Why we are seeking our Spirit?

Hampstead Friends Meeting House, Hampstead (England)

1980-10-23 Why we are seeking our Spirit? Friends Meeting House, Hampstead, transcribed, 82' Download subtitles: BG,EN (2)View subtitles:
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“Why are we seeking our Spirit?” Public Programme,  Friends Meeting House, 120 Heath St, Hampstead,  London (UK), 23 October 1980.

Today somebody came from India and told me that, “You better change the name Sahaja Yoga into some other name. So I said, “What about Maha Yoga?” And he liked it very much. He said, “Now people are taking Sahaj Yoga as their own and they are using it for their own purpose.” I said, “Very good idea. If they are using it, is even better! Because the word itself suggests that this union has to be spontaneous. They have to give a spontaneous union. If they claim it, they have to do it. If they are not doing it, then it is wrong. It’s very simple!” But he said, “In any case Sahaj Yoga does not denote the dimension which it has reached: that people are getting en-masse Realisation.” Moreover he said that people don’t understand that the time has come for thousands of people to get their Realisation.

Perhaps we are not aware [of] what time we are born. So many people are seeking God. Never in the history before there was such a multitude which was seriously seeking God, and honestly wanting to get their union. Only in the modern times you find they are very honest, very sincere; and they are born seekers. I mean their quality is that they are seekers; their temperament is that they are seekers. They are not satisfied with anything else but seeking.

Why this is happening? We have to think about it. Why people are not satisfied with what they have? Why are they not seeking now the materialism or the powers which are other than the Divine Power? Why do they want that they should know their Spirit? What is the reason? Why such an upsurge? And why people, like mad, are following anyone who comes across? To try every method and experiment with everything to get that bliss and joy.

You know [that], from ancient times, people have been talking about your rebirth. Even at the time of Rama, one disciple called as Nachiketa, went to the father-in-law of Rama, whose name was Raja Janaka, and asked Him that, “Give me Self-knowledge.” And Nachiketa was very, very anxious, very much wanting to be the Spirit. But Janaka put him to many, many tests. And the conversation between them is very interesting. So one individual is mentioned in those days — I mean that’s a long time back, Rama’s time — who was seeking. Even at the time of Christ there was, we would say, John the Baptist who talked of baptism. But as far as seeking is concerned, in the multitude, there was no such urge, there was not that seeking as you find today. So there must be something in the atmosphere.

Then another thing is that we are trying to save time. We must have watches. We must see that [watch] after every ten minutes. Oh, we have to save time. We cannot waste time. I mean, supposing somebody has to go to India, then a date is fixed, and then he must go by that plane, particular plane. If that plane is missed, he thinks he’s lost the world! Time-saving is another urge within us. Why do we want to save time? Why this urge from the unconscious is so strong that we must save time? Is there something going wrong or something is going to happen? Or is there some urgency or emergency which you feel in the time itself? Because, in the olden times, nobody used to worry so much about time. So what is the reason for this kind of time-saving today?

We can see very clearly that there are genuine seekers. There are seekers because of the faction around. And there are people who do not seek; who are quite satisfied with whatever mundane life they are leading, or whatever ambitions they have other than seeking. But the genuine seekers are so many in number that we have to find out why this genuine seeking is working so much. And you are so restless about it, so anxious that, without the seeking, you are not satisfied. You are willing to give up everything that is on this Earth with you, or whatever is your own so-called possessions, but you want to seek yourself. That’s a fact; it’s absolutely honest. There’s no doubt about it.

But why there is seeking? It is because the Last Judgment has started. The Last Judgment has started now.

Many great souls are taking birth. It is very common these days, you talk to anyone about his child [and] they will tell two things: Either he is a grand old man, some ancient figure born in the family and every word he speaks is wisdom. Or the other thing they may tell you is that he’s a monster, he’s good for nothing, he is useless. Nothing in between! Now this happening also was very uncommon.

Now we have seen, so many of you, who are Sahaj Yogis, that so many children are born-realised. I mean, when I was born, I found very, very few people. Except for my father I couldn’t find anyone who was born-realised. And there were many fakirs and saints, who came to our house, or we went to see them, and I found that their Kundalini was all frozen. They may be calling themselves saints or whatever it is. But I was amazed that there was no companionship with them because you couldn’t talk [to them]. They were at a very low level of evolution and they were just trying to make money or give some sort of technique or some sort of a blah, blah, blah. Even then it was so.

But innately in a country like India people know what to seek, what to find. Now, because of your righteous life in previous births, I believe, maybe, or whatever it is: as a blessing of that you are born in these countries where there is affluence, where your attention does not go to material things so much, but to higher things. And then you start thinking that all this is a waste, a junk and we are not going to carry the junk of our parents on our heads. Some sort of feeling crawls up and you start seeking.

In England I don’t know how many children I have seen who are born-realised, of a very high quality. Such great souls are taking birth on this Earth. Why? It never happened before. And within these ten years’ time, such a tremendous in-flow of these great souls is felt that one has to realise that there is a kind of an emergency. This emergency is felt also even in those people who are not yet seeking. They are so speedy; they are so anxious; they get into stress and they get into tensions. If you ask your forefathers who had gone out to wars: they never had tensions. They would kill ten people and sleep off nicely without thinking about it. They didn’t even have the sensitivity that you have, that compassion and that understanding.

With this growth within, or we can say, with this urge within, also there are many things that have happened outside that you can see very clearly: is that a consciousness has come, a collective awareness has come, as to the idea of cruelty, wars and also domination of other people. Perhaps none of you could be as old as I am here. I have seen this working out.

People are so much changed in their ideas. There’s such a revolution that you cannot think [of] a person like Christ, today to be born and to be crucified. Of course you may misunderstand. You may not like Him because He’s a carpenter’s son, He’s too simple, He talks of spontaneity; He doesn’t give you any technique; He doesn’t take any money from you; He doesn’t organise. You may not like Him, and you may deny Him also thinking that He’s just useless, but you cannot crucify [Him]. Under any law you cannot do it. Imagine what a development of society has also taken place!

And we understand what is wrong. For example now, Afghanistan was invaded: everybody, everyone in the whole world, was feeling that it was wrong. When one of the satellites was falling, and there were some astronauts caught up in that, the whole world was watching. I mean, they were not Indians and they were not Egyptians, but everywhere people were watching that they should come down safely. Everybody was praying in their own way that, “Oh God, they must be safe!” Because of the development outside we are so much connected with each other: there’s such an articulation of our thoughts and our ideas and our feelings and our sensitivities that, anything happens in any part of our country, we do feel, in any part of the world, we feel; anywhere anything happens to someone, we feel it. So our collectivity has also become sharper and sensitive.

It’s a remarkable time we are born in. You are very fortunate and lucky people. And your age group specially is specially blessed because, at this time, you are well-read, you know all about it and you are just there to understand and get it. But, as I said, that, in a country like India where, from ancient times, there has been a big search within, much more known to them were the truths of life. They knew what they were seeking, they knew what they had to seek and what is to expect in your seeking.

Though I would say India is today sleeping compared to you people. You are awake, you are definitely awake. Those who know what to seek are sleeping; those who are awake do not know what to seek. It’s a funny situation! But we can understand it by understanding one fact, that, when the tree grows outside too much we must know that the roots must have grown down deep, otherwise the tree cannot be sustained. If, in the West, we have grown very much outside, in the East maybe one or two roots, maybe, have gone deep down to find out the source to sustain this tree.

For me, east and west doesn’t exit. Nor does it exist for anything that is Divine. It’s a human conception of east and west and these countries and all that. It’s only one map, a beautiful picture God has created. Only human beings think that we are different and they are different. Of course He has created varieties just to create the joy of beauty. But He never created east, west, north, south and the difference between the people. That’s our own conception.

[But], whatever it is, definitely in the growth there are two types of people: one are the people who are growing outside, extroversion is much more, people are seeking outside, and there are people who are seeking inside. I would say like the Pisces, you see, they have two fishes: one fish is seeking inside and one fish is seeking outside. In the same way the whole universe looks to me that some are seeking outside and some are seeking inside.

Now those who are seekers of the Divine must take some guidance from people who have found out something before. For example, I had a big discussion with a gentleman who said, “This is occidental and this is that…” and all. I asked him, “Who was Christ? Was He born in England or in America? Why did you accept Him?” I mean He has to be born somewhere! After all, either He’ll be born in the East or in the West. Supposing He’s born in the West: so the Eastern people should say that, “Because He was born in the West, we’ll reject Him.” He is born in the East so Western people should say, “We will reject Him because He was born in the East!” This is absurd! I mean, a person can be born in one place only, he cannot be born everywhere. He has to be born somewhere. But these kind of localised identifications have led to lots of problems in the minds of people.

As scientists we have to keep our mind very, very open to understand what search people have made in the inner being, to find out what are we made of, why are we here, why did we get our evolution from amoeba to this stage, where have we to reach. We have to understand the other side of the picture. And [it’s] much more necessary for people who are now seeking that which was found out in the East. And Eastern people are seeking that which you have found out here. They are getting developed, you see, they are now getting sophisticated. While you are trying to find out something which they had found out without much sophistication.

In the ancient times, a long, long time back, we had three types of people working out the seeking. The first type I would say were the people who were on the left hand side of this Primordial Being which you see there with a blue line . Have you something to show them?

This blue line is the representative of a channel called Ida Nadi. And this channel was discovered thousands of years back in India. This channel represents the power of desire within us. And the desire reached such a subtle form that there was a desire to meet God, to be one with your Spirit; that’s the last desire. And this desire became what you call as the power of devotion or dedication or for asking, “Oh Lord, when are we going to meet? You must come, and we are waiting for You,” and all such things which shows that people believed that there was some Superior Power and that we had to receive the help from that Superior Power. This was one side or one type of people who existed.

And the other side [that] you see is the yellow line: this is the power of our action. The channel is called as Pingala channel. These are all very subtle channels inside our spinal cord. This Pingala channel expressed in the people who went into action.

Now the power of action in the West, I think, is a later manifestation of the way people acted in India. By this power they try to find out the mysteries of the matter. As you know matter is made of five elements. So they wanted to know how to overpower the matter; how to harness it, how to use it. And they tried to find out which are the Deities which are ruling the material side of life. For example, which is the Deity for the sea, what is the Deity for water, what is the Deity for Sun, Moon and other stars, and all those things. And Greeks, I think, went further with it, very much further, and they got into a wrong path and they got lost.

But this was the search where people tried to excite or to master the methods by which you could control all these five elements. And this method is expressed in our Vedas. ‘Vida’ means ‘to know’;  and the Vedas are the expressions of all the mantras which were used to harness the matter. The result of that is, today, what we feel, is science: that, through that, now science is manifested as knowledge to us.

But first they tried to, say, overpower the fire. Now there is one way of overpowering the fire: is from outside to use the fire for cooking, for this, that, all sorts of things. Or there could be a method by which you find out the Deity that rules the fire. If you can excite the Deity that rules the fire and can control that Deity or you are connected with that Deity, then you can manage to use the fire the way you like. So the second type of people who went into these mantras and yAgnyas and all these things: they did the fire ceremonies and tried to control the Sun, Moon and all sort of things; they were interested [in that].

But now the third type of people, who existed in the centre, in the central path. This path is called as the Sushumna path, and this path is responsible for our evolution from amoeba to this stage. Because of this power within us, to evolve, we became human beings. Why did we become human beings? Nobody asks! We should ask some questions!

All the scientists must ask questions [such as]: Why did we become human beings? Why some animals were discarded, and why we are supposed to be on top of all the evolutionary process? And now what is our goal? Why are we there? What are we to achieve?

This central path is a very, very important path for us, for Sahaja Yoga, because, by these different chakras that there are, the one is the lower one, then the second, the third and the fourth, fifth, sixth and seventh: these seven chakras denote vertically our evolution — vertically. And horizontally they express our physical, mental, emotional being.

The first chakra is very important. This chakra is the centre of Mooladhara. ‘Mooladhara’ means ‘the support of the root’. This centre is the centre of our innocence. The first thing that was created on this Earth was innocence. Innocence is the first power that was created. And that’s what we had to preserve first of all. That was the most important thing to preserve: is our innocence.

Now you will be surprised that this centre is placed under the Kundalini, not above the Kundalini. Kundalini is above that. Now this Kundalini is the power which is placed in the sacrum bone, nowhere else. I mean people can tell you, I have heard the other day, he was saying, that, “We believe the Kundalini is here.” I said, “You can believe it, it is here! I mean, but by believing it is not there!” Because what you see is the pulsation of Kundalini in this area. When Sahaja Yoga starts, in many people, with the naked eyes, you can see the pulsation of the Kundalini in this area, on people who have got some obstruction. Those who are all right they just get their Realisation without any difficulties. But [with] those who have obstruction, many of you have seen the pulsation in the sacrum bone. And imagine this bone is called ‘sacrum’! ‘Sacrum’ means ‘sacred’. So they knew that there was something in it. Even the Greeks, I think. Latin is not Greek, but we can say in Latin language it is called as sacred. So the sacred bone was containing this Sacred Power within us known as ‘Kundalini’.

This is the primule, is the germinating power within us. Now this fact has been accepted for thousands of years in India and elsewhere. In the Bible also it is said that Moses saw the tree of fire. That tree of fire is nothing but the whole Kundalini instrument. They talk of the Tree of Life: that is the same as this. In the Bible it is said, “I will appear before you like tongues of flames,” [this] is nothing but these centres. And these centres, you can see clearly within yourself, look like living flames as these are. But these are static, and they are moving and living.

So this is the thing that is being described in our ancient books, in all the scriptures. Even in Koran they have described as ‘Ruh’, R-U-H, ‘Ruh’. ‘Ruh’ means the cool breeze, the cool breeze. The Cool Breeze of the Holy Ghost is described in the Bible also. You cannot suddenly start a new idea about something. If it is an evolutionary process, if it is a living process, it must have its background, its history and it must culminate into something fruitful. Like every fruit has a tree behind it and roots behind it. You cannot just come out from somewhere and say, “See now, I have created a fruit! Now this fruit can become like this.” It has no meaning. It must be a plastic fruit. It cannot be a real fruit. If it is a living fruit it has to come out of the tree. That has existed for thousands and thousands of years and out of that this tree has to come. It must have the base. And this is traditionally called as the Kundalini awakening process.

Now, this was done, as I told you, there was only one person at the time of Rama, Nachiketa who tried to find it. Yoga Vasishtha was a realised-soul, no doubt, but he did not give Realisation to anyone. Only Raja Janaka gave Realisation to one fellow called Nachiketa.

Even Zen system in which people were supposed to get their Realisation: they said that nobody got Realisation except that there were twenty-six kashyapas. ‘Kashyapas’ means “realised-souls”. Only twenty-six, because I think it started about the sixth century. And for six centuries they had these kashyapas coming and going, one at a time. And after that they had none, they had none. So there are no realised-souls there either.

Christ has said very clearly that, “You are to be born again.” I mean the whole message of Christ’s life is Realisation. Because Judaism talked of the dharma, of the sustenance, of maintenance of the balance in the centre. That also, like a tree, that was very important. But then Christ came on this Earth to show that you have to become the Spirit. By His resurrection He showed that. And this is the message of Christ. But in Christianity, I don’t know how many people are seeking. They think that by going to church every morning it’s finished. Same with the Indians where it was said in every scripture, even about Vedas the first thing is said that, “Through this knowledge if you cannot seek your Spirit, it’s all useless.”

Then we had people like Shankaracharya, Adi Shankaracharya, who was the person who tried to re-establish Hinduism. Who has said that, “Without getting Realisation, what’s this life?” “Na yogye, na sankhye.” (meaning: neither by ‘yoga’ nor ‘sankhya’ it is achieved’) By all this talking, blah, blah blahs, where are you going to lie? You have to get the grace of the Mother to get your Realisation. When he talked first of ‘Vivekachudamani’, a very big book he wrote, on treaties of Indian philosophy, people were amazed at his knowledge. But later on he just wrote ‘Saundarya Lahari’ which is just the description of the Cool Breeze of the Holy Ghost and of the Holy Ghost. And people said, “What are you doing? You are just praising the Holy Ghost and not writing any philosophy.” He said, “There is no philosophy. It’s a spontaneous thing which should happen to all of us, and just the praise is the way you get it.” Just imagine a person of his calibre. But what are the Hindus doing today is nothing but the same old-style techniques and ritualism and all nonsense; they are also lost.

I mean there is such a pickle, made out of every great incarnation, that to me it was a shock to see how they have been able to spoil every incarnation into zero, and some sort of a nonsensical image of every incarnation who came on this Earth to emancipate, to give you a higher life, a higher awareness.

So we come to the point where we have to think what we have to expect. The first thing is: if it is a living process, it has to be spontaneous. This is very difficult for people to understand: that it has to be spontaneous.

For example, if this flower has to become the fruit, what is the technique? Do you stand before it for hours together or do you jump before it, or you stand on your heads [so] that it becomes? Anything spontaneous [that] you have seen, which is living, happens by itself. There is no technique.

When I say there is no technique, people do not want to believe it, because technique they want. But you have taken for granted all these things, isn’t it? I mean, one day you are sleeping, you find that the blossom time has come, lots of flowers are there. One morning you get up you find most of the flowers have become fruits, and you take it for granted. Do you ask for a technique there?

In the same way what technique did you employ to become human beings from amoeba? Say from monkey’s state to human beings: did you cut your tails to become human beings? Didn’t we become spontaneously that? It’s rather difficult to accept. But logically, you tell me, if it is a living process, what do we have do?

It is impossible to explain to people that there is no technique. They must have a technique. Now why do we want to have a technique?Let us face ourselves. Because we think we must do something about it: if we are not doing anything about it, then how can we get it? Because we think whatever we have got in this world is through our effort, by working for it. But what have you got? You’ve got everything dead! Say for example, something is dead, these stones are dead and you have made a building out of it. So what? Dead from the dead! What have you got living with you? Have you got any living powers? Can you give life to a fruit or to a tree? You cannot.

What have you achieved? Is only dead. With effort you can only achieve dead. Have you achieved anything living? If you put such a question to yourself then you will understand that living processes, we have to accept, are spontaneous: we cannot put any technique on it. As soon as we want to have technique, we must know this is our Mr Ego who wants to get satisfied.

I have seen people doing that. For example I will give you a very concrete example of a gentleman who came to me and he said, “No, no. How can be it that be simple Mother? How can it be that simple?” I told him that, “See: your breathing is so simple. If you have to read books and go into techniques for your breathing, how many people would be living?” But he would not accept me.

He said, “You must give us a technique otherwise we’ll not be happy.” Now there’s a very great realised-soul living in India but he is a very strict person, he’s not a Mother and he has no tolerance for any nonsense. So he had once told me, “If somebody troubles you, send the fellow over to me.” So I told him, “You go and see the guruji, such and such.” He was very enamoured that, “This gentleman has called me!” So he had to climb up seven miles up on a hill where this gentleman was sitting there. He went there, and he started talking, “Blah, blah, blah,” to him that, “See, Mother doesn’t give any technique to us and She’s just giving Realisation to every Dick, Tom and Harry and this and that!” He said, “Yah! Really, She’s doing wrong, isn’t it? All right, you be here and you eat your food and sleep here!” After a month I found the gentleman came to see me with both his legs round his neck, dangling in the air. I said, “What’s happened?” I mean, really tears came into my eyes and I said, “What’s happened? What this guru has done to him?” He came and started crying. He said, “Mother, never send me to that guru.” I said, “But you were very anxious to go to him, because you wanted something to climb up to see him.” He said, “He made really a mess out of me.” In the night because this guru, his limbs are broken and hands are broken, so he goes on a tiger. So he said, “And this tiger came and pushed me into a ghat! And I was lying there about thirteen, fourteen feet down below, and this guru after three, four days lowered down some rotis, some breads to me, and he said, “Now eat it and stay there. And till you promise me that you will not go and trouble Mataji, I am not going to take you out of this place!”

And then after two days he sent a few people to pick him up and brought. He said, “I am not here to take money from you. You cannot give me money, anything. But I will only teach you a good lesson!” He said, “I have had enough of it.” He said, “Now you take these legs around your neck, go dangling to Mataji, and She’s going to cure you. I am not going to cure you. And don’t come and tell me stories!” “Oh God” I said, “Look at this,” then of course we tried and worked on him, that’s a different point. But this is what it is. He said he wants technique, so he gave him a technique.

Another fellow who was like this, a doctor, he was troubling me, and I didn’t tell him, but he felt that he should go and see this guru. And for one month he made this fellow clean a Shiva’s temple, taking the water seven miles every day, morning and evening: with one bucket cleaning in Shiva’s temple! And doctor came back, he was so thinned down, absolutely exhausted. I said, “What’s the matter?” He said, “I was cleaning Shiva’s temple for a month!” So when I met this guru I asked him, “Why did you do that to him?” He said, “For a donkey, you better give donkey’s job! It’s no use telling them something of the higher life. They don’t want it. They want donkey’s life. So let them jump and do what they like. Let them be donkeys. Why should You try to give them [everything] so simple?” I was amazed at him. He said, “Mother, you are a Mother and you do what you like because this is your whim. But as far as we are concerned we are not going to give Realisation to anyone. I have given it to one, and he’s become a hopeless man.”

So I went to see this gentleman one day, the one who took twenty-five years to get his Realisation. And because somebody, one of my disciples had to invite him. Now this fellow was smoking cigarettes like this, sitting before me and he was talking quite a lot, and there were girls and women pressing his feet and doing all kinds of things. Of course he got up, touched my feet. He sat down, then he started saying that, “Now why this [Gagangiri] Maharaj is coming to see you in Bombay? After all he should not leave his place. He has been there for a hundred and eight years,” this, that. I said, “Who are you to judge him? Why are you judging him? He’s your guru. Why should you judge him? He has given you Realisation.”

“Yes, yes, he’s given me Realisation, I know. But I can also tell him something.”

I said, “But what about your smoking? You are still on with the smoking.” “Oh, I don’t care. I am beyond everything!”

I said, “All right.” Then I sat down watching him for a while. I said, “Now I am going home.” I said, “You apply this tika to me.”

I said, “All right, first I will apply,” so I applied [to] him. I said, “Now you apply,” and I sucked his finger, this is Agnya’s finger of ego. I sucked his finger on my Agnya, and he went on “Ha, ha, ha, ha, ha, ha!” like that. He said, “Mother, Mother, Mother what you are doing?” I said, “Nothing, nothing. You are great, you are a realised-soul. Why should you shake before me? Why are you shaking? Why don’t you get all right? Why are you shaking?”

He said, “No, no, no please stop it, stop it.” I said, “Now, first promise that you are not going to talk ill of your guru and stop all this nonsense of having women around and making money!”

But then the person with whom he went, he swindled them completely, just imagine! And I asked this gentleman who met me at the airport, “Why did you give money to this man?” They said, “Mother, because he said, ‘See, I was shaking before Mother because I was giving power to Her!’” I said, “Such fools! Why did you give him the money? Why didn’t you ask me what was happening?” This is what it is. When you want technique, then in the market there are thousand and one to give you technique, anything. They may tell you that put this [candle] on your head, light this, and walk on the street. And you will find thousands of them walking like this, and the price of this [candle] will go up in the market, and people will be doing it. Any sort of nonsense they will give you, they would like to do it!

For example, these people at Oxford Street: they are standing there, [the] Hareramas. They had cleaned their hair completely and applied those, what we call them shendis in India, I don’t know what you call. And they are sold in the market; do you know? Like all other wigs, they are sold as wigs there, and that is to applied there. And when they were dancing that was falling down, you know! And the dress and sari they were wearing was also falling down! And such foolish people. I said, “What do they think? By doing this, are they going to get God?” I said, “But why don’t you sit down and receive the blessings and why to do [this]?” They said, “But what’s wrong in clothes. What is the need to have clothes?” I said, “That’s not the point! What I am saying if by becoming naked, if you can become God, all the animals must go to God first, before you!”

You must understand what should happen to you: is there should be a new dimension which must be enlightened within you. A new dimension must come into you. What about your own power: have you got you own powers? If you are spiritually evolved, you must have your own powers. This is like enslavement. I said, “What are our own powers?” I said, “Can you tell in this person where is the Kundalini?” They said, “No, we don’t know. We have never heard about it.” “Can you tell what are your centres catching? Can you tell where are his centres rising?” He said, “No, we cannot.” So I called him, I said, “Come along, have your Realisation.” One of them I got hold of, somehow or other brought him. I think he was not interested in Realisation at all. He was not at all interested. He was interested in exhibitionism. He wanted to exhibition himself in that Oxford Street that’s why he went there. Absolutely that’s true. Otherwise, if he was, he would have said, “All right, if you are saying ‘I am giving you Realisation,’ let me have it!”

He said, “How can that be so silly?” I said, “What silly?  I said, “How can it be silly?” I said, “The wisest”. But must be somebody else is silly to see things which are silly. Like mad people:  if you go to a lunatic asylum they think you all are mad.

Once our prime minister went to a lunatic asylum and one lunatic came and started talking to him very nicely. He said, “How are you? When did you come here? And who are you?” So he said, “I am Jawaharlal Nehru, I am the prime minister of India.” He said, “All right, all right, you’ll be all right also. I used to say the same thing.” (laughter)

But how do you judge whether you are right or wrong? Where are you? The judgment comes when you have the dimension to judge. When you are Realised you can judge. You can say what chakras are catching. When Self-realisation comes in, you know all about these centres and you know all about these channels; about yourself and about others. The collective consciousness becomes an actualisation; it becomes part and parcel of you. Like an egg when it gets transformed, you really get a bird! It’s not just “blah, blah, blah.” You just get to see the bird with its wings and everything. A transformation takes place.

Your awareness must have that actual dimension within itself, inside. Not outside by developing your some sort of a horn or wearing some sort of a bushy hair. It’s something that happens to you within where…(break in recording)…comes through when you start judging yourself.

But God is compassion. He’s love. He gives you [the] chance, all the powers to clear yourself and cleanse yourself. But nobody can help a person who is so dump founded or mesmerised or who is such a, I would say, unintelligent person; who doesn’t understand that something has to happen to your awareness. Then only you have achieved something. For days in and days out they are going and going and going and achieving nothing. Somebody told me, “Oh, they are people who love each other very much.” “How do you know?” “They kiss each other quite a lot.” I said, “What is there?” Any licentious society you find such kissing going on. For example if you go to France, I mean, it’s horrifyingly kissing society, I tell you. Everybody has a right to kiss everyone they feel like. I mean, it’s sometimes so much that you really get frightened of the whole thing: anybody can come and kiss you, anybody is supposed to… I mean, I don’t know how it works out but it’s so. So I said, “What is, so [great] in kissing? There’s no love!”

Love is a thing which is not expressed in that way, but which works, which flows. It’s a power which acts, just like the sun’s rays. Sun’s rays come and act on the leaves. In the same way the love flows and acts on the Kundalini, and it gives Realisation to others. It transforms your life. You become a different person altogether. You become a master of yourself when you overpower everything.

Of course some are, I would call them, lame people, so they need little more time. Some are very fast ones and some are so quick that they once get it, they never lose it. And then the real growth of the new personality starts in which you start enjoying that bliss which is promised. All that is said before has to be proved today — every thing.

Now like we went to one of the Protestant Church meeting. I mean Catholics and Protestants and all sorts of things, you know! I am facing, mullahs and priests and this and that. But these people they said, “We believe in Christ.” I said, “Very good! That’s a very good thing to do, is to believe in Christ, thank God. At least there is no anarchist or somebody who is anti-Christ I am facing here! But,” I said, “where is Christ?” “He’s everywhere.” I said, “All right. But how do you contact Him?”

Everywhere there is ether, everywhere there are pictures, everywhere there is music, but how do you get them in the television? How do you contact? He is placed in a centre within us and we can prove it, through the Kundalini awakening, that Christ is there. Because when Kundalini reaches that centre, the centre which is on the optic thalamus, which controls the pituitary and the pineal body, [that], in that centre, resides Christ can be proved through Kundalini awakening. Because when Kundalini arrives at that point and it does not pierce, you have to take the name of Christ and then Kundalini moves on. But not the person who is not realised, the one who is realised can only do it.

So there are two types of people you find in Sahaja Yoga, is the people who are realised and those who are not realised. Now here the conflict starts that people who are realised can shock other people because they say some things very positively. They say that, “See, this is wrong, you should give up these things. This is not going to lead you anywhere.” And they look just like as you are but they know about your chakras. And when they tell you, you get angry with them and half of them leave, but that’s not the way. One should know that they are just trying to help you.

They were just the same as you were. Maybe even worse than you were or maybe much worse than you were but today they have reached the place from where they can feel you. And you are also going to do the same, so there is nothing to be shocked about or to be angry with.

But there’s tremendous difference in any artificial type of technique and the real is this that they know what it is. If you tie the eyes of ten people or ten young people who are realised-souls, two are sitting here, they all of them will say the same thing. For example, if you ask them, where is this gentleman catching?  They will show the same finger. And this is such a subjective thing, such a thing as your own, which has no whims, nothing. It’s absolutely definite.

Now the last point which I would like to cover today is that, as a result of Sahaja Yoga: this is the chocolate on the castor oil, we can say. The advantage of Sahaja Yoga is felt immediately, immediately. First of all physical ailments get cured. Now for your information I may have to say this that in ten minutes Sahaja Yoga cured the cancer of our President Sanjeev Reddy in India; in ten minutes. Cancer cannot be cured by anything else but Sahaja Yoga – it’s a fact.

For example, now doctors have reached the stage to say that cancer is caused by some protein matter which attacks us from the areas which are within us, which are built within us since the Creation.

Now within us what are these areas, let us see. On the left hand side of this Ida Nadi or this blue line is the collective subconscious. On the right hand side of this yellow line which is called as the Pingala Nadi is the collective supra-conscious. Below is the Hell. On top is the super-consciousness which we call as Self-realisation because this is the seat of the Spirit, which is manifested in the heart.

These are the areas, of course doctors don’t know. But whatever the psychologists start talking like blind people can be easily seen through when the lights are on. For example, from the left side and the right side I have always said there are entities which attack you. Those who disappeared in the Creation went out of circulation because they were not good for our evolution, they all exist there. Say, there are some vegetables which form viruses, there are some birds, some animals and many human beings who exist on both the sides. On the right hand side are the people who are very ambitious, who dealt with material things and who try to overpower matter and tried all kinds of tricks. These are the people who are still there existing within us.

When we try to go to the extremes, either to the left or to the right, by any one of these techniques, we get caught up. And when this thing happens, these proteins, so-called ’58 protein’ and number some sort of 56, all these are nothing but they are entities. They attack us and they trigger the cancer within us. And once this is triggered there is no way out because once you are in these areas, you’ll be attacked more and more, and the galloping state is established.

For example, now let us take the case of blood cancer: a simple thing like blood cancer. It’s the most simple thing and is very simple to treat also. [Dr.] David Spiro is laughing at it! All right, how you get it? The spleen is the speedometer within us, spleen which is placed on the left hand side like a round ball.

(No, on top a little bit. David can you come and show them?

Yes, correct! We should put it in the Void only, so it’s better! Near the Void you can say.)

Now spleen is managed by Swadishthan Chakra, which moves round and round the Void, you see. And it is the one which really sets our speed and pace: both things are done by the Swadishthana Chakra. But this poor spleen is creating blood cells for us. First of all if you think too much then the Swadishthana Chakra has to convert the fat cells for the use of the brain and it neglects the spleen, the liver, the pancreas, the kidneys and the uterus. But when it neglects the spleen, this is the first cause [of blood cancer], the primal cause we can call it.

Secondly, those people who are supposed to be very speedy — those who think too much are speedy people also. They will eat their food with such a speed, I can tell you, that I have seen people that they can polish off things before…I mean, you see them there, and it’s finished! (laughter) They are so fast, and if I am sitting with them, I am really starving because I just can’t keep pace with them! Just you serve them, and it’s finished, it’s polished off! Then they will eat with that speed and immediately finishing that plate there and they run off for some other work. Now this poor spleen has to now create blood for the digestion, then suddenly the fellow runs out [so] it has to give the blood cells for it’s running. Then he sits down and he starts thinking. While running he is thinking. He is doing many things. We think our body is a multipurpose machine. So with one thing we will be brushing, with another thing we will be doing something else, with ears we will be doing something else, with nose we will be doing something else, with stomach we will be doing something else. Like that, the whole body is poor thing busy with multipurpose things: poor this body. And then this spleen becomes really mad! It goes bizarre, as you call it. It does not know what is wrong with the fellow. It does not know when it will jump and when it will go into some sort of a new activity. So it goes really bizarre, and then the cells that are created by it become malignant cells, and blood cancer is settled.

But the third thing that really, that really, attacks it is one of these entities catching hold of these blood cells, and blood cancer is set in. And blood cancer can be very easily cured. I have seen now three cases, where doctors predicted that the patient is going to die within fifteen days, is still surviving after three years, quite hale and hearty!

If you just pull your attention through Kundalini awakening and pierce it through here, the attention which is spread out on left and right and gone to the extreme like this, stretched, can be pushed out onto the super-consciousness, immediately all your attacks are finished. All of them are left high and dry in their own places, and you are cured. And that is how blood cancer can be cured very easily in Sahaja Yoga. But that doesn’t mean you think of all the blood cancer patients you have and bring them along here! That always happens. I would request you not to do that. You see, this happened at the time of Christ and it should not be repeated again. God is interested in curing people who are seekers, who are seeking God and not curing people who are not seeking.

You do not look after a lamp which never is going to be enlightened; you just throw it in the junk! In the same way those who are seekers get their Realisation and get their cancer, all kinds of incurable diseases, diabetes this, that, lots of things, are cured. I mean [the list is] endless. So this is the first thing that happens: is physical.

Then mental: you know there are some people who are here sitting today who were horribly epileptic. Some of them used to scream for three hours, thanks to some great gurus who have managed to polish off everything that they had. Who have managed to take away all their money, mesmerise them completely. And those who became epileptic falling on the street, even some of the children, who are here now today, who have been absolutely cured of epilepsy, madness, schizophrenia, all sort of diseases like that, because again the same thing happens to you that your attention goes into the super-consciousness, which is, collective consciousness. Collective consciousness gets enlightened within you, it becomes actualised.  It gets manifesting itself.

It’s such a wonderful instrument you are — a human being. You have no idea. Only thing is you have to be plugged to the mains. Like a television set, once it is plugged to the mains, it starts manifesting, you also start manifesting. Nothing that I do, I do not do anything. Actually really, it is something like everything is ready, and one enlightened light can enlighten another light! What is there to be done? You are just ready and you just receive your own powers. I don’t do anything.

And why should one feel so hurt if I am doing it? It’s something surprising. Because a gentleman very seriously asked me, “Why you?” He was a doctor. I said, “Doctor, I will be thankful you come in my place. Here I am, I have to work till two o’clock in the night. I have to work so very hard, such a thankless job. You better do it! I’ll be very happy to be your disciple! And whatever you say, I am willing to do. You awaken the Kundalini of people!”

He said, “But I cannot.” So I said, “That’s why I am here!” Unluckily I know this! Unfortunately I know it! Now what to do? That I am supposed to do.

Now you are supposed to do many things which I cannot do. For example you can drive a car; I don’t know anything about it. I don’t understand your economics, I don’t understand your laws, I cannot understand anything that is supposed to be understood by a normal human being. But I understand Kundalini. If you ask me to open an ordinary packet of milk, I cannot! But I can open Kundalini. What to do now? I know that, so why should you feel so hurt about it?

It’s me who was supposed to do it. And that’s the only problem, if you can overcome it. You know so many things and I don’t know so many things, then there won’t be any problem of ego coming in between. If I have to, say, do something, fixing up this, I’ll have to ask Douglas to do it. I do not know how to fix it. I may spoil it but I do not know how to use it. So this is what it is, as simple as that.

And this has to be done. It was all promised. I have to do it. All this time has been promised. All this happening has been promised. This is your right to get it. You’d better get it.

And you cannot pay for it; no question [of that]. It’s an insult.  It is love. It’s not mercenary. It is love. You cannot pay for it. You cannot purchase me.

I am quite an illusion also. I mean, I can be quite tricky so be careful about me. If you try to avoid me, I’ll avoid you hundred times, and you’ll go out of circulation. So be careful, because I am not that simple as I look. I am telling you beforehand, so be careful about it. But still you will forget because I look so simple, but I am not.

I know so many things about you that I may try to just avoid you and I may really get you out of circulation for some time, till I have really sincere good people in here who get their Realisation, and then later on we can try these people who have gone out of circulation. It works out that way.

Many of time Sahaja yogis think that we have very few people coming to Sahaja Yoga. I said, “That has to be because this is real work.” This is not that you become an organisation member of somebody and you are certified, “All right, you are a Sahaja yogi.” There is nothing like that. It has to happen. The Kundalini has to come. You have to feel the vibrations. It is a happening. Unless and until it happens you cannot give false certificate. It’s not like plastic flowers, it is a real flower. And for the real flower to come in, it takes time, doesn’t matter. I mean we cannot give a false certificate.

So the second thing that happens is emotional thing.

Third thing is spiritual. We can say that spiritually you understand Sahaja Yoga. You understand what mistakes you have committed, what wrong people you have been to. Immediately you understand. You find it out. And also you are told each and every secret: how to do it, how to raise the Kundalini.

You can raise Kundalini. Only if the Kundalini has crossed up to Agnya, you can raise the Kundalini. As soon as you get your Realisation, you can give Realisation to others because of [the] emergency: we have to give Realisation to thousands and thousands and millions and millions.

You can give Realisation to people. There are all these people have given Realisation. Not only that, you can cure people. And you can know as to how you are progressing: where you are, what are the chakras, where they are placed on your fingers, where they come, every thing you can know. It’s all inside not outside. And it should happen to all of you. After all I am here only for that job.

I’ll work very hard, and I have been working very hard, everyone knows that. But you have to also understand to co-operate a little bit. Take your Realisation. After Realisation you will have to work hard also. But before Realisation just leave it to people who are realised. Like, when you don’t know swimming, it’s better to leave it to people who know swimming. Once you learn swimming, you also teach others. There’s nothing like inferiority, superiority, and all that. It’s not that.

So just face it as simple people, not with all this misidentification with ego. Now somebody was raising the Kundalini like that, so one gentleman walked off, I said, “Why?” He said, “Why is he doing like this?” I said, “But you do not know.” Supposing there is a person who is trying to help you swimming, he puts his hand under your belly: you can get angry with that person, “Why are you doing that?” I mean, he’s making you to float. But this is what it is. You do not know the technique which these people know. You will also know the technique of Kundalini, which is a living technique, because you are not yet living. When you become realised, you will be knowing because the power will flow from your hand. You can feel it on your hands, the cool breeze flowing.

But there’s only one warning to all our western seekers, which I always give: that you are great saints, I know you are seekers, you are very genuine and you are honest, everything is there. But you have one defect is that you think about everything. Even you have organised God, you have organised about Him. You have already preconceived ideas about Him — all this is there. And anybody who tries to play some tricks with you, you are very happy with that person and you are going along with that person very nicely. But here it is you who has to know, it is you who has to achieve, it is you who has to judge. Nobody is going to say that you are all right unless and until you say you are all right. It is you who have to believe into it.

So what happens that after Realisation the Kundalini rises and She pierces this fontanel bone area where you get your baptism. You can even feel the cool breeze coming from your head, actually you can feel it. But then you forget the experience, you go home and start thinking about it. As soon as you start thinking, the whole thing comes down, because it is beyond thinking. The happening is beyond thinking: without thinking it has happened. By thinking Kundalini doesn’t rise.

So just allow it to work out. When it works out, you will be surprised [that] it’s flowing. Supposing there is electricity coming and the electricity comes in, you see the light flickering. If you start thinking about it, do you think you’ll get back the light? No! You have to put the connection right. It’s something like that.

So thinking gives you ramblings, people are lost [in that]. Then they come back. And once, after Realisation if you lose it, it takes time, it takes time. It’s a headache to me and headache to you. Many people do that way but please don’t do it. After all you are seekers of ages. Why should you waste your energy and time and mine also. Be sensible and wise, get your Realisation and get to it. Give up all your misidentifications. All these are misidentifications. And do not reach that point where you become helpless and you have to give up these misidentifications.

Because I told one person I told that, “Your guru is not all right,” and he wouldn’t believe me, because his Void was catching. Then he got epileptic, he got sick, then he came to me. It took me three months to work on him. So the whole process of emancipation is slowed down, and that’s how you pull down the forces of Divinity.

There are so many things one can say. As you know there are lectures and lectures, and Douglas has so many tapes and in London itself I have done so much. And to understand why London and why England, you better read “Milton” by William Blake*. He has prophesied all this that is going to happen. That England is going to be the Jerusalem. That it is going to be the pilgrimage. It has described everything that is Sahaja Yoga. It’s a wonderful prophesy, you better read it to understand. It is even described where the ashram would be in Lambeth Vale. It has described that first it will start in Surrey Hills where I first came and stayed. And he has described in the end how the Virgin Herself is going to work it out, how the Mother is going to work it. It’s all beautifully done. So you had such a great poet like Blake, who has already guided you. Better take guidance from them.

Another is Shakespeare who was another great realised-soul who showed the futility of nonsense of this so-called romanticism and all this. So be sensible about it, be wise. You have a great heritage. Your Stonehenge and all these things, I have talked about it, what are these. This place has been worked out by many saints before, and today you are born here. You are here to achieve your highest. There is a purpose behind it.

As I said that England is the heart of the universe, no doubt, it is the heart, that’s why I am here. I didn’t come as an immigrant or anything. I came because my husband got elected to this post and I came here. That was all organised. And I am just there because of that, and you’ll be happy to know he has been re-elected again for five years so I am going to be here five years more. And then England being the heart, we have to be very careful because everything articulates through heart, and the Spirit lives in the heart.

England is the heart, India is the Kundalini and Europe is the liver. Now see the contradiction: Kundalini, where Kundalini is in India people are sleeping. Kundalini is sleeping; where Europe, where the liver is, where the attention is, people are drunkards, they are drinking, the liver is gone! Where the heart is England, it is lethargic. Tell me now: what am I to do? This is the situation in which we are, so we have to rise to the occasion and achieve our goal.

England is very important, very, very important, and I am going to work very hard here, no doubt. But you all have to help me and understand that the time has come now to get what you have been seeking. All of you should achieve what you have been seeking, right now.

May God Bless you.

I would like you to ask me some questions. But don’t ask controversial questions like: “I read in this book, that book…” Then somebody has been to some far-fetched place, “What do you think of this guru and that guru?” I am not going to get into controversies. So don’t ask me about any guru, you will find out yourself.

Ask some sensible questions about Realisation.

Seeker: If you feel yourself to be completely blocked, if there’s nothing you can do. What do you do?

Shri Mataji: You leave it to me. I am quite a master in this.  I have had all kinds of blocks: mountains after mountains. You don’t know how much I have gone through. I have become now an expert. You are not such a block, at least as far as you are concerned, so don’t worry.

You see, I have worked hard for years to study all the permutations, combinations. I used to enter into the Kundalini and into the…to find out what are the blockages. And I know how to find the way out. You just leave it to me. But later on when you get it, everything I will tell you, every secret about it. Everything I am going to tell you, and you are going to become the master yourself. That’s what it is. What kind of blockage you are fearing?

Seeker: Some kind of fear.

Shri Mataji: Fear is very simple to conquer. You see, it is because of conditionings. People are … I don’t know why they do it, this I cannot explain. Human beings are very difficult. Like in France they said, “Mother, if you say you are a happy person, they’ll think you are naïve.” I said, “Why?”

“Because [they think] you do not know any problems. So you have to be a very unhappy person. You have to show you are unhappy. Your cheeks must go inside like this; you must look absolutely like a prisoner of Ceylon.” I said, “Really?”

They said, “If you go like this, Mother, in such a happy mood, they will never take you seriously!” I said, “But I don’t think.” They said, “We must suffer. That’s what they want.”

I said, “But why? Christ has suffered for you, now why do you want to suffer?”

But they say these things. Actually you know, it is with these people I have seen they say. I said, “If it is so, you are people having prostitutes on the streets, lined up together. You have pubs on the other side. You have gay, this thing and nonsensical things all over. You are unhappy. You are making everybody extremely unhappy.” I said, “I am unhappy because I see this kind of thing going on here, and you are saying that you are unhappy. You are not unhappy at all, you are just escaping it.”

Also so the fear is another sort of a conditioning on you. It comes to you [such] that you think, “I will have to lose something.” No, you blossom into something. Because you are beautiful. I see that beauty and I see that Spirit and you are that. And the fear that you have is because you cannot see it. It’s just a conditioning. You just blossom into it. Did you read any one of these horrible books on Kundalini? That’s it! That’s very simple to overcome.

I’ll tell you what: a villager comes to the city, he has never seen electricity and he puts his two fingers in the plug! [It’s] like that. They are absolutely unauthorised. You know, they do not know what Kundalini is. I was amazed. There’s a big book like that, and he says the Kundalini is in the stomach! I said, “Now what to do?” And he’s written a big book like that, you see.

They are naïve first of all, they are unauthorised, they are unholy. Everybody cannot do Kundalini’s job. You have to be an authorised person from God and you have to be holy person. Specially a gentleman, I know, who has written a book, he leads such a horrible private life. He’s such a money-minded fellow. He talks of Kundalini, I was surprised. He’s taking money from everyone and he’s leading such a horrible life and he’s spoiling women and doing all kinds of things and raping them. And he is telling that my Kundalini rose and it troubled me like this, and it will. Kundalini doesn’t trouble actually [it’s] this Deity sitting there on the first chakra – Shri Ganesha. He is the Deity of innocence, who incarnated as Jesus Christ. He only thrashes such people who try to handle Kundalini. Even they try to put your innocence, which looks after your sex onto the Mother. Just imagine what a sinful thing it is.

Innocence is the one that is your special power. That’s why people are not even spontaneous now in sex. They just think about it. Do you know the latest numbers of people who are impotent in the West? And do you know, in Switzerland itself, out of five families only one family can produce children – they are impotent. If you think about sex, you can become impotent. All the spontaneity is lost. And here people are getting sophisticated with it. Either you become a rapist or you become absolutely an impotent person. Either you go the right or to the left.

So these people who talk about Kundalini have no sense of proportion, they have lead a very bad life, they are unholy people. They have no sense of holiness, righteousness. I mean righteousness is the thing. When I talk of righteousness they think I am a Victorian, you see. So I said, “I am not only Victorian, I am even much earlier – I am ancient.” But that is what it is.

But I do not say you become righteous or anything — nothing out of the kind — because that’s a difficult task. What I say you is you get your Realisation. [Then] automatically you will do it, automatically. Because the religion, what we call is the religion or the righteousness gets enlightened within you, [so] you just cannot do it.

So I am not going to tell you. I said I am tricky. I will just raise your Kundalini. You yourself will give up. I don’t say you give up your drugs, nothing, but you just give up. I don’t say you give up your drinks. I do not say you give up your cigarettes. There are many who have given up completely because they have found the absolute! All right?

In the same way your fears will also disappear but do not think of them. Just now you are sitting before a very powerful person. Don’t you worry.

Alright? Is there any question? One more, and then I will do the thing. Anyone?

Seeker: Mother, Mother, you mentioned about emergency, what did you mean?

Shri Mataji: Are you already frightened? I said ‘emergency’ because the Last Judgment has started. In the atmosphere it is. No earthquakes for you, all right?

Can’t you see [that] there is emergency, people want to have it, and you can feel the emergency, everywhere there’s a talk about it. Everyone knows there is some sort of an atmosphere of emergency. Everybody is running fast, nobody knows why.

You don’t worry, you are a realised-soul. Emergency is that you give more Realisation to East End (of London) people! (laughing)

All right?

So, anymore, no, all right. Now, why I have asked you to ask questions, that after this don’t ask any questions, just have it. If you are hungry, you will just get it.

And I would request you to put out your shoes and put your feet on the ground. I don’t need really but I am just doing it to please you people. It’s all right, I can manage. Because they will say, “Why don’t You take out your shoes?” you know.

All right, so, put your hands towards me, straight like this, and you have to close your eyes. That’s very important, that you must close your eyes. Now, why? Because the Kundalini when it rises above the Agnya, if your eyes are not closed, it does not rise because there is dilatation of the pupil that takes place, and it stops there.

But maybe your eyes may be flickering possibly, then you open your eyes and watch me. In case that they are not flickering, then it’s all right.

Now some of you may feel a little heat, and if Sahaja yogis tell you something, you just listen to them, don’t get angry with them. It’s for your good. If they tell you to remove something or do something, it’s better to listen to them.

Just put both your hands towards me. Just like that.

Just see if there is flickering in your eyes.

It’s a funny thing today: the centre you are catching is Left Nabhi. And you have to decide one thing that you have to marry sometime because there are great souls who are to be born, and we have to give them parents who are realised-souls. If you are not yet married just say that, “Mother, we’ll marry,” that’s all. It will work out.

Still Left Nabhi is there.

Also the marriage institution has to be put right because, if these great souls are to be born, we have to give them a nest, a family where they are to be born. Otherwise poor Indians will have to bear all the children of the world!

Because of this emergency many people are taking birth, and they would not like to be born in a place where the parents are killing the children or where the parents are quarrelling among themselves and every day they are having a divorce. So poor Indians they have to take the load upon themselves.

Marcus close your eyes.

Close your eyes Linda. Close your eyes. It doesn’t go over your Hamsa. Close your eyes.

Put your attention to your Sahasrara.

Void is there and Left Nabhi.

(End of recording)

*(about William Blake)