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Talk to yogis. Lonavala (India), 25 January 1982.
It is such a pleasure to meet so many Sahaja Yogis from all over the world, and to be able to talk to them. They understand Me the best, in this whole world. It’s impossible to have a rapport with a person who is not a Sahaja Yogi. Even if you give them realization, if they have not become Sahaja Yogis, then it is very difficult to make them understand the subtleties of their own being also. Today, as we are all Sahaja yogis here, I would like to tell you about the growth of the being on the subtler plane.
All the time, as we have been doing anything, we have been thinking what is to be done. “What is to be done to be realized?” was the first question people asked Me, when they were not realized. “What should we do Mother to get realized?” Then I had to tell them, “Nothing, just spread your hands towards Me, and it will work out.” It’s true, it works out that way. Now after realization, you have to do something, as they say. But still what have you to do? Again, the question comes in, “What should we do for this – to remove this chakra, that chakra; what is the technique, what is the thing?” The trouble with Sahaja yogis as they are today, they are all technocrats already. They have done so much of technical things, that it is better that they should forget about technique and worry more about spontaneity. The technique is so much, that the technique has killed the spontaneity, and a balance has to be struck between technique and the spontaneity.
First you get your realization by spontaneity -sahaja. Then you have to have – naturally, by temperament you are technocrats – want to have a technique, the tantra, the mechanism, how to work out the mechanism. Thank God, we are not so bad now, otherwise, normally I have seen, I was giving lectures and people were giving bandhans to them and raising their Kundalini – all mad people around, and others who were newcomers would be frightened at such Sahaja Yogis that, “What is the matter with these people? They are so abnormal.” And if you tell them that, “You should not do it, you should just listen to the lecture”, they would say, “No, no, Mother, we were catching, so we were trying to put ourselves right.”
Now one has to realize that you have to become subtler. Then again the question, “How to become?” How to become subtler is the problem. For example, today, there was a question of having a puja in the morning time – today. They said that there is a Suryagrahana, means ‘the eclipse of the sun’ and if today is such a great date, that if you do the worship or the puja you get blessings of thousands of such pujas on an eclipse day of the sun. Now, if you look at it, it looks very fine, good, yes it’s true, it is written in the astrological survey and all that – is a very great thing, and we start following it. You being Sahaja Yogis, you must attack it from a subtler point. That is how your wisdom will also become subtler; your attitude also will become subtler. To attack such a question from subtle point of view, we have to first of all know that we are Sahaja Yogis. No technique is needed, just see your vibrations on this question, to begin with – it’s very simple. Subtler things are the simpler things; gross things are complicated – it is very simple, very simple equation. Simple thing is to feel the vibrations on this point – whether today’s puja, is it really worth something or not. You’ll be amazed that your right side will become hot on this point.
So, this intellect, which is now being enlightened, prabuddha you have become, you must use it in a subtler way. Why, that for Sahaja Yogis, it is not necessary to do the puja today? You have already become thoughtless, so I will not ask you to answer the question. The reason is, as you are all technocrats, you are right-sided. This was all right thousands of years back, when the Vedas started, and the Vedas have given us the science. All the excitement about Vedas was all right at that time when they worshipped the Surya or the right-sided things. In Greece, these things reached such a height that all the Gods had to fall just like human beings and become just like human beings. For them now, everybody has weaknesses; every God has a weakness. This weakness one has, that weakness another has, they don’t understand Gods anymore in Greece. They just think that they are some sort of entities with all the weaknesses of human beings burdened on them. So, this right-side movement has been bit too much – since the time of Vedas. Worshipping of Surya has been too much; you have worshipped too much. It was so much so, that Christ had to come on this Earth and tell people that you better forgive. His advent should have made people more in the centre but it did not. On the contrary all the Christian nations went onto right side and we Indians are also following you up.
So, we are very right-sided people. All the Sahaja Yogis today are – 99.9 percent are – right-sided, even Indians are. The bhakti people are lost; they are not yet here. They are another mad people. They are going to this Pandhari temple, praying to God, they are in the churches, they are in the temples, they are in the mosques – everywhere they are lost. So, those who worship the moon, worship the bhakti, the so-called love of God, are lost to Sahaja Yoga for the time being. More the intellectuals are here. Because they really lead others into another… they sound more sane than the other. But this movement towards the right is overdone. So now, to bring Sahaja Yogis to normalcy is to bring them to the left side, as they are today – as they are today. That’s why I took you down to villages, where people are very simple, very loving, very affectionate. With right-sided people, the brain is so wobbly that you can’t bear any discomfort – you can’t bear any discomfort. If there is any discomfort, you just can’t bear it because all your energies are spent in your brain activity, which is useless and thoroughly rubbish, absolutely – creating nothing. But it makes you so tired that a slight discomfort in the body makes you very, very upset, and you can’t bear any physical discomfort. Now we Indians are also, are so enamored by your progress that we are also trying to follow your footsteps, and with a double march.
Under these circumstances, one has to think of those people who really love God. There is bhakti, there is devotion. They don’t think, they don’t worry; they are blindly following God. They know there is God and they said, “We will meet God sometime” whatever mistakes they are creating. As you have committed mistakes with your right-sided behavior, with the left-side also they are committing lots of mistakes, no doubt. But they are to be brought in. You have to meet them, and they have to meet you. They’ll have a good effect on you, I know they will have. To become the moon now – is not so easy, because once you have become the sun, rather difficult – you have gone a little ahead. But to become the moon, you have to develop that shraddha, that faith, that non-thinking faith, that love.
One may ask, “From where do you start when you sit for meditation?” I asked Modi what were the questions. “From where to start and where to end?” It’s all again technique. Only one technique I would prescribe for you people – every group requires a different type of a technique, you see, the kind of problems they face – is that you start with your heart and end there only. It starts from your heart, from your Atma, and ends in your Atma. Just give up talking about it, just start feeling your heart; just start feeling your heart, opening it out – not your mouth so much as your heart. What do we do when we love? What is the sign and symptom? I don’t know, in the West, if that glimpse of love is also there or not. But you can see in this country, still – say a mother, if her child is sick. I’ve known My own mother, when My brother was very sick with typhoid, for twenty-one days and nights she did not sleep a wink, she did not. If you have seen that kind of love, then you can understand what wonders… she never thought of her comfort, nothing – what time she slept, what time she got up. She didn’t think of her food, nothing. She was just wanting that her son should be all right. Now, they said that twenty-one days he has to be sick whatever it is; if you try to cure it earlier, then it will have a relapse on him or some problem. So, twenty-one days, really I’ve seen, that she didn’t eat any food. She didn’t know what she was eating; anybody who offered her food, she would eat little bit and then she would not; she had no desire left but to see that her child is cured.
How much can we sacrifice for Sahaj Yoga?
Then I’ll give you another example, which I’ve seen Myself in My childhood. Now Indians are very different people – but I have seen very great Indians in this country. When the Britishers were here, they were another type of Britishers also – now you don’t find them anywhere. Only thing, that Gandhiji said that, “You’ll get swaraj – you’ll get independence.” Swaraji is actually – ”swa’ means ‘your Spirit’, and ‘the reign of the Spirit’. But when he said ‘swaraji’, he meant ‘political independence’. And how much people sacrificed for that – which they did not enjoy themselves? In My own family, My own father who had houses, cars, everything, he was a titleholder, he used to get his clothes stitched from England, everything was taken away from him, everything that he had, everything. And we stayed in very ordinary huts on the soil itself. There was nothing between us and the Mother Earth. But what we felt, that our father was doing it for such a great purpose – we were very proud of it. We never felt we were sacrificing anything; we were very much respected everywhere and people offered us free things but we would not accept. Such pride that we are doing it, such a great thing, for our own country, for our countrymen, for such a wider interest.
In Sahaja Yoga, you don’t have to sacrifice anything, neither money, nor your sleep, which is very important, nor your comforts, nothing. Everything you get cheap – you see this blessing. And what is promised to you is swaraj in the real sense, is the domain of your Spirit. The liberation of the highest type is promised, which you have achieved. And sacrifice is zero. You can’t even sacrifice your time. On top of that, some people think that they are obliging Sahaja Yoga, specially Me. It is the absurdity of the whole thing. It was not definite also that we’ll get independence at that time – nothing definite. They went to jail – My mother went to jail 5 times – with 11 children in the family, only we and our relations, everybody, staying in the house, all still not educated. Now we are the other way round. You see, today’s politicians are busy making money – it is just the other way around system; other way around – it is just the other way around. I mean, I can’t understand from where these people have come. So, you don’t have to sacrifice anything – nothing is to be sacrificed. Always, you get a added advantage in this way or that way – you are blessed every moment. Count your blessings. And then, one should start understanding that these blessings are for us to become more loving, more generous and sacrificing.
The idea that we are sacrificing itself is a ego-oriented idea. What do you sacrifice? What do we have to sacrifice? I mean, supposing I say, “I am sacrificing,” it’s nonsense because that’s My nature. I have to jolly well do it, can’t help it, I can’t run away. If I run away from you, My vibrations will make Me – bloat Me like this – I won’t be able to even walk. I have to give. In the same way, you have to give realization. If you think that, “In my house, Oh, I do lots of meditation, Mother, I give exclusively, I am exclusive” – finished. You cannot go further. You may have your own conception that you are going further with it – you are absolutely wrong. I allow you to continue with your myths. That doesn’t mean that it is true. People ask Me, “How many times should we attend the program? How many times should we meditate?” Every moment!
You have to take responsibility of Sahaja Yoga now. You have to become responsible for it in your own way. You have to do it because you are doing it for the greater good. The more you think of the greater good it is doing, the better it would be for you. All these are the qualities of the left side, heart – the Atma. Atma is all the time giving, it cannot receive. That is why it is untarnishable, it is unsurmountable. Who can surmount it? Because it is the king of itself, nobody can dominate, nothing, no material wealth. Nothing can dominate it, it is above. So, to get to subtler life, “Take to spiritual life,” they say. But spiritual life means what – they don’t understand. And ‘spirit’ in English language, it is such a misnomer that for three things they use one word ‘spirit’, can you imagine? – For the dead, for the spirit that they drink, and the Spirit that so called exists within them. It is absurd isn’t it, to give such a name, one name to the three things which are absolutely contradicting each other? So, to get to subtler life, one has to get to the Spirit, to the subtleties of everything.
Now, I’ll give you a concrete example. You need not pull your ears for that – see to the subtleness. In Pune, people wanted to give you some presents. They said, “What should we give?” I said, “Give them the soil of Maharashtra.” Every particle is vibrated here – clay of Maharashtra. Last time if you remember, they gave you a incense-burning – what we call dhupat in Marathi. I don’t know what you call in English – there is no name for such a thing – but you know what they gave you. This time I said give some symbolic and I chose that for you. I wanted to see your reactions, what reactions you will have. It was chosen with a purpose. It is a very important thing you are taking with you. Is a very important thing, is vibrated clay from Maharashtra – it’s a very great thing. Though in Pune, people are very miserly – agreed; they always make a mess of many things – agreed; but the soil is vibrated – is punyas there. And out of that soil, I wanted to find out something that would be symbolic. I Myself went before the Puja to select it. Now, what you have made out of it is not so satisfactory. That is the most important thing you are taking from here. All other things are of utility of a very gross nature. You may try; you can put a plant in it which will give vibrations. So, I was told that they were asked to send it by ship. It is very wrong. But if I give you a silver thing, you will carry it with you – will you send it by ship? Nothing to pull your ears for.
But to get to subtler things is to understand the subtler values of everything. It cannot be weighed or understood through money. Because in the West, you know, people buy everything as an investment, everything. I don’t know how they don’t buy even their nose for an investment. Everything – they must be standardized, because it should have a resale value. I mean, imagine to have everything which is saleable – means there is no feeling for that thing. They would buy even a certificate the same way; even the bed they sleep in, everything should be saleable, re-saleable I mean. And this is the curse of that country. In this country, it is not so. For them, silver need not be so much standardized and gold need not be so much standardized. Gold they may like to have pure gold because it is good for vibrations. But such standardization in these things! It’s all right for, say, bathroom pipes you should have standard; but for these small-small things there should be no standardization. Because they do not feel the vibrations. If you start understanding things that have vibrations, then you will be amazed that the things, that they look so insipid, so useless, not re-saleable at all – you can say worthless, you can call it from all our standards absolutely worthless – could be so much useful. Like one hair of Mohammed Sahib, imagine one hair of Mohammed Sahib! Shroud of Christ! Shroud of Christ, but that also they are selling now, they are making money out of that also. I mean, thanks to these Western people, everything is saleable.
So, once you start going to the subtler side of the physical things, not only aesthetics – aesthetics are also saleable – but things that cannot be sold – you cannot sell your Spirit – they should be the most precious things for you which is the most precious energy for you. Our values are changed. We are different people. Which is the most precious energy for us? Is the living energy. The synthesized energy of all the energies is the living energy. But we believe in money energy or destructive energies or atomic energies, electrical energies, now petrol energies – and all these points will be hit to understand that you have to do without them. So, the greatest thing for a Sahaja Yogi is the living energy, and the sign of living energy is that it grows and discards all that is useless for it. It knows how to work it out. In the same way, a Sahaja Yogi should know what is important, what is unimportant. You are judged every moment, naturally because you have entered into the Judgment of God.
This understanding of becoming subtler comes through love. What is love, is hard to describe. You can only enjoy it. I enjoy it, when a villager brings something so simple and makes Me eat that. Like the small little fruits called ‘ber’ were given to Shri Rama. Shri Rama Himself was born on the right side. Great example for all of you is Shri Ram who was on the right side, who works the right side. When He was born and He was a child… He is a Suryavanshi, He is the son of Surya. I mean Surya – everything comes from the Sun to Him. When He was born and was a little child, He asked His mother that, “I would like to have the Moon.” He started crying, and nobody knew how to satisfy. He said, “I want to have the Moon.” They gave Him any toys, He’d throw away. They said, “What a child it is, funny thing. He wants to have the moon, now how to get Him the moon?” They did not know how to solve the problem. He said, “Somehow you get Me the moon. I don’t want to eat or anything, I want to have the moon.” Here the moon represents the Atma, the cooling capacity. He asked for the moon. You are all on the right side, so ask for the moon, ask for the Spirit. And they didn’t know how to satisfy this Shri Rama, who was the incarnation of Shri Vishnu, asking for the moon of all the things, not for anything else. What’s so important? So, the mother has always a intuition. She brought a – it’s a, it’s a maya, it is a beautiful drama – she brought a mirror and showed Him the moon in the mirror. He said, “Now you can get the moon here.” So sweet! And He was satisfied. Even the reflection of that can satisfy. You are like the mirrors and I want to see the reflection of moon in you.
The love we talk of, is to be subtler. It becomes really subtler when you really enjoy. Like giving something to someone is one of the ways of judging it. When you start to enjoy giving – not taking, just giving – then you should know that on material level you have felt, you have touched that shore of subtlety on material level only. On emotional level you can – in India, I mean, everybody loves their children, I mean it’s a bit too much, going too far. I mean, they can even sell their country in the name of their children. It is going too far, their wives – I mean, it is a trip – their husbands, is a bit too much. The other side is in the West, where they don’t believe in all this nonsensical love. In between, the subtlety of love is that love a person, not with any reasoning, with any way of gain or any relationship whatsoever, just emit love. Whether you are recognized or not, just emit love is the subtler way of loving. That love cures people, that love comforts – that’s the comforting side, it comforts. To begin with, we should see to the comforts of others. Self-indulgence is against that love. People would like to make My bed. All right, they love Me I know. But it must permeate to others. They love Me, and second they love themselves. That’s no good.
Between Me and them there is a big gap. All that is filled by others. Who are the others? Are the Sahaja yogis. We would never make a bed of another Sahaja Yogi out of love also – very difficult – it’s too much. But to find out the faults with other Sahaja Yogis! “You got up very early, you opened the tap bit loudly, I couldn’t sleep”, this is a very common complaint. “They banged the door early in the morning, they made a noise.” Because your brains are out now, with thinking, you are so much strained here that you can’t bear any sounds anywhere. I mean, people can only live in a churchyard happily I think, if that is the situation. While in India, you see, we don’t mind any kind of noise anywhere. I mean, as it is, wherever I have stayed there has been a railway station around. We could hear all the shunting, everything going on and I enjoyed really all that.
So, when we start comforting others, to give comfort to their physical body, to their mental body, that is also a very far-fetched thing. Because to say comforting things, to say beautiful things to others, is regarded – I don’t know what. In the West it is very hard to find people who can find out words to say sweet things to others. Same in India, specially in Maharashtra. Marathi language can be very harsh. (Marathi.) Speak sweet words, say something sweet, be kind and nice. It is so nice to hear that you are sweet to each other.
When people come and tell Me that, “Such and such Sahaja Yogi came and comforted me, and was very kind,” I really feel Sahaja Yoga is working in a big way. I feel it in a very big way. You may have thousands of them, what is it? There is no quality there. Try to mold your Vishuddhi in a proper way, otherwise you will have Vishuddhi troubles, I must say. Try to use language which is extremely sweet. It doesn’t mean hypocrisy, no. You are great inside, you want to love. But there is a barrier of your ego. When your light of love passes through that ego, it gets falsified, it gets ruined, it gets spoilt and then you say harsh words to others. Try to be sweet through your Vishuddhi Chakra. Once you start doing that, you will develop your witness state very well. Because, first of all you witness yourself which is trying to be nasty to others and enjoy that nastiness. There is a Hitler sitting in your Vishuddhi and that Hitler you start seeing, “All right, Mr. Hitler.” It wants to say something very harsh, you see, because that appeals to your ego which we call as intelligence. You see our misidentifications are, you see, ” You are very intelligent, very sharp.” That’s only ego, one of the agents of ego. So try to be sweet in your tongue.
It is very easy to make fun of people for small things here and there, anything making easy. (Marathi.) In Maharashtra, people are known for such a thing – how to make fun of everyone. But when we start making fun of others, we also become a target of fun. English also are like that, very much. Everyone, I should say, but English are quite specia, to make fun of everyone. Of course, Sahaja Yogis are now realizing. Everyone has their own style of dealing with things. Like, I would say Americans are – they have no respect of themselves, no respect for themselves. I mean, they have no respect at all for themselves or anybody else’s life or any… They have no respect of any kind. Indians are hypocritical, very hypocritical people. Like that, everybody has problem.
Now you have become Sahaja Yogis, you are no more English, Indians, Americans – nothing. You are Sahaja Yogis. You belong to a great – very, very great organization of God. And Sahaja Yoga is the place where you have to learn, in every way. For Indians have to learn how to be honest and English have to learn how to love. Americans have to learn how to be self-respecting. All of us have to learn, give up what we had, our identifications, and have to become subtler and universal and people of such values that anybody who sees will say that in America Mother has created Abraham Lincolns, in Russia Tolstoys, in Maharashtra Shivajis. I’m too ambitious, I should say. But I see reality in you and reality in Myself. On that basis, I say, one has to create people of that special quality which they have sterling qualities, sterling qualities, spiritual qualities which are so subtle, so beautiful, so sweet, so understanding. And still, just like steel, nobody can budge them from their own principles, tattwas. That is what it is, so simple as that. And then you start enjoying your love, enjoying your virtues, enjoying everything and having compassion for others.
Then you don’t catch. You catch because you don’t have compassion. In compassion you’ll never catch, never. A mother never gets a disease from her child. She never gets a disease from her child, it’s a fact. Child may be a tuberculosis patient or could be any patient, she never catches because she loves.
In the same way, when you really love, you’ll never catch anything. Then what is the question of what is to clear, where to clear, what to do – what does it matter? You are just flowing your heart. At this moment, My children, My Sahaja Yogis are at that level that they can completely open their heart without any fear. It’s a very different stage you have reached now; you are at a different stage. Just assume your powers. Know that you are that. Just open your heart.
Like, the other day I saw somebody, he was caught up very badly from all the sides – not Sahaja Yogi, somebody else. And I asked him, “How did you manage to get so many bhoots into yourself?” Every, every guru you name, he is there. I said, “How did you manage?” He said, “I have a very open heart.” (Laughter.) “Oh God,” I said. I said, “It’s like an open window in a dirty place. You get every smell, every mosquitoes and bugs walking into it.”
So, the fear of opening your heart to that extent, comes from that, from that experience. But now, you are at such a stage that, open your heart. There should be no fear; there will be no problem. Material problems are not difficult to be solved. Like, somebody was taking My photograph which was in a silver frame, and she was rather worried because the customs may stop her not taking. Of course, photograph they can’t stop, but maybe the silver frame. And this gentleman told Me that he was taking it with him with a frame, silver frame and he thought people will object. But as soon as they saw the photograph they said namaskar to the photograph, forgot about the frame.
So many problems can be solved, material problems – is so simple to be solved, so simple. Is the easiest to be solved, physical problems also. I have known of some Sahaja Yogis who have been in Sahaja Yoga six, seven years. But still they are frightened about their body, their physical body, the troubles they have had and this and that. If they can just leave that fear, they’ll get out of it. It is such a vicious circle built in. And the same thing works out with our open-heart surgery, as we call it. We are afraid that our heart will be again be caught up into nonsensical things, so we don’t want to open our heart. That fear I can understand. But now you are Sahaja Yogis, finished. Ask all these people to get lost. All these fears, you should ask them to get lost.
When you discover that you are the Spirit, you are that powerful Spirit, just try to steady it. How it feels happy? It’s very simple. When do you feel really happy? Is when you give something, not to Mataji only. To Me you are, I know. If I take something from you, you’ll feel very happy about it, I know. But to somebody else; give some love, comfort. What a great power this voice and this vani has, that you can comfort others by saying good things. Can you imagine what a power God has given you? Without spending a single pie, you can comfort others, only by saying good things. If you say a mantra, you’ll comfort them more in a subtle way. If you instill love of God within them, it is even greater. And the joy of that is so much because the Spirit is joy. The more you open it out, the more light comes in, more it works out. So give up that fear which is placed within you in your experiences. Now, this is a new experience of a new life, where your energy comes from the Spirit, which is love. In one word it is love. And in three words, it is truth, it is attention and it is joy. All put together it is love. When you mix them up, it becomes love. And that is what you have – it’s the great power of love. Through your attention, you love others. Even attention is sufficient, to be attentive! See, I needed a handkerchief, all right. That’s true. I needed a handkerchief. I forgot. I mean, usually I forget all these things. Then they felt the need, “Mother needs just a handkerchief.” They brought the handkerchief to Me. Is very simple action, you know, but the attention is on Me. With little things like handkerchief you can comfort people. For a Sahaja Yogi, even to give a handkerchief, itself is so vibrated, itself is.
To win over other people is also this way: to be kind to them, to give them. But to give them realization is the highest thing. Now, when you become subtler and subtler, you will see that you will not have sympathies with people who are afflicted, not sympathies, but you will have love for them. There is a big difference between sympathy and love. When you have sympathy means what? You share pathos. Pathos. If you want to share pathos, share. Very good idea is to share pathos. But if you want to share joy, you will not have sympathy, you’ll have love. You want to share your joy of your Spirit with another person, so you may talk to that person in a way that may not look so much pleasing. And falling at his feet, and – you see, this is the work of politicians or business people, not yours. You are not seeking any business out of them; you want them to come to realization. So, you have to say things which are wrong very firmly. With a real firm hand you have to say, “This is absolutely wrong, absurd.” You have to convince on that point. On that, if you go on saying like this, like that, it will never go into their heads because they are bhoots and you have to hit them hard. That is also love.
So, love is the strongest thing and the sweetest thing. Is such a beautiful combination and the one who has the wisdom, that subtler wisdom, can only achieve it. Now again the mind will work, “How to do it?” So, I think all of you should put this word “how” into the sea. There is another very good word in English language which you should use: “Why not?” That’s the way you can assure yourself, ascertain yourself, work it out that way into complete placing of God. You have to just pass those blessings to others, that’s all. Nothing more is to be done, just pass that light to others. For that, what you need is a man who has accepted love as his career, a man who worships love, a person who thinks love is above all.
So today, to save the Surya from grahana, we extend our love to Him and ask Him to create love in the hearts of people who worship Him. Those who worship Surya, must know that Christ resides in that center, who was nothing but love. All His life He loved. He sacrificed Himself because He loved you so much that He wanted you all to get into the kingdom of God. He sacrificed Himself at the altar of God’s forbidden territories. He made it possible for you to go there by sucking your ego and superego. He is the messenger of love who was born on the Surya. So, to do the greatest justice to Surya is to decide today that you will take up love as your worshipping, as your Puja.
May God bless you all!
Any questions? Yes.
Q: What about the Australians, Mother? You said the Americans… (Inaudible.) (Laughter.)
Shri Mataji: They are rather safe people, but they have to be deeper. They still are under a shock, I would say that they think that they are away from the whole world, separated, and they have to get into deeper ways of life. They are loving people compared to other countries, no doubt, but one has to go deep down, deep down. You have to be very deep, very deep. You should know that Australia was once placed between Africa and India. I am going to Perth, the African side and then to Indian side which is Sydney and all these places. But you must not be satisfied with all the Western culture you have imbibed, the Western things you have, you are not in the West, you are in the East. Because you are not on the West, if you try to follow them, it’s just mimicry, it’s very superficial. So, not the Sahaja Yogis I am saying, but otherwise, the people, Australians are very superficial people. They drink much more than the Scotland people drink, I mean in every way, they are very, very… too much, I would say, and that’s how they are rough.
So they have to get to the subtler side by developing deeper understanding into the aesthetics of life, into the, you can say, the beauties of life, the beauties of language, all right? This is how if they go about, it would be a wonderful place. English are very developed that way. They have lots of beauties, understanding of beauties, this thing, that thing. But they have become, sort of, they think they are the wisest of all, they are stupid. And they think they are the wisest, you see. Australians, on the whole do not think they are the wisest, but they should know they can become the wisest. Because you live on superficial level, you see you think that everything should be tackled on superficial level, that’s not the point. You can be the wisest. As English could be, you could be, anybody could be. And as it is the Mooladhara, you should be the first to become the wisest. Maybe that the message of Sahaja Yoga should start more from Australia. So, go deep into yourself. Depth must be developed.
They are still very fond of the sea and the sun, this they will do all their lives. There’s no need to worry about anything like that, it’s nothing important. The sea is within you, the sun is within you, the Atma is within you, everything is within you. Try to enjoy within. Give up the idea of going to the nature for it or anywhere, it’s within yourself, it’s all within. That is what I mean that if you look at things superficially, you take it from other people. Now the craze of going out is finished in England, practically people don’t move out that way. Or they don’t go to the sea also to ‘that’ extent. But, still in Australia, you have to learn all that. Instead of learning the hard way, it’s better to do it in a shorter way, is to become deeper and deeper. Cut down your activities, become deeper, meditate more than going to the sea. Sea visits are bit too much I think, also the sun bathing is also too much, is all very superficial. They all have liver problems. You shouldn’t go to the sun anymore, you should actually shut all your houses and sit down inside and meditate. What a problem we have of liver.
So, do not treat any question superficially because God has given you, basically you are made of wisdom. You know, the whole soil has wisdom in it. But where is it, do you find it anywhere in Australia? It’s hard to find wise people, isn’t it? Sahaja Yogis can’t talk to other Australians, poor things. The reason is, you are following other people who are not all right. Follow yourself only. Go deep down, is wisdom there, lot of wisdom. Find out yourself. Because you are wisdom, you will give wisdom to the whole world. It’s all like that, you know, everywhere upside-down conditions. In Australia, it should be wisdom personified; they are the most unwise people. They will always support the wrong type of people in their diplomacy. I mean all sorts of unwise things they do. Why? Because they have not gone to their own depths of finding out that they are wisdom. Like Maharashtrians have got Kundalini, they are sleeping. They are busy with this movement of going to this temple, for one month they will walk down to that temple and worship Shri Krishna there. They don’t want to see. And to add up to it, they take lot of tobacco in different ways. You see, even they use – what you call the (Hindi or Marathi) – manjan, a kind of a powder made out of tobacco to rub their teeth, can you believe it? I mean teeth, which is Shri Krishna’s place. They rub it with this finger nicely and go to worship Shri Krishna there in the temple, absurd people. They’ll take a little bit of this tobacco, to make it stronger, mix it up with a kind of a chuna, what you call, a calcium carbonate, you see, kind of a thing and put it here near these gums which is also Shri Krishna and go on singing for one month, not eat any food, do anything and go there and get their heads broken by these horrible Brahmins there. And this is Kundalini’s place, just imagine.
Same in Europe which is the liver, which is the Nabhi. And they are the people who drink and eat. They consume more food than anybody else in the whole world can consume. You go to Spain, you are amazed, they can devour everyone. (Laughter.) Then Americans, they also eat a lot. But Americans are, as I told you, they have no self-respect. No self- respect. They’ll give you five rupees and tell you hundred times, we have given you five rupees, five rupees, it is horrible. Those who do not have self-respect cannot respect another person. And they themselves can be parasitic, very parasitic, extremely parasitic people.
There was an organization which wrote to Gavin, you see. He was so angry with them, that they said, “Mother is such a rich lady, why shouldn’t She pay for Her travel to America and also pay for their halls? We’ll give Her food.” So Gavin got very angry. I said, “No, tell them also, ‘I’ll pay for My food and yours also. And also get some nice presents for you.’ It’s all right, I mean.” And they asked Me that – I went to a church – and they said, “No, no we have to give You some money after all.” I said, “Why?” They said, “It is a custom to have a collection.” I said, “No, please don’t have.” They had a collection, it was I think three dollars and two – what is next to dollar? (Yogis: cents) – two cents, three dollar-two cents they collected. I mean, no self-respect of any kind, you know? They think whatever they do is all right, so ego-oriented, horrible. Always support wrong nations, always support wrong policies. Like they’ll support Argentina, Chileans who are horribly oppressive people. They have killed thousands and thousands of their civilians, simple people, and just they are autocrats. All the Germans have reached there and the Germans are teaching them the fascism. The fascism is going to grow in these countries and take over these so-called peanut people. But they will support them and not Cuba, because it is communism. All right, communism is bad, democracy is good. But what are you doing as democrats? You are supporting autocrats, always support wrong things. Made a mess in Vietnam, made a mess there, everywhere. They don’t know how to witness things properly. But they had Abraham Lincoln, so for that you have to excuse the whole country. But you can’t live with one Abraham Lincoln!
These days Indians are horrible. I mean, you can kill somebody here and can pay some money and get out of it. This is what it is. The politicians put money when they want to have elections, so all wasters, all useless people are supported by business people here. The business people give money, the politicians fight elections and the whole is under the control of few business people who are miserly, horrible, absolutely useless, self-indulgent people. And these politicians take over, they are wasters, briefless lawyers, wasters, useless people who have no brains, they become ministers. It’s such a mess, everything for money. Anybody who is intelligent, cannot have much money, is a fact. It doesn’t go hand in hand. A person who is a worshipper of Saraswati doesn’t get so much Lakshmi. Always, you will find, you talk to a businessman, immediately you know, something is little loose. (Laughter.) That’s true with Americans also, little loose. And if you talk to an intellectual, you find something very tight. (Laughter.) This is the problem. And because of this, the money-oriented people in this country are stupid people. So you have to play into the hands of stupid people.
Now, this is the country where the Yogeshwara lived. Great saints lived, they didn’t care for all the styles and all that. What is the need for Indians to have all these styles? They should live well, they should be clean, neat, they should not be insipid, because Lakshmi stays here. But the way they are becoming modern, you see, wearing nylons and having stainless steel in the house. For them, when I told them that I am going to make huts for your ashram, they were little bit recoiling. (Laughter.) They are not going to have cements, I know Australians hate cement. We are not going to have cement, that’s one thing I am sure of. We can have stones, but no cements. You see, our ashram is going to be an ideal for everyone. It cannot be like any other. So don’t try to give Me examples of other ashrams. I am not going to take any hints from anyone. We are going to live in beautiful huts, very comfortably under the protection of Mother’s love.
So, any other questions? From Australians, I had to drag in everybody, because I don’t want anybody to feel hurt. (Laughter.) Never scold one person, scold at least ten then it’s all right. (Laughter.) I am not going to say anything to him. Now what is it, what is the other question?
Q: What to do with France, Mother?
Shri Mataji : Eh? What’s the…
Shri Mataji: What is France? I have already told you, France is a drunkard. And all the drunkards have no values left in them. They have no values about morality, no values at all. I mean, they are drunkards you see, there is no chetana, they are not aware, they are not human beings, they are drunk. That’s what they are. They are drunkards and they are supposed to be the Nabhi, the liver. Imagine, liver being drunk, horrible. But you don’t run away from France, all right? I know why he asked this question, they all want to run away. (Laughter.) If you are a real French, you have to look after French people; it’s your duty, you are duty-bound. If you are a Brahmin, you have to correct all the Brahmins, if you are Maratha, you have to correct all the Marathas. If you are really that, if I am an Indian, I have to correct Indians. I have to correct them; I have to bring them to the right path. Or should I also help them to go to hell? We have to look after them; they are your own people. To pull them out, even if you have one little bit of a sari in your hand, you can pull out the whole sari. Keep your grip there. That is wisdom. Nobody has to get out from anywhere; you settle down everywhere, I have settled you down for some purposes. Don’t have to shift; there is no need to shift. Nobody has to shift.
Q: Mother, would You tell us Your secrets? You have been to the States, to Europe, to India, to Australia. What about South America, Africa, China? What it is about?
Shri Mataji: You see, I would suggest that all these countries are their part and parcel. But what? As it is, we have many centers in our body, isn’t it? Not only seven. But we have to concentrate on first of all the seven major ones. So let us concentrate on these seven because we can operate also there, those we have already got, you see? Once you start working in those countries, I will talk about that also. Because at their back, I shouldn’t say anything. When they will be here, I’ll tell you all about them. Africa is, God save them. I don’t know. As it is they were very good, but you people went and put your ideas into their heads. So, they are lost cases, absolutely lost cases. I don’t know. They have such organized religions and for primitive people, if you give them any organized religion! Like Indian Christians are, they are one of the worst people we can think of; the Jews, Indian Jews, Indian Muslims, they are extremely fanatic, I mean extremely fanatic. Even you all Christians become Sahaja Yogis, the Indian Christians will not. For them, the dog of the missionary is also to be worshipped, yes, this is the case. That’s why I took My birth in that community. So this is what is. You have gone and converted them into Christianity. And there are, others are Muslims. They are very fanatic you see. A new Muslim eats lot of onions they say, because Indians don’t eat so much onions you see, so he eats more onions to prove that he is a good Muslim. That’s what it is. And you have harmed them very much by giving them Christianity, so called. I hope they will realize that things will work out. We are working through Algeria; Algeria is taking shape, but it’s a autocratic country, all sorts of things are there. Let’s see, we have to depend on Sahaja Yoga and Sahaja Yogis. Sahaja Yogis more than anything. All right?
May God bless you!
Q. (A Yogini in Hindi) What is anadi and anahada? I can see colors.
Shri Mataji: Yes. Sit down.
I will say in Hindi? She has asked a nice question is that, “What is anadi and anahada?” Anahada is a sound that you hear; and she sees some colors.
(Shri Mataji replies in Hindi: When you become the Spirit, then nothing should be visible to you. You become that. When you come inside this, then nothing outside will be visible to you. The seeing of colors, when there is a movement to the right side of the Agnya, then you see start seeing the colors. The hearing of the sound or anahada, that is talked about, this is also to be understood. The hearing of anahad does not happen through these ears [external ears]. When the ears inside us open, the sound of that is like the sound of sweet music. And that which is heard by external ears is not anahad, it means that there is a problem of some kind. What this means is that either you have done lot of worship, for example, like chanting of the Gayatri mantra, then you will hear that sound, because by chanting of the Gayatri mantra, your movement is to the right side. Movement to the right side generates heat in you. Because of this heat, your nerves start getting dry. And when the nerves of the ear and nose become dry, because of this drying, these types of sounds start coming. That is entirely physical, and there is no joy in it. But when anahad is heard internally, then in a way, it is not heard, but it is felt. For all things the rhythm manifests itself. It is not heard. Because of that a type of peace is felt within, a type of rhythm is felt within. Like when you hear some music, you start walking with a kind of a rhythm. In the same way, when the music inside starts, then it is not visible to you, but it actually happens in you. The rhythm starts manifesting in your talking and speaking, sweetness manifests. This is the difference. [NOT CLEAR]. Colors also should not be visible. Nothing should be visible. Understood? It has to be corrected. It will happen – I will tell you, it is because of the Agnya chakra – it will happen by correcting the Agnya chakra.)
Her question I have answered… (Yogini continues and Shri Mataji replies briefly in Hindi.)
She asked Me a question, that she said that you hear anahat noises. She hears noises in her ears, and noses and all that, and she sees colors and then she said, “What is it? Is it meaning Shraddha [true] anahata one has to hear?
Now the anahata you really hear after Realization. Actually, that the whole system is built in with a rhythm. You talk in a rhythm, you walk in a rhythm. In everything is very rhythmic, rhythmic with the rhythm of Shiva. Your behavior is such, your everything is such that people feel that as if the person is hearing some music. You live with that. Supposing you are listening to some good music, you see. You see how your mind moves, you see, go into that movement. Sometimes it suddenly becomes quiet and [you] start feeling that. It’s not heard by these ears but by the internal ears, we can say, by the subtler ears which act in your behavior, in your temperament, in everything. But this sound actually you can feel the “lub-dub” into everything breathing, everything pulsating. You see that, but not with these eyes. You just feel that pulsation within you and that person passing through. When you are at My feet, you see – I would also suggest it – I suddenly feel that, then I know it’s done [Realization]. But Mine is so much one, I mean when I say, “Ha, you get your Realization”, the vibrations I feel and everything in one shot. You see, I don’t have to think, rationalize, nothing. It is so spontaneous. In the same it’s a reflex action you can say; completely is a reflex action.
But so, hear anything – how do you hear all these things is that if you do right side action. Say, for example you say Gayatri mantra, is right sided. You do any right action, you get developed, the right-side heat is developed, everything gets dried out. There’s no humidity left. It’s dried out. Then with the dry skin and dry things you develop all these things, like the dry nerves, you see. They are dry. There’s no humidity. And then you start hearing all these things. But they are very disturbing and you feel very unhappy with it. It’s not musical.
With Agnya chakra, the combination of Agnya and Vishuddhi – that works it out and you should learn how to do it. With Agnya and Vishuddhi it can be cured and corrected.
Actually, people who were realized souls, great realized souls, didn’t know that people will misunderstand this for that. Even a barking of a dog one can say, “I hear anahat.” What can you do about it? Subtle things you do not really hear with these organs or with eyes you don’t see, nothing. They act. As you have seen, your hand takes the Kundalini up. You don’t see anything there, do you? It acts – ‘Kalyan’ means that is subtle; means it exists, it acts but you don’t see. That’s what it is subtle. If we can see, it is not, it is gross. Is it not? I mean, it’s so simple to Me. Whatever is subtle you don’t see. ‘Sukshma’ means you don’t see that thing, isn’t it? You don’t hear it. If you see something, it’s not subtle, finished.
Any other question? If you stop one word, “how”, ninety percent questions will drop out.
[Sahaja Yogi asking in Hindi or Marathi about the meaning of “Triguna”. Mother corrects it (using the same language) to “Triguna Atma” – meaning Tamas-Rajas-Sattva Gunas where left side is “Tamas”, right side is “Rajas” and center is “Sattva”, and “Trigunatmika” is centered in a balanced position.]
Q. (Sahaja Yogi in Hindi or Marathi): How long does the effect of bandhan last?
Shri Mataji: He asked Me a question, “When we put a “bandhan” how long it will last?” I said, “Depends on your intensity. I never put any bandhan to Myself.” (Laughter.) It is your intensity. After sometime, you don’t need any bandhan. Others will have to put bandhan when you go there. (Laughter.)
[Mother speaks in Hindi or Marathi about intensity].
Q. (Sahaja Yogi in Hindi or Marathi): Where is the Hamsa Chakra?
Shri Mataji: Hamsa. This is the Hamsa chakra. It’s a very, very material thing, I think, this chakra, it’s very material and it has to be worked on material level only. Is the center here where most of the left and right side in a way cross on a material level here, material level again I say, on a material level they cross over here. And when it gets spoiled, you get troubles like sinus and troubles like colds and coughs and all that. So, I myself have tried to get this into trouble and to find out what I should do, because if I live as I am, I will never be able to help you. So, I said, “I better get sick Myself to see what happens.”
Actually, what happens with this center being catching, same thing, the drying up of the nose of the humidity because of central heating is there. For Indians, say Maharashtrians especially take a kadak bath, isn’t it – means a very hot water; they use tremendously hot water to take their bath. For them it is very relaxing, which is an absolutely wrong idea. Normally a cold bath is the best. If not possible, take a tepid, can take little hot and then tepid, absolutely tepid water. That will solve one of the problems that you do not expose yourself to too much cold or heat. The temperature is kept the same as the room temperature. Because you take a very hot bath and then you come out.
In London people have died, Indians have died out of their lung cancer because they can’t get out of their habit of it, bad habit of taking bath in the morning. I call it bad habit for Indians, not for English, eh? (Laughter) Because they’ll take their bath and immediately go to work. And so many Indians I have seen they have got lung cancer. They died there. And if you ask them, “Why?” “We don’t feel all right.” Then take your bath at four o ‘clock in the morning, stay in the house, get used to the climate and then go. Or take your bath in the night.
All extreme behaviors from left to right create the problems of Hamsa.
Like they’ll take, say, a fruit. I mean, we knew all these things but now we are modern, you see, we have forgotten. Like you eat a banana in India, after that you should not take water. Old people know. The young are becoming see jeans-oriented. So, the whole head has gone into jeans and they will eat banana and take water. Now these are two extremes. Any fruit you take and after that you take water, you will get it. So, you should take water after some carbohydrates. You can take some papad, not fried one. Anything fried you take and that, on top of that you are not to take water. Take, you can take a biscuit or you can have a, what you call, a bread, something like that to dry up; best is chaana. Dry up your throat and then take water.
Heat and cold. Now say take coffee and then take water – is absolutely wrong. Water you should take then gradually heat it up and take coffee last, and then don’t take water till you have taken some carbohydrates. I mean, this is what it is; it’s the heat and the cold. The combination of heat and cold should be understood.
Now what do you do actually is to neglect certain laws of nature. Like in London or anywhere it’s all heated up inside the rooms, too much heated up, and there’s very dry. I mean, we all know that in England that you have to have a humidifier, isn’t it? Must keep some water or something or fill a tub in the bath, and keep it open so that there is humidity in the room. To compensate for all that, one can do is to take some water and sip in the nose, I would say, after brushing your teeth. Sip it, try it, and try to take it out. By putting these fingers, these thumbs in your ears and take it out. By that you’ll clear out your sinuses, you will make it humid. Or for these parts mucus membrane, you can put some oil, or some ghee, is very good. If this water can have little salt, little salt, is a good idea. But that should not be very cold, should not be very hot, should be tepid.
Tepid food. In India, the custom is to eat very hot food – garam garam khao, garam garam khao. I mean, we are so garam. (Laughter) They are really garam people. I don’t know why. The women – the man will sit on the thing and the woman must cook at that time garam garam, and the rotis must be made at that time and the phulkas must be brought garam garam and the husband must eat garam garam and before going to office or work he should get garam garam temperament also. (Laughter) Even then they’ll leave this, leave, “This is not hot, we’ll bring hot for you” and burning absolutely, you see, burning tongues, they are. There is no need to eat such a garam garam business.
On the contrary, in England they eat so much of cold foods that I am amazed. I mean ice, the amount of ice the Western people eat, we can’t understand. I mean how can − morning ice, every time ice. You have this thing with ice and “on the rocks”, as they call it. (Laughter) So you will be on the rocks. So much of ice they take. God knows why. What is the need to take so much of ice? Indiscriminately they’ll take ice-cream, after ice-cream they’ll take coffee. Or after coffee they’ll take ice-cream. I mean, it’s such a national dish there, ice. Icing, icing, icing – all the time so much of ice. I mean, they have so much of ice outside, why should they have ice inside? (Laughter.) Even we went to the Prime Minister’s place there. They gave us rhubarb ices to eat. Imagine, as sweet dish. And they are very miserly, no doubt, but to this extent! (Laughter.) To give us rhubarb ice to eat, imagine, it was horrid! (Mother speaks in Hindi or Marathi). Mrs. Thatcher, you see, she’s “thatching” up everything! (Laughter.)
So, this is what it is, you see, they eat ice morning till evening. And they don’t know why to eat so much ice. And after eating that ice they will have something hot suddenly, after that. Or before. Before eating the ice, they’ll have hot, that’s the worst of all. So, they take coffee and ice. Imagine. So, this is what it is, that we don’t understand, discriminate between hot and cold. Take tepid food also. Need not eat immediately from the oven sizzling. Sizzling food you should not eat. I don’t know why devilish ideas are coming, to have sizzling. Take a little time. Take some patience. Let your juices flow out to digest it and then eat it. Otherwise you’ll burn your tongue, you’ll burn your palate, you’ll burn everything – except for your teeth which in any case are false! (Laughter.)
So, the best thing is to keep a tepid understanding of food also.
(Mother speaks in Hindi or Marathi).
H.H. Shri Mataji Nirmala Devi