavin? He said alright, very beautiful. Yesterday he saw it here you see. He said I never knew it is such a good thing, you can’t get but she wanted back. 

Sahaja yogi: (takes some name of a lady) was very surprised. She said how did you come? What night you come, by evening tonight….(not clear)May I know Mrs. Shrivastava’s first name? ….(not clear) embassy wife…I could not figure out? They were really surprised to (not clear) …how she gave her name for this…(not clear) I never knew(not clear)Really  surprised, really ..(not clear) 

Shri Mataji: She was, she was so surprised, she told my husband I never knew that she was such a powerful speaker, such a convincing speaker, such a loving speaker and all kinds of things.  She said she is very great I must say, in her own right she is very great.  

New Seeker: Hello

Shri Mataji: Hello! I knew you will be there.

New seeker: yes, I have to, I have to come

Shri Mataji: May God bless you! May God bless you. (One word not clear) He was very good. What’s your name?

New person: Andrew

Shri Mataji: Andrew and sir name? 

New seeker:   Clark

Shri Mataji: Clark. So where have you been going for spiritual search?

New seeker: Oh!

Shri Mataji:  England? 

New seeker: England yeah(inaudible)Zen

Shri Mataji: Zen is this only. This is Zen.

New seeker: It’s words. (Not clear) It is all words.

(Sahaja yogis laugh)

Shri Mataji: Yeah, I know, is true, it’s true. Now the machine has started. Yeah. Now Zen, Zen is same, Khalil Gibran, same you see but as you say words were words and now it’s done.

New seeker: it’s experience.

Shri Mataji: This is the experience Zen.

New seeker: Now there are no words

(Sahaja yogis laugh)

Shri Mataji: Now you are a Kashyapa, you are a Zen, you are a Zen master now. You are!!

Sahaja yogi: (not clearly audible)

Shri Mataji: come along. 

New person: my son’s trainee is a TM teacher. 

Sahaja yogi: He is telling his son’s trainee is a TM teacher.

Sound of Shri Mataji breathing deeply.

New seeker:  he is nineteen (not clear) I got nothing out of TM apart from relaxation.

Shri Mataji: That is another kind of relaxation we will tell you. But you got something terrible with that. I ‘ll tell you all about that. You get now here TM people. But that’s the trouble you see. At the age of nineteen years, they don’t understand. They are very young, alright. Then they take to something, without understanding. They fall deep down into it. When they are ruined, they come to me. 

New seeker: He has found out by himself. I can’t stop him. 

Shri Mataji: But you wait something and meet him. We have got so many TM now.

New Seeker: He is in Germany now. 

Shri Mataji: Better do something about this fellow. You see TM is one of the most convenient things to be done. Only thing you have to give away some money. Part with your money. If you can part with your money, then it is the easiest thing to take devils from him. You know is very easy. How you do it? You can have any vices you feel like. You can drink as much as you like. You can have ten women around. You can kill anybody. You can do any violence, makes no difference to TM. Only if you can give him money. He will put some devil into you, and you relax. That’s all. Is the easiest thing. To give somebody money and please somebody with money is the easiest thing to do. I think, nothing difficult. 

Seeker: I don’t like it. I got nothing out but my son (not clear) 

Shri Mataji: we’ll save him. Don’t you worry. What’s his name?

Seeker: Robin, Robin Clark

Shri Mataji:  Clark, you said sir name. (Not clear) What is he? What is he doing, he is a student? 

New Seeker: he is a student. He works for TM people (inaudible)

Shri Mataji: He’ll be alright. When did he join them?

New seeker: when he was sixteen (not audible)

Shri Mataji: Jane there is a handkerchief in my, pocket. Terrible pain in the back. We started his working now. Do this TM fellow and when I visited them, I understand what I found those people just shivering like this before me. They said now we are all becoming mad. We are nervous, we are good for nothing. And the man with whom he stayed, with whom he stayed has died now. His son is very young. He is about I think twenty-five years of age. But he started his work I think about ten or twelve years back. But this son also has become like that like the father. Very recently he developed something like a Parkinson’s disease. And this boy is also doing the same thing. Then what these people told me (one lady says something not clear) So, he, he said, this boy told me and many others have told me, that even if somebody takes the name of God, even if you take the name of God, even then he, they start shivering. Even if they go near a church or a mosque they start shivering. And even these incenses are burnt they say, he starts shivering. But one man told me if he sees any light, he starts shivering. I mean any natural light like a candle or deepas we have in India. He just can’t see that. He can bear these but not this. Fire he cannot see. 

Sahaja yogi: Cannot see?

Shri Mataji: cannot see. He stands I mean he cannot stand. 

He cannot see with his eyes, fire. He cannot go near the sea. If there is rain, he is sitting in the house. He was terrible in Delhi and I don’t know, his age is about not much of say hardly fifty five or so but he looks like a old man doing this. Nothing left in him. So very bad thing to do. Of course, I have removed that from him. He’s better now but still you know these if you practice it for years together then they don’t give you a peace (not clear) Even if in my presence they may disappear but they come back unless and until you positively turned them out. See there are some methods, Mohammad Sahab has suggested some very good methods how to turn them and have to use Christ’s name very much for that. Because he is really, he is the one who is chaser of this horrible, he is a real chaser. And that’s how you to manage it otherwise it’s not easy because once I get into you, very difficult. Now we had in our first program at least two hundred and fifty people. Out of that at least hundred and fifty were from TM.

Sahaja yogi: inaudible

Shri Mataji: Yes, they have been to TM. 

Sahaja yogi: they just tried it.

Shri Mataji: Tried, yes some of them have just tried some. Now out of that fifty of them I would say really stuck on, you know. They wanted to see what it is like really. They did touch. You see everybody touches, alright. They touched the Sahasrara but again they went down you see. But some of them were so nicely touched. Though they went down they remembered their experience. And they stuck on to it. And now within eight days or so. (now Shri Mataji asks Sahaja yogis) eight days have passed or fifteen days have passed?

Sahaja yogis: inaudible

Shri Mataji: no but they improved after the second program, after that. That was one week, just after one week they improved. And after the second program they improved tremendously I must say, because for this program they were much more.

Sahaja yogi: inaudible

Shri Mataji: some of you really because this is the, this is such an, this is such a promise to me because TM in Bombay I have tried on some people TM I said as I told you I have also helped them. But some of them I was not able to do much. Only their kundalini freezes down and doesn’t rise at all. It’s very difficult. But you people have been real seekers I tell you though you been to TM and all that, you have been real seekers that’s how you’ve got it. Otherwise I mean TM means I just say baba , I can’t understand, impossible. Because they are very difficult and complicated. Had a little problem . You want to tell me something.

Seeker: (not audible)

Shri Mataji: Come here, come here. You put your right hand over here. If you want you can sit. You put this handout. (inaudible) You take the chair please. Your eyes also. Vishuddhi? Vishuddhi first will be hit. What is the name he has given you this horrid fellow? What is it?

Seeker: no, I can’t. I promised not to say.

Shri Mataji: No, you tell me, who is he to promise to 

Seeker: A promise is a promise.

Shri Mataji: no, no, no, no, no, not to a devil. You must tell me otherwise he will keep the promise to you. Just tell me.

Seeker: keyring

Shri Mataji: keyring? I do not know. 

Seeker: inaudible

Shri Mataji: Key ring! Keyring! You said. English word? 

Seeker: Yes, English word, that’s right. (inaudible)

Shri Mataji laughs aloud. Sahaja yogis laugh.

Seeker: (not audible)

Shri Mataji: yesterday.

Seeker: For many years, I have lot of anxiety, I mean it went, now it’s coming back (inaudible)

Shri Mataji: where is it? Here? I know. (Sahaja yogis laugh) they are feeling the chakras. Be comfortable. Get him a chair, I think it’s better.

Seeker: no, I don’t need. (inaudible)

Shri Mataji: You are alright. Nabhi and this. He creates cancer. I mean he can do anything nonsense. The way he might excite your sympathetic sometimes. This anxiety can give you mental problem. Isn’t it? You will not be able to sleep. I mean he can do anything. You see you are not regarded as anything great but still there is an effect, see. Right 

Shri Mataji: Hello, how are you, David?

David:  very well

Shri Mataji: May God bless you. 

David: I got a job.

Shri Mataji: You got a job. Congratulations! Congratulations! congratulations!

David: inaudible

Shri Mataji: All of you should be there to finish all this chana. I am so happy. May God bless you. 

Shri Mataji says to new seeker: Be comfortable, be comfortable. You can take a chair, or you can sit here, you sit here. It’s alright, you sit here. 

(Sahaja yogis talking amongst themselves)

Shri Mataji to the Sahaja yogi who is working on the seeker: you go this side. Put it down he has touched, he has touched. (inaudible) Because you see his working is on the pingla. He works on the pingla. 

Shri Mataji asks David: so, what is the job? Where are you going to work?

David: I am selling carpets. 

Shri Mataji: A ha good! 

David: (inaudible)very, very nice carpets. (inaudible)

Shri Mataji: they will say I am devil personified. No, they are going to come. It is all announced already in the scriptures. They are going to take the name of God, of spiritual life, of self-realization and that’s all. (Not clear) Isn’t it? That is what they want to do. They are not going to come and say No I am the devil. Come along. 

Seeker:  subtle

Shri Mataji: very subtle they are, extremely subtle. And they have to be subtler than all of you. If they are not subtler, how are they going to master. First of all, you see for yourself and then believe or disbelieve in comes later on. Keep yourself open. The more open you are the more it will work out, alright. You don’t have to believe me blindly. Not at all. Because that is not going to help me at all. You must open your eyes.  I want you to open your eyes and see for yourself because by seeing you can guide yourself and you can guide others also. Blindly where will you jump and where are the (not clear word) to jump. 

Seeker: yeah

Shri Mataji: Isn’t it? So, I don’t want blind followers at all. What do you say now? It’s better, now it’s better? 

Sahaja yogis: Still (not clear) something up here. 

Seeker: Just feeling anxiety, not related to them (not clear)

Sahaja yogi: left Vishuddhi

Shri Mataji: Left Vishuddhi is the problem. You see, it is, the anxiety is given to you by something unknown to you. And when you do not know something then why (not clear) isn’t it?

Sahaja yogi: not audible.

Shri Mataji:  that’s, that’s the spirit. Nothing else. But did you get some limes? You better get some from the market. Ask them to get it. 

Sahaja yogi: I will go and get it.

Shri Mataji: get me some twelve dozen or so.

Sahaja yogi: limes or lemons?

Shri Mataji: limes are better because you see (not clear) or lemons are alright. Lemons are alright. Not very big ones. So, lemons can be.  

Sahaja yogi: not audible.

Seeker:  I always heard (not clear) my mind says I am not prepared (not clear)

Shri Mataji: (inaudible) no, no, really (not clear) You see you don’t have to worry about all that. I am going to look after. These people who have written about kundalini, you should have heard me before, when I told about (not clear) it’s all written about.  They don’t even know where is kundalini? Exactly. I can show you. You see they don’t even know where it is lying. Just imagine they have written such big books. There is a book written by Abon or someone. Such a big book, you see and then I (not clear) a lady she told me they don’t even know whether it lies in the subtle form at the back or in the front.  They don’t know anything. Now you will see with your own eyes and   feel it with your hands. And know for yourself what is kundalini. All these people are talking, talking, talking so cheats. No one has been to there. 

Sahaja yogi: some new people joining in from 

Shri Mataji: I think Jameel, Jameel read one book on this thing on a and he came to me (not clear)

Sahaja yogi says something which is inaudible.

Seeker:  I have read that book (not clear) kundalini (not clear) accidently

Shri Mataji: Accidently  

Shri Mataji: He doesn’t deserve it. If you see his private life no kundalini is going to come out of it. I can tell you. 

Sahaja yogi: no the one you introduced me the one that (not clear)

Shri Mataji: No, no, the one that is that Ananda that they are in India they wanted to have a big collaboration with Indira Gandhi to sixty-five lakhs of rupees they were going to spend for this kundalini yoga. Not a word he knows, and he is against 

Sahaja yogi:  He is the one. The one that (not clear) He is Ankit Mukhrjee

Shri Mataji: who?

Sahaja yogi: Ankit Mukherjee, I think. That was one of them Sharda Devi invited, Ankit Mukherjee. The other guys put on me yoga (not clear) some tantrism. 

Shri Mataji: I mean the ignorance was sufficient. On top of that the confusion. Ah! It’s terrible. Just imagine my plight. See when I have come in this world, when people have lost their innocence. Those who are seekers, you see, have lost their power to recognize. Such a confusion, such a confusion. 

New seeker comes to Shri Mataji.

Shri Mataji: sit down. Take out your socks and you sit facing your feet that side and your back towards me. Take out your socks please. Now I will work it out. Him also, just see his kundalini and all that. 

Shri Mataji to the new seeker: put your hands straight. Keep your hands on the lap Alright!

Sahaja yogi: not audible.

Shri Mataji: Vishuddhi and where is the kundalini? Watch here alright, you watch here. Not here please. Those who are in the service or who are doing all this planning stuff or artists, musicians, they will be all attracted to it naturally. Because he is on the pingla side. Hm, now you feel better? Agnya. 

Shri Mataji asks new seeker: you have done some concentration and all that?

Seeker: not audible

Shri Mataji: Seeking like a motor car alright. Now a motor car if you don’t know how to drive, I really don’t know anything about the motor car. I try to do something to it, gets spoilt. So, some expert has to teach you, has to start for you. Something like that. Haan! better now. Its better. How is he? 

Sahaja yogi: he is better.

Shri Mataji: His problem is his son. Imagine for a father even to know about his own son is a big problem and there was a yesterday in the evening news there was a article about a father (not audible)

Sahaja yogi: it’s too much cold on the right side, too much cold on the right than the left.

Shri Mataji: because I am working on the left, right. Now, better

Sahaja yogi: it’s getting better

Shri Mataji: hu?

Sahaja yogi: its getting better

Shri Mataji: hmmm Gavin what do you say? You were looking very tired yesterday. Working on the people I believe. (Shri Mataji laughs) What do you say Jane? 

Sahaja yogini:   not audible.

Shri Mataji: right? 

Jane: Right swadishthan

Shri Mataji: Better. Right swadishthan, better

Sahaja yogi: He’s calm down a lot.

Shri Mataji: no will

Sahaja yogi: inaudible

Shri Mataji: left, or right?

Sahaja yogi: left much than the right.

Shri Mataji: left. Hmm how is it? 

Sahaja yogi: right agnya

Shri Mataji: right agnya.  See now, open, agnya I will open now. Open now agnya. Though I mean it is weak agnya chakra. Here’s the kundalini. Put a force. All of you put a force. Just you watch here, alright. You just keep your eyes closed. Don’t get into trance. Just keep alert. You are alert. Absolutely alert. See now where is it stopping? If you are seeing anything or anything you just don’t see anything. You should not bother, alright. You have to reach there. Haan! 

Sahaja yogis: inaudible

Shri Mataji: only the right agnya has to open. Now can you forgive people. Just say I forgive all of them. Just say I forgive. This is the mantra you say inside yourself. I forgive all of them so that God may forgive me. Just say. Haan! (inaudible) I tied the Kundalini. 

New seeker: inaudible

Shri Mataji: not seekers, just see.

Sahaja yogi: inaudible

Shri Mataji: Tell me all about it, tell me then what happened.

New seeker: (inaudible) this force running through me. 

Shri Mataji: no, no, this is so because he opened out. But what happens when possession comes back to him when he gets anxious that’s all. But he has opened out, see he has opened out, no doubt. Aa now see the forces started again. 

New seeker: like a symbol (inaudible)

Shri Mataji: beautiful. He is such a beautiful man.

New seeker: I am very bad man. 

Shri Mataji: Haa! if a diamond is covered with mud, you don’t call it mud, do you? Haa! Vishuddhi still, left, or right?

Sahaja yogi: right

(Sahaja yogis laugh after talking something amongst themselves)

Shri Mataji: now see now, how is it? Is it much better? 

Sahaja yogi: agnya

Shri Mataji: agnya, too much agnya or little?

Sahaja yogi: there is pressure coming in.

Shri Mataji: its better now. It’s going now. Let him sit in the water. Let him face me Jane, you sit down, she will tell you. Is there any salt in it?

Sahaja yogini: yes

Shri Mataji: Keep. there, there, let him sit there. No, where is it? Better there? Or may be here, it’s alright. 

(Sahaja yogis talk amongst themselves)

Shri Mataji: bring some Kumkum for him, for his agnya. 

Sahaja yogi: not clear

New seeker: yeah, excuse me.

Shri Mataji: how far you have gone. Hmm, (inaudible) you can bring some water in a, Jane bring some in a bowl. I will just pour. Put your both the hands towards me. Put this thing clear for me. All these.

End of the speech