Understanding the Love of God

Caxton Hall, London (England)

1982-05-11 Public Program with Yogi introduction, Caxton Hall, London UK, DP, 90' Chapters: Introduction by Yogi, Talk, Q&ADownload subtitles: EN,TRView subtitles:
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“Understanding the love of God”, Caxton Hall, London (UK), 11 May 1982.

For the last so many lectures we have been saying that you cannot pay for God’s love. It makes me laugh sometimes. Human beings can never understand His love because they live in a very limited sphere. His love is unlimited. His forgiveness is unlimited. Even this word ‘unlimited’ and ‘infinite’ we do not understand because we have not known anything like that. And to say that something is genuine is also like certifying something that is genuine. You don’t need a certificate. Even that human beings don’t understand.

We live with artificiality. We try to find the Truth. Again we accept artificiality as Truth. Again we go on fighting. Then we think, “This is the Truth.” Again that turns out to be something artificial thing or some sort of a mental projection.

All these limited endeavours of human beings and experiences they have made him so conditioned that it is not easy to understand God. He made all this Universe in His compassion and love. He created you as human beings, also, in His compassion and love. He doesn’t need anything. But He loves. And you can’t understand a person who loves beyond any reason, without any reward, just love because for love’s sake. We can’t think of one human being like that who can love only for love’s sake. Only after Realisation, as you grow more and more, you realise that loving is the greatest joy.

And then you cannot think of money in relation to Him. It’s something you say, but I think even to say this, “We don’t need money” or “We don’t take money,” itself is so low level! It’s so much gross because money and all these concepts are your own.

He didn’t make this world to get any fruits out of it. Nothing. He just made it because He loved and He wanted just to express His love. Just to manifest that love He made this world. There’s nothing else expected. And to put the human mind at that level is an impossibility, I find, in the beginning, but gradually they start understanding how forgiving He is, how kind He is, how nice He is.

So the first problem I face in the West always , even in Paris this was what I faced, was that human beings feel guilty. And this guilt is such a big problem in the West, I just don’t understand! Why to feel guilty so much? And that is one of the hurdles of Sahaja Yoga, I have seen, that people start feeling guilty. To such an extent that they don’t believe that they can get Realisation. They think they are sinners, born outright, permanently, branded as ‘sinners’ and [think that] they can never get their Realisation. I mean, just they brand themselves. It’s beyond self-pity also, I would say it’s even self-destructive!

Today, I have taken up the subject of Left Vishuddhi because I felt that I must one day speak on this subject. That this is absolutely not intelligible to God that you are guilty. For what? Guilty for what are you? If you ask yourself you will say, “Oh, we are guilty because we crucified Christ.”  – at the most. That is the maximum guilt a human being can say on his head. “We crucified Christ.” “We tortured all the saints.” All right. But by being guilty what do you get? Do you get Him back? Can you go back and correct that situation? You cannot. But harping upon that, you do get into your sub-conscious mind. You get into a position where you are no more normal to receive the love of God. You recede into a corner of your mind which is darkness, which is ignorance, which is blindness; where you cannot receive that beautiful ray, that eternal flow that’s coming in. You hide  yourself at the back and then you say, “What about the sun? I cannot receive it because I don’t deserve it.”

Behind all this ego-orientation in the West though I wish they were purely egoistical – they are not. All this ego recedes back into that little pouch, what we call ‘the guilt’. You say something to someone. It’s not saying that thing at that stage that, “I’ve said it, all right I’ve said it and I take the responsibility. It’s good.” Not that way. But you come back home, “Oh, I should not have said that!” So you wobble between one kind of action into another kind, from an aggressive to the another one of a receding type. And this wobbling really is very, very troublesome. It can go on too much, the oscillation could be so much that it can make you absolutely frantic, diffident and sometimes useless.

On the contrary, God wants to find human beings who are cheerful people, who are happy people, who are thankful to Him for His blessings. The most unhappy animal in this world is a human being. Can you believe that? Animals don’t know happiness and unhappiness, also a good point is. But the most unhappy human being and the most complicated human being has become so over, you see, self-destructive that a destruction force has built within himself.
Now think of that force that has built you up into a human: how with care and love, without your knowledge, without troubling you. Even when you were born you never knew what was the pain of the birth; your mother took over it. He’s made you a human being so carefully, delicately he’s built you up. For what? What is the fruit of this beautiful flower? Why the flower starts hitting itself? Have you ever heard of anyone like that?

This is the worst disease with which we, in the West, suffer. French, yes, we had at least double the number of people than we have here today, surprisingly, but all of them had the same problem and I think all their psychologists, psychoanalysts, the books, the writers the philosophers, everyone has done to them; they have given you the ideas and everybody accepts them and they curse themselves morning till evening, walking with so many wrinkles on the forehead. When you ask them they will say, “Mother we are very unhappy people.” It’s like asking unhappiness to come and decorate you.

But it has a subtler meaning, of which people are not aware. These are the times when you have to get your Realisation, this mass Realisation has to work out, is all prophesised, and very important times are these. All the stars are acting to help us. The whole Universe is helping them. All the elements are helping us. We are on the stage. But when the actors arrive on the stage they are finished! They can’t act, they can’t do anything, they can’t play their game. They are so involved with their different roles.

And that is why one has to understand the subtler effect of it. Then only you will get rid of this guilt. You are playing into the hands of negative forces, they are not less than any atomic bombs, built within yourself.

Now what is the way it works out, I think people do not realise it. It’s a very subtle method. Let’s see the atomic bomb, hydrogen bomb, what will you do there? They will separate something which should not be separated. We break atom which is not divisible into its divisible parts. So we put a pressure to break them. And when that breaking force, that aggression I would say, is worked out, that becomes another destructive force.

So whatever effort we have put into that multiplies; it’s not the same force. And that we use for our destruction. I mean, this, only human being can do, to create things to destroy himself.

But this force which works within our minds, within ourselves, within our being – where we actually really hate ourselves, sometimes I feel, the way we are destroying ourselves – this force we build within ourselves thanks to many nonsensical writers and conditioners, and people who talk of conditioning really condition you much worse! You should be singing and chirping like a bird. You should be laughing and enjoying life like a flower.

But I find human beings faces, all, looking so very unhappy. What’s the reason? The reason is you are separated from your own being, the being that integrates you. You are completely disintegrated. When you disintegrate a hydrogen atom, you form a very big force [that is] built into it. In the same way, you are disintegrating your being: your physical being on one side, your mental being on another side, your spiritual being on another side. There’s no integrating point. And when you cannot feel that integration you feel guilty, but that guilt is just a symptom of a very big destructive force built-in you.

This is the way we are going to destroy ourselves. No other way. Our destruction is not going to come to us from outside, that can be controlled. It’s going to come from within, within ourselves.

Everything we do now, after disintegration, is further disintegration or further building up that negative force within ourselves. But to integrate it, to make you feel complete integration with all your being, is only possible if you can somehow or other get to that integrating force which is still there and is quite deep.

That’s the last chance I would say now. That has to win. The way the negative forces have set in motion, of which you may not be aware at all, you may not be aware, you don’t know what darkness is there. And to fight it, what one has to do is to bring in that light of the Spirit which integrates. Darkness always disintegrates you. For example there is complete darkness all right, I can’t feel you, I don’t know who you are, where you are sitting, [then] we are all separated. I can’t see you, I don’t know who you people are here. I wouldn’t know where is the window, where is the door. I’ll hold this and say, “This is the Truth.” All disintegrated personality. And disintegrated people always see aberrations, they see different things, different auras, different things.

Now it’s a very vicious circle. You just think of it. It’s a very great vicious circle we have. The vicious circle is that we try to think about it, which is limited. Supposing I have a limited vision [when] there is darkness – what will I feel? You start thinking about it and thinking about it, pondering over it. The more you think about it the worse it becomes. Another way could be people may try to solve this problem, to think that we are disintegrated, is to talk of big things, “We are all brothers and sisters! Let’s form UN council. Let’s do world organisation!” All blind people doing world organisation will end up, at the most, as a labour department, that’s all. With all these institutions working in a big name where are we? Actually when we become aware we don’t need them. We don’t need at all. So this awareness is nothing but is the light of the Spirit within you which is missing. The Spirit is watching you all right. It goes up to a point, it sees your stupidity and your limitedness and it goes up to a very great extent, I should say, where it’s finished. It disappears and a person dies or he gets into trouble, he becomes crazy, mad, whatever you may call him. He develops other diseases like cancer which are caused by another problem here as you know – Ekadesha.

So these forces are built within us, of negativity, when we go to the extremes of negativity. So, in the Kundalini shastra, we can say that the left and right side, when used too much, you build up these forces in the head of eleven Rudras, of the eleven destructive forces. A cancer patient develops it. But even before developing cancer people can develop it. And there are so many things that can create this that, sometimes one would feel, in this vicious circle, that how are you going to patch up the whole society? And there’s only one thing that will save the situation – it’s Self-realisation.

All other things are destroying, are absolutely confusing. But there’s only one thing if you can do, it saves the whole thing. Like putting on the light – finished!

But people don’t understand the importance of Self-realisation, because some people ask me, “What’s the use of getting the cool breeze in the hand?” Now see the big canvas of the whole thing, the whole cosmos, in a jeopardy. See what’s happening to human beings today. And if they are to be saved [there’s] no use being unhappy. Like in France they said, “You cannot Mother, say you are a very happy person.” I said, “Why?” “Because that means you are ignorant of the shocks.” You see? I have to say, “I am very unhappy,” you see. I have to paint some lines here to show that I’m very deeply concerned, worried about the whole world. [Laughing]

But what is the solution have you got? You want me to be like you only? Is that the solution? That if ten people are weeping you also join them weeping? Is that the solution? And the one and only method that we have, which has been already told and prescribed and has been prophesised – nobody seeks it! No one seeks it!

See now, in The Bible: ‘you have to be born again’. ‘Christ is to be born in your heart’. I mean they do it, even before solving the whole drama, they do it, of giving you ‘second birth’, by ‘Christening’ you, so-called [laughing]. Hindus, they believe [that] without yoga there is no sense. “Yoga kshema wahamyam,” Krishna has said all the time that, “You seek yoga. What are you seeking?” All these treatises and all these big books and all these scriptures are aiming at what? Even those who talked, “You must live with dharma, you must live a balanced life.” [was] for what? Why do we do it? What is the destination? And the destination is the Spirit.

And today, the background is so black and so dark that this solution is the end of everything. But do we realise this? On the contrary the vicious circle builds in within us all the time. “Oh, see how the world is miserable! How can I be happy?” “I am so unhappy in life!” I have yet to come across a person before Realisation saying that, “I am a happy person.” Maybe ego-oriented people might say, “I am happy.” meaning, “My ego [is]”. If he goes in a swanky car or something like that he’s very happy, on top of the world! After ten minutes you see him [looking miserable]. And this vicious circle is set in. This ego-oriented circle, or another one, it sets in. Another vicious circle and another vicious circle and another vicious circle, we go on from one to another, moving on the wheels after wheels without realising that, “Where we are going?”

And this vicious circle has to be broken by one faith, by one understanding, that God is forgiveness, God is love. When we feel love for anyone without any lust and greed, then that is God’s love within us. That He is the embodiment of that pure love which just loves, which has given you this beautiful human life and wants to make you more beautiful.

He created all this creation for you and that He wants you to enjoy the bounties of this creation. He wants you to enjoy the citizen of his realm and the Kingdom of his Grace. Do we go to see someone who is highly placed with a morose face? Do we? That day, we’ll specially brush our hair, make our hair into a beautiful thing, make our face nice, dress up well. It looks like we are well, you see. That’s outside. Inside, if you just feel how kind He is, how He has worked out meticulously in this blissful life of a human being. But think how much He has done for you! Instead of that, if you are all the time going to say, “I am very unhappy in life.” I mean, think of someone who does everything for you and you just come back saying, “Oh, I am just a very unhappy person.” What is he going to feel about you? No gratitude! Count your blessings one by one. That’s what one has to do, is to have complete understanding that He is God Almighty, He can do anything that He likes and we are the recipient of His Almighty. He is the Ocean of love and we are the recipient of His love. Let us feel that within ourselves and understand logically with wisdom.

If this sets into your mind, that’s the best conditioning I think human beings can have, what you call in Sanskrit the ‘susanskara’, means the ‘auspicious conditionings’. We don’t have only conditioning and ego, we have a third thing called also ‘good conditioning’. The conditionings that have ruined your chances of enjoyment, let it be brought round. And see for yourself. Logically you can see how much He’s done for you. I mean, none of the animals were that comfortable as you are. They don’t know the idea of comfort, they have never had a car, even chairs to sit down.

It’s easy to say, “Nice to be like animals,” you see. But just go and see the way they live, poor things! No. Even the king of the forest, how he lives, one should go and see. But he’s happy. He’s full of joy. Oh, he has to kill an animal, he’ll kill it and with his dignity eat one or two days – finished. Then he lives for ten days without food. Whenever he feels hungry he goes [hunting]. He’s not bothered. He doesn’t feel guilty for killing anybody: he’s hungry, he has to eat, he eats – finished! But human beings, as they are, they will eat someone without the need and then feel guilty. This is the problem.

He has made you with his own image. He’s done everything beautifully. After Realisation, you start understanding yourself and enjoying yourself as you enjoy others. The fragrance of others you start enjoying.

Self-realisation is the only way you can get the light in – enlightenment. Everybody talks of enlightenment, enlightenment. Enlightenment means, for some people, is that you start jumping. Is it enlightenment to be abnormal like that? Or take out your clothes? I mean just think of it. How does it go into your brains, I just can’t understand, that doing all these nonsensical things, how can there be enlightenment? Or taking to alcohols, drinking or drugs or anything, how can it give you enlightenment? Has it given to anyone so far? It might be some sort of a funny, strange experience you might get, but not enlightenment. In enlightenment you get integrated, you see your way through, you know where you are standing and how you are moving in relationship to others.

So the illogical method, I would say, ‘unwise method’, the way we deal with life becomes a kind of a possession. And we are possessed by this negative force which is eating us out. And we go on living with that idea, enjoying that idea that we are miserable people, we are unhappy, we are helpless. I mean, I have seen people sitting on the streets and discussing, “Oh, thank God there’s going to be eight stars coming in and we’ll be all destroyed”. I mean, just imagine!

But we have to think about The One who has created us. Is he waiting for your destruction? Will he be happy with that? How much are we cooperating with Him? With what care, love, He has created us? With what hopes, whatever it is. What does He want to do for us, that we are sitting down and feeling guilty? And now I have to tell openly that it has come to you also through other vehicles apart from the psychologists, psychoanalysts. Psychoanalysts: the other day we had a girl, she came to see me. She’s French. Her English was wonderful, and she said, “Horrible psychologists! They make me mad!” I said, “Why?” “They said, ‘I have bad relationship with my mother, bad relationship with my father, bad relationship with every third person.’ I don’t have! I have absolutely pure relationship. They try to put that idea into my head that there’s something abnormal, pathological about me which I am not! And they are making my brother’s relationship also funny by telling him that I have bad relations with him!” This is it.

So, they hit at the point of pure love, disintegrate you. You can’t have good relationship with your own mother, with your own father, with your own sister, with your own brother, and nobody. Because you cannot love except for you are sex-points. You have just relationship of sex! Even animals have better relationship than we have if you have to accept the psychologists! And they take money to suggest all these nonsensical ideas into your head! There are some here sitting. I will face them later on. This is how they’re putting ideas, into your heads that, “You are a person who has no purity,” and that, “You are a sinner.” “You are a damned person and any person you look upon, you have only sex relationships, nothing else.” I mean, are we sex-points? With all this evolution, God has made us into a sex-point: that’s what we have done to ourselves, reduced ourselves to that point only. He has created you in your own glory and your own dignity. He has not created you to be only wasted like this.

Then the second thing that disintegrates us very much more is the idea that, we are here, you see, to live in a gross way somehow, fighting political, economic, all this nonsensical progress that we are making. And everything is explained, all destructive forces are explained in the name of political or economic growth. I don’t know if it is ‘growth’ or whatever it is, but definitely it is not love, take it from me. It is not love. That’s why economics of God is to be understood. Politics of God is to be understood. And for human beings to understand it they must have Self-realisation.

In His economics generosity is the key-note. He enjoys his generosity. Material things are to express your generosity, isn’t it? What are they for? The most enjoyable thing is to give, and when you give you will see your economic problems will be solved completely. Because you are here to become free, no problems! The problems are because you want to grab. And once you start giving, you get it as much as you want because, if there is no outlet, there’s no joy, there’s no happiness, there’s no relief from the material domination on you. But giving is the way you can get rid of that material domination on your head, that you give away. Give away everything that you have and you will be surprised how it flows to you.

Now when I say, “It is fantastic the way it acts! Fantastic the way it acts,” Somehow, it’s easy to say, “It’s Mother is saying something which is something miraculous.” But what do you think of Moses crossing the sea? You mean it was miraculous or it was a false story or what do you think of it? It was absolutely true that he did cross the sea. With the help of God, he could do it. What about Christ walking on the water? He did because by His nature He did it. What about all the miracles that were done by these incarnations? Is absolutely true. I am here to prove all of them. But you must get your Realisation. Not because that I cannot prove it. You must enter into that realm of awareness. Otherwise, they cannot prove it. It’s true.

The other day, somebody was saying that Rama is a fiction and I said, “How do you say that?” He said, “Because it looks like a fiction.” I said, “To human mind they cannot understand God, who has millions and millions of hands and eyes to work out His plan”. So naturally Rama is a fiction. Krishna is a fiction. Everybody’s a fiction! Because we ourselves are fictitious, I think! It’s not that it is a fiction, but we are incapable of grasping that is miraculous, which is divine. And that’s why we just call it, “Oh!” No. Everything is true, believe me everything is true.
Now Rama’s case, let’s take it. Simple to be like Rama, all right? “Rama is a fiction.” Many of our Indians are very anglicised now, very westernised, you see. So, they want to say, “We don’t believe in all this fiction!” So they’re becoming English. For them, to become English is the last epitome, the last word. So we don’t believe in Rama, nothing, you see“. All right, it’s all our old style of thinking. But He exists and He is within us! It can be proved by your Kundalini awakening. The person who has got asthma, who suffers from asthma, catches on the Right Heart. You have to take the name of Rama to cure him. Nothing else can cure him. It’s simple. The Kundalini stops here (at Agnya).

Many people don’t believe in Christ. “We don’t believe in Christ”. But you don’t believe in Christ, but under what circumstances? Why? Why don’t you believe in Christ? “Because, you see, we don’t think He existed. How could He be possible?” We don’t believe in Moses, we don’t believe in Christ, we don’t believe in anyone. All right. Do you believe in yourself? Perhaps that is missing. Because the Self is not there. If you know your Self, you should believe in them. Because when Kundalini rises, at this point (Agnya), you will be amazed, at this point, whether you believe in Christ or not, at this point, at the Agnya Chakra where you see the crossing of it, you have to say Lord’s Prayer. You have to take the name of Christ. Otherwise, Kundalini doesn’t rise. Now, most of the people who are here, who are Realised, know this. It has been proved to them.

In the Nabhi, in this Void, if it is hanging, we have to take the name of Moses. Whether you are a Jew or not or a hater of Jews or whatever you may be, you have to take the name of Moses. The whole movement of the Kundalini is to integrate all the truths which are treated as miraculous, some people think it’s falsehood, it’s good for nothing, useless. All these things are proved by the movement of the Kundalini in your central path. And the greatest and greatest thing that is proved is that God exists, not only exists but He is active, that He does everything for us, that it is He who is the truth and it’s his power, Brahma, is the truth, the rest is all falsehood and nonsense. It works in all details too, in small details also.

Now Sahaja Yogis have seen the miracle of Sahaja Yoga, they cannot explain it. You cannot explain also. When you become Realised, you are surprised how you are helped, how you meet people, how you get to things, how things work out. And how it works out so smoothly you just can’t imagine! Even to the smallest detail it can work out, beautifully. But you have to establish yourself in the Kingdom of God. Not with these fanatical ideas, like you go to the Catholic church and they say, “Now you must confess”. I don’t know from where did they get this idea! I don’t think Christ would have ever said that, “You’d better go and confess to these priests,” who are not even Realised-souls! What are they going to do by confession?

And then the answer came to me from a priest. I asked him, he’s a nice man, he’s a Realised-soul now and he’s working for Sahaja Yoga. But he told me, “The reason in the Bible it is written is that, ‘Whatever is corrected on this earth will be corrected in the heaven’.” That’s why you’d better correct it by telling to the priest! Now by any logical means do you think this priest can correct you by telling them anything? Whatever is to be corrected on this earth is your Kundalini and your chakras. If the language of Bible has been, especially the Old Testament, has been extremely guarded, it was a security measure. Like, the Tree of Life is nothing but the Kundalini which is enlightened. Absolutely, it is that, it looks like that, like a tree.

The other day they were having a programme, I think today only. my children showed me, “Look, the Kundalini.” I went and saw and they were describing about Moses, something perhaps, and this was the Tree of Life they said. And my children, grandchildren, said, “See it’s the Kundalini!” The language they used, may be for security measures, may be, but not the word. If it is now changed by human beings, it’s false. Human beings can change words, that’s a different point.
But you can see it, in Sahaja Yoga you can see what is changed, what is wrong, which is falsehood. You can see all these things. So, to disintegrate you, these things are again created in the name of religion so-called.

I mean these people are here for God or for making you feel guilty? Like, say, Jews think that Christ was not a saviour. If they are still waiting for two hundred years it’s not true. He’s the One. Without Him you cannot raise the Kundalini. One should understand that He’s the Mahavishnu described [in Indian puranas]. But if I say something that doesn’t mean that you should believe me, not at all. But you should see for yourself, because if you are interested in the emancipation of the whole world, you should not get stuck on to one, stuck on to one thing and say, “This is the truth and this is the truth”. No. See for yourself what is the truth and you will be amazed that they are all one like Christ has said, “Those who are not against me are people who are with me.”

Moses and Christ are one, which can be proved. Same in other religions. So religion is another way to disintegrate you. You hate each other. Fundamentalists fighting, for God! “Fundamental difference, you know!” Can you imagine! What is the fundamental of these religions? It’s their Spirit, isn’t it? Is it a difference between the Spirit of one and another? Fundamentals are that God is one. He has created us. And what are you fighting about? “Fundamental difference, you know. Fundamental difference!” When there exists no difference at all!
So we have psychologists, we have religious leaders teaching us how to fight and hate God and your fellow beings in the name of God.
This is another disintegration that sets into us. So, you people, who are thinking [people] should understand that anything that creates such limitations within us, any kind of fanaticism is dangerous not only to you but to the whole society and if you support it even this much, you are supporting that destruction.

With Sahaja Yoga we can establish that, anybody who is a fanatic has problems and suffers from many diseases [from] which normal people don’t.

Then there are another type of a people who say that, “All right. We don’t believe in God because how can God create this fanaticism?” How can you blame God for fanaticism? I just can’t understand. He never created it. Actually, He never created any difference between you people, just a variety, just to make it beautiful, that’s all. See, He didn’t create England separately, this separately to that extent, the way you think. But He created them because they are different organs in the body of God.

Do we take out an eye and say, “This is an eye so I do not have anything to do [with it].”? Can we? It’s like that! It’s simple like that. It’s so simple. The truth is so simple and so starkly lit before you: that we are doing all these things, fighting, quarrelling, all the time within ourselves and without.

Now, for that Self-realisation, God has placed this wonderful thing, Kundalini, within us, very beautifully, in the best possible position. It could not be better anywhere. To create this happening within us, in our awareness, the Kundalini has to rise and give us Realisation.

Now people ask questions to God also, can be. They can say, “Why did He do it? Why didn’t He make us wise to begin with?” There are many like that! “He should have just made us wise. Just from monkeys dipped into some wisdom powder and pushed us out as wise people living in the Kingdom of God!” “Why didn’t He do it in our evolution? Why did He make us so stupid?”
One can say to God you see, “Why did You create these problems?” talking to God. But who are we to ask Him questions? He does what He likes. But, there’s a reason. If you have to enter into that complete freedom, you must know how to be free. If you are just abandoned people, you have no sense of freedom, you don’t know how to be choosy about the good and the bad and you do not understand the value of your own wisdom. And if you are put in charge – imagine some mad people put in charge your government, what will happen to you? So you have to grow up to that point to feel your freedom that, in your freedom you are righteous. In that freedom, you are kind. In that freedom you are absolutely balanced.
And when that happens to you, then only the higher freedom is given to you because that’s completely free. And once that higher freedom comes into you then you can feel the responsibility, the responsibility to be responsible for your freedom.

To put this beautiful responsibility onto you, you have to know how to use your freedom, this is only [a] transition which has lead all of us into this feeling ‘guilty business’ or this aggression. Can you imagine? You could have waited for a while without feeling so sick. I mean, sometimes I feel the people are going for a funeral, the way they look miserable. The rest are busy creating such people.

So, there are only two types of people, if one sees: some who are being victims and another who are victimizing.

So, to have the balance in the centre, to stand in the centre, God has created this little tide where you have to just learn how to weigh your freedom. He gave you freedom to know. And this freedom is the only thing that has created all the problems you face. Not God, God has not created any problems for you. No. He wanted to make a very smooth ascent. He’s made your machines so beautifully.
Despite all this, you do get your Realisation, no doubt. But because of habits, you may run down again to it; again you may have an ascent, again go down. It happens with some people, doesn’t matter. But if you are steady it is going to work out. It has to work out. If God has to save his creation, He has to do it! Only thing: how many are going to cooperate and take advantage of his compassion is to be seen. That is the most important thing: how many are going to be wise to see to their own advantage and to their own ascent. It’s the only choice.
May God bless you.

If you have any questions, you may ask me. And then I will do the Realisation.
Sahaja Yogi: Mother, how the negative force is created?
Shri Mataji: What’s it?
Sahaja Yogi: Mother, how this negative force is created to begin with?
Shri Mataji: What is he saying?
Another Sahaja Yogi: How the negative force is created, to begin with?
Shri Mataji: By the ‘great’ human beings.
Who has created atom bomb? Same type. From the very beginning, they started creating these negative forces. All kinds. In seeking, as I told you, in seeking, they set in this vicious circle which started creating. And the, you see, this mistake is small. What is the mistake in separating a hydrogen atom? Isn’t it? Just they did it for fun sake, maybe. I don’t know why they did it. But now, that will become like a devil sitting on everybody’s head, in everybody. Thank God only, whatever they create frightens them. Thank God. So they are not going to use it. But who has created that? Human beings! In ignorance, they have done it. As a Mother, I have to say that. I cannot say that it was deliberate. It’s a dangerous situation there.

It’s obvious. In your lifetime, people have created atom bomb, what was the need? I mean, for a stranger like me, I don’t understand what is the need to create an atom bomb. What is the need? Who are they to create this kind of a democracy and this kind of communism and this kind of all nonsensical institutions which just make people fight?

Any other question please? And you can’t blame God for that. At least, God didn’t tell you to make atom bomb.

Any other question please?
Sahaja Yogi: I have got one.
Shri Mataji: Yes.
Sahaja Yogi: Why do you think people are all the time so afraid of losing things, of losing their ego, of losing their relatives or -but not losing but – losing what they have built up in themselves, their identity that they think they are, they are afraid of losing it.
Shri Mataji: Why are they afraid?
Sahaja Yogi: Yes.
Shri Mataji: They have been cooked up like that, you know. They are told like that, they are conditioned like that. What can they do? You see that all the time, if somebody tells you that you are going to lose, “It’s very precious, very precious”. You see, you’ll hold on to it.
But one must know in growth, in life, when a flower becomes a fruit, it loses flower for fruit to come, to grow into new. When an egg breaks, its shell falls off, and the bird comes out. It’s not losing, it’s growth.
You have been frightened, what can you do? From the very beginning. What is there to lose if you are not holding anything? [Laughter] All right? What is there to lose? You just tell me. If you’re not holding onto something then, if there is no catch on anything, what are you going to lose? You are just enjoying and giving.

What do we take from here? When we go the hands are like this, when we come our hands are like this. Our hands are open when we go, we can’t take anything, we confess it. Even ego we leave here. Everything we leave here. [Laughter]
All myths! So many myths have been created and man is living with the mythical ideas. I tell you he is living, he’s compromising with the myths. All the time, he doesn’t accept a myth then they say, “He’s not a sane person”. All sorts of [myths], and there are many, many sets here. People start copying others, you see, blindly. It’s all you see, to an ignorant person like me, it’s something I just don’t understand; what is the need?
But I am talking of the real world where you have to enter into, it is reality. And do you know? Reality is love. It is love. But not the way human beings understand love. But love which flows, which thinks, which cooperates and generates the feeling of joy. It’s a very different world where we have to enter into. And what will you lose? What have you got? What you have that is lost, that’s your Spirit. And what you don’t have you are holding on to it. There’s nothing to be lost, it’s very true: they are so frightened you don’t know. Very frightened.

They are made like that, what can you do? But they lose everything to a person who knows how to handle the situation in the real sense. You can just become like a cabbage with some people. Really, they can make you a cabbage. In the name of God, in the name of enlightenment they can. Yes, they can harm you. Then they are not worried. I don’t know how they get this confidence with that.
Like the other day, we had somebody from ‘charismatic movement’. You remember that? Norman. And I hope you have not taken any photographs of him, did you? We were also quite worried about him. And he went into such movements of the body; for at least half an hour he was so much in a very funny type of epilepsy, you see. All his body was moving and terrible. He was crying and weeping. He fell down on the ground. You can’t imagine. And he said, “This I’ve been doing and so many are doing like this, and they think they are getting into Holy Ghost.” I said, “The Holy Ghost? What an unholy thing it is to be like that!” Holy Ghost! Can you imagine?

He wanted to get out of it. He could not. Now he’s all right, perfectly all right. He’s like a small little child. I wish you could see that. John, you should have seen that. Really. Shocking, it was. Much worse than TM, I tell you, much worse. Because the movement was so fast, unrhythmic, big fast movements. The whole body was gesticulating and it was too much. But he got cured.

Any other questions?
Ego is one problem, I must say. It’s a very big problem. And for ego, like some people say, “Mother, why you should do it?” I said, “You better do it! It’s a very good idea. I would like to retire”. [Laughter]
But you can’t do it, what to do? You see? All right. Now you do so many things [and] I don’t feel bad. Why should you feel bad if I know something. You know, one thing I know is to awaken, awakening of the Kundalini. Now what can I do about it? Are you going to crucify me for that?
I mean I don’t get any – what you call – title from your government for that, no payment, nothing. So why? Why to feel bad? I mean, I will make you the same way. You will raise other’s Kundalini also. So what’s the harm? You will, of course, you are going to do it yourself. Supposing I have the keys with me: if I give you the keys, will you feel your ego will be hurt or not? See, if I am a trustee, I have to give you, isn’t it? Do you feel your ego hurt if I give you your keys? It’s so simple as that.

This is your own. This is your own property. I have got the keys. I’ll give you because I have got them. Now what to do? If you have them, it’s very good. You never had, so I’m giving you. [Laughter] What is there to feel hurt about that part? Actually, I have to work very hard you don’t have to work hard at all. To begin with. Then it’s up to you.

Any other question?
I would like Sahaja Yogis to ask me questions for one reason because when they are faced with life [unsure] and other people will ask them questions, so any questions which you have not been able to answer, you can ask me and then we will have our Realisation.

Sahaja Yogi: Mother?
Shri Mataji: Yes?
Sahaja Yogi: What is the approach towards the Christian Church?
Shri Mataji: What is it?
Sahaja Yogi: What is our approach, the line, for the Christian Church?
Shri Mataji: Have pity for them. [Laughter]
You see, I took my birth in the Christian religion, in India. And first, the Hindus, you see, were very upset that, “How could She take birth in a Christian religion?” I mean so-called Christian religion. And I must tell you I was baptised forcibly by a Lutheran church! All right? The simple answer is that Christians are the most fanatic people. And the Indian Christians are the worst because they think Christ was born in England. Really, they think so. You see, if you have an English name then you are a real Christian. Otherwise, you are not. You can’t imagine how ignorant they are. And how the Christians are most fanatic. It looks funny but it is so, because their fanaticism is so beautifully managed. It is not like Khomeini’s, which is stark open fanaticism. You know Khomeini is that and he has to accept he is. But this one is very well polished you know, beautifully done. Others can be said they are stones, but this is like a diamond artificially made. They do social work this Christian way.
Now for example, if you ask somebody the way in England, it’s a Christian way to tell the way, you see. What God has got to do with this? Just you tell me. They have mixed up God with all these things. It’s such a big mixture they have made, that the fanaticism of Christianity is very much in delusion. For them, begging in the name of God is also Christian. It’s is a very dangerous game because they are the cleverest of all, they think.

So, the way they have entangled themselves into, is so much dogmatic and so beautifully philosophised. It’s a philosophy. To know it you have to get out of it. It is so beautiful you can’t imagine, it’s so beautiful. And so appealing, they are the most ‘kindest’ people, ‘compassion’ personified, great people, Christians. And the Christians believe it. Christ never asked you to beg. He never asked you to collect money for the poor. Nothing of the kind, it was not his idea at all, you see. He wanted you to get your Realisation. That’s what He wanted. You have created the poor and you’d better look after them. That’s not God’s job. Communist may be the greatest Christians like that, the way they look after their poor. God’s job is one: is to give you Realisation. No other job. To take you away from this ignorance and mire of life into that beautiful blissful Kingdom of God. That is the work of God and not these things which you describe back.
But it looks so idealistic, you know, the whole thing such an idealism. That’s why it’s very, very dangerous. And it’s so well organised. So well organised, you know, so well organised. Even the hymn numbers everything is done so well, every book is done so well. Stand up to sing. Now you sit down. So regimented, beautifully. No one can realise even that this is we are going all to madness, you see! It’s a very wonderful thing.

You are not supposed to look this side or that side. It’s all right. In England, I have Christians, many have been Christians, you see. I’ve Christians, Jews, all kind of disciples. Indians Christians, I don’t have even one. Except for, of course, my family people are from there, but they have known my childhood, they know me. But the rest of them, for them I am a healer! [Laughter]
I am, believe me! Hindus are my disciples, then Muslims are, but not Christians. Not one. I knew this. And when I went to America, they pronounced, “A Christian mystic has come!” That gave me good marks you know! [Laughter]
People came to see me, because I was a Christian mystic, properly baptised. I must get my certificate also!
So our attitude should be of simply pity towards them. Like Blake has said it, “The priest cursed my head when he baptised me.” It’s something like that, it is really. We should have real, simple pity for all the people who go to churches where there are all the graves and they sit on the graves and get all the spirits into themselves. God save them!

I don’t know why Christians, everyone is just like that. But among the Christians only, I am sure, one day Sahaja Yoga will come up very well. That’s the power of Christ. I hope so. I hope so.
Mislaid and misled people, also who are enjoying that misleading, are most difficult, aren’t they. Don’t you think so? How can you talk to them? Who can break it? When I go to India, I can speak in a ‘sanathan’, means catholic – where thousands of people came to attend my lecture and they respect me as a saint. Do you think in any church whatsoever, I would be respected like that? Except for one ‘Unity Church we had’, [Laughter]
where all kinds of bhoots are respected. So, I was also called to give a lecture. It was I think more of a – I don’t know, money-making proposition whatever it was, whatever it was.

But in India, that’s the blessing of the Hindus they are not organised. For them, a saint is a saint. Even the Prime minister, even, I would say, the president of India would stand for a saint, they wouldn’t sit.
These ideas are not here. We are too organised to get out of this organised way, to find out what is beyond. You see, we just- all our spirituality is just satisfied by going to Sunday church; finished! Or giving some money for the feat, that’s all. That’s not the way it is. It’s much, much, much more. But be kind to them. Christ has said that, “You will be calling me, ‘Christ, Christ’ I won’t recognise you.” That’s what they are. And I’m sorry for them, really sorry.

Any other question?
Sahaja Yogi: Mother, can everybody become aware at the most, how do you recognize it up?
Shri Mataji: Yes. Everybody can. But everybody doesn’t mind, want it. You see, they don’t want it. See how many people are here. But if it was some sort of a falsehood, if I’d come with two horns there would have been three halls big like this. People don’t want reality, my child. They don’t want it. They never wanted it. They always crucified it. But now, at least, there are some who really want it and I am happy you think of others also, very happy to know that.
But it’s a difficult task. I have to work very hard. They don’t want reality because, in Sahaja yoga, it is a becoming. It is not just to come and fill in a form, “All right, you are the member!” Or you pay, supposing, a one-pound a membership fees. It’s not that! It’s your becoming, it’s what you become. It’s your thing, that must happen. You must get your properties. This is the problem.

You have to give up a little bit. It’s easy to give up. It’s very easy but I never talked about it before Realisation, because after Realisation just give up. If I tell you, half of you might go away, so I’m not going to tell you. You’d better get your Realisation. It will work it out. It will establish a new priority within yourself, naturally, because if you have light you see. You see snake as snake and rope as rope. So, I don’t have to tell you, you just see it. You just feel it. It happens to you. Yes, I know, I know. I wish I could. It can be done to all the new people, whatever race you may belong; it can. But how many are there? It’s a very slow movement. For four years, I had only seven Britons with me. I was struggling with them. Four years, can you imagine? In England. [Laughter] It’s a tremendous task.

All right. So you get your Realisation now. Let’s see how many you bring in.
Seeker: Divine holy Mother, after Self-realisation, how long it takes for a new [unclear], is it possible to stop being reincarnating and seek perfection?
Shri Mataji: Is it easy to? Last what did he say? What d’you say? It is easy to? Last sentence what d’ou say?
Seeker: I was saying after Realization, is it possible to stop reincarnating and to be perfect these troubled times?
Shri Mataji: You are reincarnated by Self-realisation itself!
Seeker: And to stop having rebirths and births.
Shri Mataji: You don’t think of these things afterwards because you are not futuristic anymore, you live in the present. You see, these ideas of rebirth and this frightening stuff: you should not have rebirth. Why not? I mean, you create a beautiful house, everything, and then you say that you don’t live in it! When you become a rich man, you want to enjoy your wealth isn’t it?
Seeker: But they’re not Buddha saying: birth is suffering, death is suffering.
Shri Mataji: Yes, that’s true. But not Realisation.

You see, what he has said is, Buddha never asked you to limit your desire of ascent. Because people talked of God, once they talked of it in India but nobody talked of the deities. That was a problem because it became a talk again. Then they talked of a God which was abstract, like you can say Jehovah and other things because they wanted people to a get over their stuck up points you see. Nothing worked, you see.

So Buddha said, “All right, let’s talk only about the Self-realisation. Nothing else. Not even of God. Let’s talk of that only. Let people get to Self-realisation then we’ll talk about God.” So he said, “All right, only Self-Realisation. No God. Nothing.” That was his job: fix you up with the idea of Self-realisation. He said, “Don’t worship anything, don’t worship, get your Self-realisation.” They are worshipping everything under the sun, these Buddhists! What am I to do?

So, whatever Buddha has said, everything is re-said in Sahaja Yoga.
“Buddham sharanam gachami.” I surrender myself to the Enlightened One. The One which is enlightened is your Spirit.
“Sangham sharanam gachami,” I surrender myself to the collectivity. Unless and until you are a collectively conscious person how can you surrender?
Buddha also, whatever has said, is not understood before Realisation. You cannot.
“Dharmam sharanam gachami,” is the sustenance within us. ‘Sharanam’ means you become that. It’s not a mental thing, “Oh, I surrender myself!” But you just become.

You become the enlightened one, you become the collectively conscious. You become the dharma, the sustenance, the religion within us. You become! That’s what he meant. But for them, ‘Sharanam gachami’ means take a wheel in the hand, go on, “Buddham sharanam gachami”. Now. [Shri Mataji strikes her forehead] What this wheel is going to do, I just don’t understand, you know. They go on [for] hours together. They’ll go mad. They will end up into lunatic asylum, believe me. Or like mad, you are saying something, all the time praying: is that the way you are becoming? They don’t even know where Buddha is placed within yourself.

But Sahaja Yogis know where He is placed and how to please him. Whatever He had said is nothing but Sahaja Yoga – absolutely, hundred percent.

Actually, Buddha was nobody else but an incarnation who reincarnated himself as Adi Shankaracharya. You can see it clearly in your being, it can be proved on Kundalini again! You see, how can I prove it?
To understand them, first you get your Realisation. Again, I am talking like Buddha only! He tried some things, by which he thought people would take to Realisation. But human beings, as they are… He thought they are very much involved in materialism take them out, try this, try that. Nothing works out. Nothing. Only thing that works out: the real happening, nothing else.
Seeker: Mother, you are [inaudible]?
Shri Mataji: What’s it? Say it loudly.
All right? Is there somebody else saying something, which I didn’t hear.
Today the vibrations are so much that, really, to be very frank, [Laughter] you can’t imagine! I don’t know how am I listening to you, what you are talking. It’s really too much flowing out. I can’t believe it. Why? There must be some great seekers who must have come today.

Should we now go in?

I would suggest that those who have come for the first time should come in the first or second line is better to understand. Please. First or the second line would be better. I mean, these men all of you should get up and give them. They are also Realised people.

Come forward come now. You also come along first or the second line. Come along come along. There are some seats here. It’s better to look after the.

Chaya also you tell. Chaya is there. Chaya is there. Just tell her. Now please, you have to put your hands towards me just like this. And put your feet on the Mother Earth touching. It helps. You need not to take out your socks. And please close your eyes.

Please put your fingers towards me directly little stretched, little stretched.

Now again we have to do the same exercise of putting your right hand on the left hand side of your neck. And saying thrice that, “Mother, I am not guilty.” From the front side. Yes, that’s the point where the guilt goes in so just say, “Mother, I am not guilty.” Say it again and again. Move the hand here and there you’ll feel the loosening of the tension there. At the back, go up to the spinal cord and you can feel tension there. Downwards you can feel it. Just go on saying, “Mother, I am not guilty.”

Still there you can put your hand from the back also if you want from the backside spinning this way. More on the left side, the whole problem is on the left side. For anything, you should not feel guilty whatsoever because God is love.

For anything, whatsoever whatsoever you have done. Forget it. You’ve been to wrong gurus anything you have done to harm yourself forget it. Now put it on to the right side.

Even the Sahaja Yogis have been into the trap of Left Vishuddhi. Now put both the hands towards me again, please. Now raise your right hand towards your heart, put it there and little bit press it and say to yourself that you are the Spirit, “Mother, I am the Spirit.” Just say that, go on saying.