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“Ego and Humility”. “Nirmala Palace” Nightingale Lane ashram, London (UK) – 7 June 1982.
We had a very good session, I should say, and a very successful trip in Portugal and even better in Spain. Portugal is a place where gurus have touched very nicely because people are too simple I think, and because they are too simple they are affected too hard. And I was really confronted with so many sick people there who have been to gurus, who have been only for two, three years with them are badly affected and surprisingly how the whole thing is exposed, that we may be able to do much better in Portugal.
Now, the Portuguese people get lot of wine. They drink a lot; they really drink. I mean, they have all kinds of wines in their country. Is a very big problem of that place, is it that has many wines and I think the drunkenness make them extremely lethargic and that lethargy brought down that empire. We can see it’s a very huge place. I mean the buildings, if you see, are very beautifully done, lots of buildings with lots of architecture, and all that is like a desolate place. The reason is: the people who were at the time quite affluent, were doing well… Gradually unemployment started settling down, lots of strikes ─ just the same thing as I feel is happening in this country ─ and unemployment and amounting to starvation.
First they used to get doles and all that, as we get here; gradually it stopped. Now it’s so bad that all of them have to depend on their parents. There’s no way. They have no source of income, very few industries. It’s one of the poorest country in the whole of Europe.
That made Me think about England, that we have to know that this country also may face a phase, if we do not get up now. You see it’s all right to divert your attention to Falklands and all that, but it cannot feed you.
So, we have to understand, all the Sahaj Yogis must understand, that they all must have some sort of a degree or something on the paper; that’s a very important. And though you are all realized souls and you are spiritually so endowed, everything is there, but you have to think of the whole. If the country completely goes down in its production and its capacity to activate itself, you will go down, too. So, your attention should be now, of course, you should not be materialistic, but towards putting more activity into you, even in Sahaja Yoga, in meditating, in working it out in yourself.
So, lethargy is not going to pay. And this is one thing, is such an inertia, such an inertia that exists, that unless and until you really put in complete willpower, this inertia may not be combated, may be very difficult, even in Sahaja Yoga. You see, it is very easy to escape and explain, you see, yourself, “Oh, I got up and, you know, this happened, that happened.” But, I think the symptoms are of a very dangerous type and as Sahaja Yogis you have to be very patriotic about it and you have to think about it. After all, you are symbols of the English people. Whatever works out in you will start working out in the rest. So, how you behave towards yourself and towards the general atmosphere is very, very important.
Now, towards Sahaja Yoga also the attitude has to be understood very clearly. You see, like a Maharaja in India who lives in quite great comfort first of all, lives like a lord and he orders about, you see, and then everything is lost. But, still he talks like a lord, he behaves like a lord. His whole thing is the same way, though, it’s not that the kingdom is there, that he’s the ruler, but he’ll talk like that to everyone, because the habits are formed.
I think the mind also has formed a habit. The whole atmosphere is charged with such ego since long and that’s why towards Sahaja Yoga also, the attitude has to be humbler, much humbler, because without humility you cannot do. That’s one thing you must understand. Is no question of you rationally saying something about it or explaining about it. But, you see, basically one has to be extremely humble.
First of all, it’s a very big privilege to get realization. You know that. It’s a greater privilege to go ahead, and it’s the greatest to be a Sahaja Yogi. Is a very great privilege that you have, which very few people have and you are the ones who are chosen specially. But, the humility part of it is still missing about Sahaja Yoga, about Sahaja Yoga. Like, we should ask, “Make me a better Sahaja Yogi, a humbler Sahaja Yogi, a compassionate Sahaja Yogi, a sweeter Sahaja Yogi. Dissolve my ego.” This is very important, we must understand, because whatever works out in you, will work out in this country.
Arrogance is something that with ego you can never understand you have been arrogant. The way you talk to others, the way you behave towards others, you will never understand, because there is ego. If you are standing in the darkness, the light is there but it is covered with something. How will you understand where is the light? So, humility must be there, because you people have very developed brains, very developed, over-developed brains and that brain can, you see, always tell you, “Oh, you are better than others,” you see, always. “The another one is no good and the third one is useless. You see, you are the best.” That’s typical of the brain teachings, you see. And when it starts working out, it’s very difficult, you see, to see that the one who is saying this is nowhere, because from the point where you see, you cannot see what you are saying. What you see is the whole thing as if you have to command it; you have to ask for it.
Of course, the quality is very much changing now, everybody is becoming very, very, very sweet and sober and nobody now demands anything from Me like, “You must give me this, Mother. You have to do it. You have to look after me. After all, I have been to Your Caxton Hall once, You see, and how dare You do not look after my mother when she met an accident?” Something like that. That’s over now. That’s over.
The quality is improving now and one has started learning now how to laugh at your own ego and this and that. But I personally think that one has to realize that if you represent this country to your Mother, then it has to improve still. “Still I have to improve. I have to go ahead. I have to go further with it and have I to develop that beauty of humility.”
Like in Portugal they told Me Lord Byron, whom I think to be a useless fellow, absolutely good for nothing and I regretted every minute why he was created on this earth, he went and said that … he went and said, “Cintra is a very beautiful place. Cintra is too good to be wasted on Portuguese.” It should have been from Mr. Lord Byron, whosoever he may be. You see, typical! And it pinches everyone, you know. Everybody feels. But think if you are the person about whom he said.
So, one has to develop a kind of a humility that “I have to still receive; I have to still get it; it has to work out.” Now, when it comes to that kind of an attitude, then you turn round. Turn round upon yourself. What have you done for Sahaja Yoga? One question, simple question: what have you done for Sahaja Yoga? How many people have you given realization? How many people have you been able to cure? How much peace have you got within yourself? How much blissful are you? How much compassion have you got? How much forgiveness and patience you have for others? How much of sharing you can do? These are the signs of Sahaja yogis, that you break your shell. You become the collective. How much do you understand others? And how much do you understand giving [to] others? What have you given to others, even on material level? Let’s see. These questions should be put to yourself. On a very material level these questions are to be asked, on a very material level, because the light comes down up to material level. How many people you can forgive?
You are realized souls. You are prophets, no doubt. You can make others prophets, but you have to be the quality, also. The quality of a prophet is his nobility. He is so noble. Nobleness. In comparison with other people, who are not realized souls, he is nobler; he is more dignified; he is much more forgiving. So the whole way of dealing with others will change. He is obedient. We have to obey in Sahaja Yoga. We have to obey our good will. Otherwise, you are difficult people. It’s impossible. Nobody can do anything to you. If you are like a thorn, how can anybody help you?
So the quality of a Sahaja yogi is measured by another kind of a measure. Is not the way human beings measure the quality of other human beings. Like, somebody has a good taste, for example, so-called. Then people say, “Oh, he’s great, with a good taste.” Or if he has a big car, then: “Oh, he’s a big man.” Or he talks like that, or he walks like that, or says this, that and all those things. Or a question like this, “Why did you say like that?” All these words, you know. They sound very hard to Me. “Why do you do like that?” This kind of a language itself was not there in this English language.
Nowadays the language is so changed and very rude, very arrogant and very harmful. So, first ask yourself, because Sahaja Yoga will spread – of course, slowly and steadily, I hope – only through your images. You are the reflectors.
You put My thousands of posters. I am so unique, you know. They’ll say, “All right, this unique personality is taken out, no good. What about the disciples?”
So, actually whatever is in the lower level animals is important, like in lower level animals the king is the one. Say, the tiger has to kill an animal, big animal. It is he who only can kill. Till human stage also perhaps it is so. The one who can really dominate others, survival of the fittest, is the ruler.
Is the other way round, now. It’s changed, completely. How much free you are in your ideas, while you are still identified with old ideas.
But free doesn’t mean abandonment, by any chance. Freedom means you respect the freedom of others. First and foremost thing of freedom is that you must respect the freedom of others. Even God respects your freedom. He cannot give you realization if you don’t want it. He cannot force it. So, respect the freedom of others. But, that does not mean by respecting the freedom of others there should be abandonment. If somebody is abandoned in Sahaja Yoga, he goes out of the circulation of Sahaja Yoga. It’s not coming in so important, I’ve told you hundred times. It’s the throwing out part of it, you see. Sometimes I feel I should use some glues to stick on. Maybe, the wheel can turn very fast and some of half-baked may be thrown out back again into the oven.
So, I feel, in these countries where I went, Spain, they call it. Spain, still half-developing; Portugal, developing. I don’t know what you think about Italy, whatever it is called. Very humble people, very humble from the very first day. Anyone who comes from the very first day, they are very humble and because they are humble, they are sensitive to Me; because you have to be really very humble to be sensitive to Me, that’s a fact, because I’m too simple, naïve, as if I do not understand anything. I look like that, I mean, as if I have no knowledge of anything – very simple woman, talks in a very simple way, is very friendly, all right.
So to understand Me you have to be extremely humble and if you cannot go to that level of humility you cannot see Me and you cannot understand Me. And the more you start understanding, the more humble you become, naturally, because you know what it is.
So, I have told you many a times about humility part of it, but My experience of these countries was where I went there. I mean, they are very humble people, very humble about Sahaja Yoga, extremely humble they were. Even the new people were very humble. Spanish people same thing, extremely humble. You see, Dawn had told Me that they have a ego of a bull fighter, but the one who came this time were so humble I was amazed. Even if I could touch them, that was sufficient for them. Nobody pulled My hand, nothing.
So, this is what it is: one has to understand that we have certain tags of our past which has to go down. The language should be extremely humble language. Try to read … I don’t know whose language is so humble. Maybe Mine, I don’t know. But, try to read books where people speak humble language, humble way of talking. You’ll enjoy it, really enjoy it. Humility is the glory of Sahaja yogis, is the only way they will grow. It’s like putting your roots down and down and down.
The people who went from here were themselves amazed at the humility of the people who were there, very much amazed, the way things are working out there, the way they helped us and did everything for us. And I am sure now in Spain we’ll have a very nice, very, very nice center. Of course, the Ambassador is a very, very humble man ─ you know him, too humble ─ and he might be coming here, and one day I want to call him here to the ashram also. He and his wife will be here. So, the Ambassador was very sweet and he called Me to his house, invited, and he had a nice tea party. He called Indians and everything and Indians said, you know they asked Me for one thing. You’ll be shocked. They said, “What about something to depend upon?” you see. “Can we have Your photographs, something? It must be having some vibrations. Should we use Your photographs for our worship?” Can you imagine? And, at first I said that “It’s all right. It will work out,” because I didn’t want to say, “You have to take My photograph.” So she was so disappointed, the lady. She said, “No, there must be a photograph or something which we can use. After all, how can that be?” Just imagine! And here, first thing comes up, like a big snake, “Why Mother’s photograph? She should give us realization, She should solve all our problems, all our sickness, everything, but why Her photograph? This is too much!” In this you can see the ego of the people.
Now, regarding ashram, I had asked Nick, I had asked him to make certain rules and regulations. And I must say that, of course, Nick should say things, as you, somebody told Me that he should have been little softer with it and all that. But, supposing somebody is not soft at all: you must know that this is sent by Mother and you must do it. You see, actually, when you say no to him, you are saying no to Me also, isn’t it? Because I sent him. I told him and I told him that “You must carry out these things.” If you do not allow him to carry out, he has to be perhaps strict. By softer means, supposing something fails, then what to do? But I really don’t know. After realization even if you do not do things, what should we do? Can you suggest?
I mean, you should respect everyone. But say, even if you respect, people get up at eight o’clock in the morning; then what should you do? What should be done, you just tell us? John, tell Me. I mean, it is really surprising. You are now prophets. Do you understand your quality, what are you, what have I given you? Then what should we do about it? You see, these are so simple things, like children also. If you are in a hostel, you are made to get up in the morning, take your bath, get ready, walk out. I mean, if you do not listen, anyone, I mean, it’s simple. Then, what should one do with prophets? You just tell Me.
This is not the problem in Australia even. But English one going to Australia, create problems. I have seen. Sally, what a problem. Ba pre. You could see in contrast, her ego. Absolutely, in contrast I could see it clearly, very egoistical. Though she said that she was in ─ what place she was in? Jersey, and there bhoots got her. But all the bhoots were egoistical. That’s the point. Such a contrast, you know.
If we have to grow as one body and you are enlightened, part and parcel, part and particle of the same body, supposing this finger says, “No, no, I will not do it.” Now, somebody is, say, putting a big attack or something and this hand says, “No, I will not work out,” then what to do?
Actually, it’s a very big dilemma for Me because a hand which is forced to do it will never do it properly. If you don’t force it, then what happens to that hand? I mean, just see, the diligence is very important. We should not take things for granted. You see, we take ourselves for granted, everything for granted. Is not proper. We have to work hard. We have to work it out ourselves. You see, even if you have ten thousand Sahaja yogis, here, what is going to happen? The quality is so poor, isn’t it?
You have to get up in the morning, do it, meditation. You have to grow. You have to grow still much more. And you know you are so very few, I have to use you only. Of course, nobody can force you. And even if you force, a forced labor is not going to help in Sahaja Yoga, that is. You take it from Me. It cannot. So, these people are nowhere, where do they stand?
Now, anyone you tell the job. Say, Warren also, in Australia. There were jealousies about that, terrible jealousies.
“Why should he tell me?” Because there is nobody to tell you within yourself. That’s the problem is it. So, that which is sleeping, I put it into one man. All right, this man is going to tell, but, then that person tells you, then people feel jealous. I mean, these are not the signs of a prophet. A prophet is never jealous, because he knows he has achieved his powers now. He’s in his own power and his power is of surrendering. Is not of overpowering.
See, you cannot see the other side of it. You think power means you sit on somebody’s head, then, “I am very powerful.” Like a woman, if she can make her husband dance to her tune, then she thinks, “Oh, I am the most powerful woman ever living.” Is the other way round, that the woman is so loving that husband can’t do without her, that sort of a power. She’s so sweet that the husband cannot manage without her.
That sort of a power is, should be the power of a prophet and these things are very much deeply put into us. So face it up and take it out. The whole value system is upside down. I tell you the whole value system is upside down. See My life, own life. As a wife of such and such and such I am expected to go into diamond shops, buy diamonds, wear, become a big lady with heels like that and walk with a neck like that and do all sorts. I mean, this is the normal thing. It’s expected. And shout at the chauffeur, and shout at the servants and shout at everyone and behave in that manner. I mean, that’s what it is, the power is. You see, that’s how the woman express their husbands’ positions.
But, the other way round, is the situation of a prophet. The prophet asserts his powers through love. “How much can you hate me? I’ll love you double. Always, whatever you will hate me, I’ll love you double of that.” Then what will happen?
But to love, one has to sacrifice, one has to give, one has to bear. Love doesn’t hang in the air. That’s one thing people don’t understand. Love is not only talking love or if you are little gentle to somebody is not the point. But even that bearing is a joy, because ultimately you are doing it for love. If love is the joy-giving thing, then that bearing is not much. You are doing it for love’s sake. See, because love, unless and until it is shared you cannot enjoy. So, first we have to be strict with ourselves, I think would be a good idea, and loving to others. That may be the way we might work it out.
By God’s grace we have a very nice place as an ashram. We might get even better place. You are the God’s own blessed people. No one can believe that we could have such a nice place. But, what are we willing to do for it? That’s the point, we should say. Don’t take things for granted. I must warn you. I know England is the heart, but in God’s realms one can create many hearts, not so difficult. So more harmony should be brought in. Even, you’ll be surprised, in France, it’s so harmonious and so beautiful. Find faults with yourself all the time.
Now, under certain circumstances I have to appoint somebody, like I would say very personally, I would say, Nick. Because Nick is doing no job nowadays, he is quite a systematic person, is all right, this thing. He has some problems, I know. You, too, have problems, all right? But he’s the one available today and he’s the one who is going to do it. Take one case. Now you must understand why Mother has appointed somebody, all right? Accept it. Because…
(speaking about the children) It’s a big dance, all that… They’re trying to entertain… see, look at this dancing. They are feeling the tenseness of the situation and trying to entertain… That’s it; that is love. See, they want to relax you, they want to relax you, they want you to feel nice, to be joyous. Look at them, in the same way, we should do.
I am sure. I am sure now, henceforth. I think best thing is to make some poems. That may be a solution, all right? Let’s see. And let everybody start writing poems. Would be a good idea. And then that should work out. And sing the song of praises. It’s very little way, just a very little way, just there in your heart, resides the source of all the beauty. It’s just, turn your face towards that. That will work out. I’m sure it will work out. It’s not very far away.
(aside) Let her also stand there, she’ll enjoy.
Now, another point was that you are going to go to that peace mission or something. What peace? What is that supposed to be? In Brighton, you are? Peace festival, all right. And I’m told Kay has written an article about it, peace. You know that peace is nothing without. It is within yourself and if you can feel your peace, then only you can start feeling peace for others. Sahaja Yoga is the only way; there’s no other way out.
You see, at the level of, say, take the position of Falkland. Now, let’s see, Falkland Island is a very immediate problem. Now at that level there’s no solution. There’s no solution. They are quite justified in attacking back Falkland, because these people were illegally there, because that’s not a democratic country. They have destroyed so many people of their own. So, English were justified. Of course My all support was for them, because they were correct on the justice point. That’s true. But, justice is a little half-baked, because for whom to fight? These unrealized souls, their right, for what? Even if you have democracy, if it is demonocracy, what is the use of having democracy? I mean, if through democracy, you are creating only demons, this demonic reign, then what’s the use of having democracy, also?
What about this so-called communism? All stupid people. To My eye, everybody is stupid and they cannot achieve anything at that level. You can say little bit, “Yes, correct. After all, you see, that was their people were there under democracy. These people should have gone because they have killed so many people already in Argentina, they have no business and, of course, despotic law is against, absolutely against Sahaja Yoga.” So democracy is the best suited, no doubt. We have to support democracy. But, even democracy for what? Why to have democracy? To have the higher freedom. If you cannot have higher freedom, and it just means abandonment, you see, democracy means that an old man can marry a young girl and all sorts of nonsensical things. Then better not to have.
So democracy is only suitable to people who are dharmic, who have established their dharma. Otherwise, you really need a communistic country which will settle down your dharma most, to evolve out of it. But people think that democracy is for ruining your dharma, you have freedom to ruin your dharma as you like.
You see, “What’s wrong?” It’s a very, you see, you cannot say. It’s a dilemma again. I don’t know which way to go. It’s another dilemma. So, to end up the dilemma you have to talk to people, that though it might be justified at this time, say Falkland thing, aggression, it’s for peace, because next time they won’t do such a thing again. Is really for peace, because next time such a thing they may not try, these despots, and there are all these Germans have gone and settled there. So, is a good thing.
But, still it’s not peace, it has killed a lot of people. This thing has happened. Why? Because people are not realized souls.
Come in, come in! Come inside, there’s a lot of space here, move on. All those people who come first should come on this.. Can you move on this side, don’t stand in there.
So, all these political institutions are a big joke, without realization. They’re not yet fully human beings. They’re not fully developed, because they have not found their spirit. You must find your spirit. Unless and until you’ve found your spirit, no problem is going to be solved. Once your problem is solved, that is, to find your spirit, all other problems are solved. How now? What will happen? Let’s see. What will happen if we establish a kingdom of the realized souls?
Let’s hear… the scholar. What should happen?
Of course, everybody will get up early in the morning, no doubt about it. Apart from that ─ that’s the most difficult thing. Tell Me. Whatever you say will happen, so that’s what I’m asking.
Yogi: Nobody will attack such a state.
Shri Mataji: There won’t be any states. You see, God has not made any states. It’s a madness. I tell you, when I was born, I was surprised. Oh God, what has happened? You see, God has not made any one of these states. It’s a very different thing than what, you see, I expected. You see, God has made a beautiful land, all right, like this one, one sari like that.
Now, you have to have some design, pattern, so He made some beautiful mountains and some nice, you can say, areas. And some are desert, some are rich. You see, it’s to create … the whole system, if you see, has worked out in such a way that you have equator, and you have the sun there, so the winds start moving. You see, it’s all created so beautifully, so you have different types of countries and different types of places, this that. Now, after creating that, the human beings, stupid as they are, they divided themselves. I mean, it is stupid. I tell you really there is no need to divide like that. So they created states. There was no need to create a state. But you see it happened like this: that in the beginning they created state, because they wanted to have a, you can say, a hut to protect themselves, then a village, then a city, now a state. Now, after state what is the next situation? The whole world! The collective. This is the breaking through. Is one world. It is. I believe it is. To Me it’s nonsense to see it in so many …
I can’t understand walking in the, you see, this Customs and all that, carrying your passport, that criminal number so and so, and apart from that you carry your photograph and then tell so many things. Oh, by the way, My passport is completely filled now. Have to get another one. It’s like that. You see, everywhere you go, you look like a criminal. They look at your face and then they stamp you. All right, you are stamped. Go ahead. It’s terrible. It’s indignified, absolutely there. That means the human beings have no dignity left in them. I mean, this land doesn’t belong to you at all. This is a land of God. You are of God and the land is. Nothing belongs to you, actually, to be very frank. I’m sorry to say, it’s true. So, what is a state? This is stateless. But stateless also means there is state in it. I say this is one world. This is, has been, is and will be.
I mean you may in your myth, you see, hallucination, think it is different and fight. I sometimes feel you are just fighting your shadows. This is the, you have created shadows and the shadows are fighting and just to make the shadows fight, you fight. Otherwise, shadows don’t fight. It’s all a shadow. There’s no truth in it. To Me it looks like that. It’s all madness. What is there to fight? This is one world. Everybody is blessed by God. They all should enjoy His blessings to enter into the kingdom of God. He is the King. He is the one who is the ruler. In His kingdom there is nothing like a state. So that’s a very different world you are entering into.
There are no alternatives there. It’s only one absolute state of mind where you become the spirit, that’s all. There’s not going to be any aggression. Is stupid to be aggressive. There’s not going to be any suppression. Stupid to do that. Nobody’s going to be suppressed and nobody’s going to take any suppression. Everybody … Why? Do you find that in the nature? Nobody does that. It’s a harmonious living in the nature, even in the animal kingdom. You see, they know that a tiger has to live on an animal. It’s all right. That cattle has its own life, finished. Even they can understand the need, but, human beings don’t. Their need is of spirit, and spirit hates, actually hates aggression. It cannot. It cannot. Even if it wants to, it cannot. It’s indignified to aggress anyone, for a spirit, indignified. Absolutely, it is wretched. So, that is what it is, that we’ll all enjoy love, love of God, His blessings, and all our limitations will drop off. So-called bhoots, as you call them, they’ll all run away.
It’s a very different atmosphere of reality. This is all unreal, is absolutely unreal, is an illusion, I tell you, because you know that Brahma, His divine vibrations are doing everything. They are working out everything, even material things. Everything they can achieve. Apart from that, they give you that source of joy which takes you onto that atmosphere where you exist and enjoy. All the illusions created by human beings will drop out. This is all illusion. Believe Me, it’s all illusion. There is no truth in it at all. But through illusion, you can work out.
It’s a very interesting thing that only through illusion you can work out, because when I’m talking to you I have to keep an illusion of being here. Otherwise, you won’t pay any attention. You wouldn’t see Me; you wouldn’t know Me; you wouldn’t talk to Me. So, you have to have an illusion. But, I know this is illusion. That’s all. Living in this world, in this illusion, if you know it’s an illusion, that’s done. You are going to be tomorrow’s citizens, no doubt, of a very high level quality. The day will come when they will have to jolly well consult us. Already you have seen how I am playing tricks on the U.S. Did you hear the way the lady made mistakes, you see, the stupid things? Did you find that? I saw her photograph and I said, “Oh, this stupid woman.” She just raised her hand like that.
Now they are realizing, you know, they don’t know what happens and then suddenly how they go amok. They’ll all go amok and then they will have to find out how they should be controlled, what has happened, how did it happen. All these tricks one has to play, with all of them.
Now, after the last war perhaps people may not come out with very aggressive words, perhaps, maybe, because it will be unpopular. But they’ll do such stupid things, you see, to prove that they are good for nothing. All this can be done. But, you must know it’s an illusion, all of you, because you are different things. You are seeing through different eyes. You know what is Brahma is. So, you must know it. And raise your quality. Raise your quality. In normal life, supposing, you see, like I’ll say that somebody is a peon, then he dresses up in a particular way. Then he suddenly becomes an officer. Then he becomes a different style, you see, walks in a different way; his gait changes; style changes.
So, now you have become prophets, whole thing has to change. Either you don’t accept this position, but if you are accepted this position and you are paid for it, then better be that. I mean, you can’t dress up like a peon if you are an officer, can you? It’s all illusion, complete illusion. Whole thing is an illusion. All these kings of yours and queens are like dolls there before you. Especially Mr. Pope, you see, who came here. My grandson says, “Mr. Poke came here.” I said, “Poke?” He said, “I’m sorry, Pork. He was talking all rubbish.”
I said, “How do you know?” “Because all his chakras were catching.” And he is supposed to be the Pope in charge. Now, Bishop of Canterbury, see, is another funny man. I’ve seen him on the thing. He was agnostic about everything. I don’t know about Christ also, maybe. He said, “I’m agnostic.” Any question you ask him, “I’m agnostic.” Is a very good escape he has got, you see. He’s agnostic of about everything, because he says, “It’s a mystery to me.” So, what are you doing there? I mean, if it’s a mystery to you, you’re agnostic. I mean, I just don’t understand how is he there. So, some people have taken up upon themselves this crusade, I believe, and to talk to him. I mean, how can you talk to your shadow? Can you? So, the people live in the shadow state, and you should not symbolize yourself as shadows. You should symbolize yourself as reality and look at them as shadows, you see. In a way, in a very dignified way, “This is a shadow, you know.” Just pick it up, but, not in an aggressive way, but have compassion about them. Say, “No, no, sir, this is not so. You are sadly mistaken. You see the shadow of life.”
The whole Christianity is doomed because they started running after shadows. This Mr. Saint Paul, I don’t know how he came into Bible. Now, you are a theologist. You tell Me, John. How did he enter? I mean, anybody who says he saw Christ, is he supposed to enter into the Bible? How did he? I mean, his saying and his words and his letters are regarded as the letters from the Bible, after Christ. Before Christ is all right, but after Christ. What is the validity? I don’t understand. What is the credibility of this person entering into that as an authority? How? When nobody challenged him. He was a man who was killing so many people before. Then, suddenly he becomes something and he starts saying, “I’m doing Christ’s work,” and this and that and writes letter to Corinthians and all these people and all that. And why these letters that he writes becomes a Bible? Can you imagine? What did he do in his own lifetime? Half of it he spent in killing and half of it is he was an imposter. I am happy that it has come to your notice. But one can ask, “Why? Why is he there?”
Now, he started this charismatic thing; he is doing all this. I first saw it in India. There’s a Saint Paul’s Church. They’re all possessed people, you know, and one of My uncles was the priest of that. He was a very possessed man, very hot-tempered, horrible. And when I saw that, I wanted to see the Saint Paul’s Bible what he has written about. I was amazed. But I said, “Let you people read and see for yourself.” And this horrible charismatic movement is anti-God activity, absolutely anti-God activity.
So, if you have to talk to the gentleman, you have to tell him about it, that it is possession. The Seventh Day Adventist and what other is this Pentecost, is nothing but that. Jamaicans are doing, all of them are great spiritually-developed people ─ spiritually in the pub. I mean, there should be certain norms, isn’t it, about a person who is supposed to be a prophet or something, something to do with God, you see. The world is coming to a position where they are understanding; but you see, once they start disregarding, the danger is this: once they start disregarding these things, because they are myths and falsehood, they will disregard also God and all the truth about God. They can become communists. That’s the easiest way. Then there is no return. It’s a dangerous situation. When you talk to him you have to tell him, warn him. Already your churches are selling here. Nobody goes to church.
Now, about the environment. They are having a meeting on environment. That, too, is only solved through spirit. All environment problems can be solved only spiritual, if you have spiritual ascent. Otherwise, you cannot. You try anything; it’s like patching up the sky. See now, it’s a very deep-rooted thing that we don’t understand that spirit is the most practical thing. You see, we think spirit, we think it’s like a drunkard, you know. Spiritual man, he’s a cult, he’s a drunkard, he’s most abnormal. He’s funny. Either he hits people or runs away from them. This is the idea we have got about a spiritual personality.
But just see you are spiritual. You will find it impossible to use plastics after some time, because you will know that the plastics give you horrid vibrations. After some time you will really find it repulsive. It’s all right to sit in a train for a while on a plastic coach, all right, but, to sit in your house on a plastic all the time would be horrible and to wear a plastic coat all the time, our body will refuse. So when people will be spiritually awakened, they’ll give up all these nonsensical things.
So, they may say then, “What will happen to the machines?” Now, machines are for us; we are not for the machines. This is another concept is: whatever is created is for us and we are not for that. All right, doesn’t matter. Nothing will go wrong with the machines. Machines should be used for anything that is a public work. Like for your motor cars, for your trains, trams, all public work which is outside. For houses at the most you can use machines.
But, for personal things, you must use handmade things, handmade things. For spiritual people, you like to wear something that is handmade or real. I can’t wear a nylon sari. Not that I am very fussy about things, but I just can’t wear. After some time, if I do not take out My socks, which are only nylon, what to do? My vibrations get jammed, completely. So, you won’t be able to wear next to your skin, near your skin, near your body, eating your food, everything in plastics, cooking in plastics. I mean it’s too much. Thank God, cooking I don’t think is possible, isn’t it? But aluminium is another thing. Is very bad. Aluminium – you won’t be able to use. You’ll either try copper or brass, I think so. Now, handmade things we may have, because they are made by hand, so they have vibrations. People would like to have handmade. It is a part, so by that we remove the disparity of the world.
Developing countries can do handmade things. You cannot beat them with computers. Can you? You go ahead, mad with your computers. You’ll have to come back.
You must understand the whole. If you don’t understand the whole, this is what is happening: like mad, you know computers are going ahead, ahead. Where? Into the ditch, into a big mountain. Now they have created a big mountains of plastic and they don’t know what to do with it. So, and now with computer, what will they do? They’ll create a greater mountains out of plastics. Maybe a Himalaya might be created, with the computer.
So the developing countries should not try to follow these mad people on one side. They should develop their hand things and all that, because they’ll have to come back. Now, the handmade things in this country are so important and so expensive. You don’t care whether it is pressed (priced?) or not. But in India you have to take nylons, because they say nylons is a symbol of development, not of over-development, perhaps, but of development. So they must take to nylons and plastics and to stainless steel and aluminium, if possible. That’s what we are doing.
When you have less things consumed like that, you use less things from your motherland, because handmade you cannot go on mad like a machine goes, like a rakshasa eating away everything and producing more. It has to live like that. It’s not economical. So when you have handmade things you have more value for your things, you look after them better, you feel better, you are comfortable and you need not be that smart, you see, machine-made. That idea of smartness is going down.
So, the developing countries should also learn a lesson. They are going after you. They are running fast. They try to run faster; they cannot. Thank God, they cannot. But they should stick on to that side. You see, one part of the country has to do something; another part has to do something else.
But, you people have to look after the side of machines, all right? I mean, handmade things, what can you make? Some ceramics, I think ─ apologies, some apologies for that. You better do what you know better and let them do what they can do better and share it. If this balance is established, there’s no aggression. Unemployment can be solved. All the problems can be solved, if you take to handmade things. We should take to handmade things as far as possible. Sahaja yogis should use handmade things. I mean, not the cars, but for their personal use. Even I would say, soaps that you use are horrid. The soaps that you get in England are not meant for your skins at all, for Sahaja yogis’ skin. I can’t bear them. What you have to use is natural soaps that you get from any country you feel like, but natural soaps, which come from natural oils.
Foods also, natural food you must eat, more natural food, than artificial. All that will give you a better living and that is called as alternative, all right. That’s alternative is important, but that doesn’t mean you go on a bullock cart. You can export your trains to India, or your cars to India and get khadi from there. All right? Mutual understanding, because we are part and parcel of one whole and we just cannot exist by our only growth because then we become malignant, you see. One cells eats another. You have to. If you have a machinery, you have to eat other, because you produce so much. You must find markets for them, you must supply them, you must send over and then you must have other countries to exploit them.
People have tremendous respect for Mahatma Gandhi, but I don’t know if people understand what he said about machinery. That doesn’t mean the people who are doing machine work should give up, by any chance, but, some of them they can close down. For example, plastic toys for children is horrifying. You can’t even get wood toys now ─ nothing, just plastic. They are touching plastic. I mean, imagine, you cannot feel any plastic.
So, this is what a sane Sahaja yogi has to understand. That’s how you can solve the problem of environment, also. Thank God, somehow with your affluence and too much of machinery, all the western people ─ I am happy to know, even in Portugal ─ realize the value of handmade things. But in India if you offer somebody in an handmade thing they’ll say, “Oh God, they have no money.” But stainless steel, “Great.” In a stainless steel, glass they’ll give you tea, you see – it’s very big. If you give it in a ceramic, “Oh, what this, village craft?”
They are to be told. But, if you create a demand, they’ll be all right; they’ll look after their handmade. And here you can’t do much. I’ve seen, you see, that neatness, that deftness is not there; that’s lacking; all lost it. Very few people have that left in them. Even if they have to cut one coat with their hands, they cannot do it. They have to use a machine, which cuts twenty-five coats at a time, you see.
Then this problem of, you have to have a figure exactly because these only can fit certain figures. You can’t have your own independent figure. This is all machine-like stuff, you see. You all must have that figure, otherwise doesn’t fit it. So, that is an ideal figure. So, everybody works out for that. See, there’s a new machinery comes up, you see, for that kind of a thing, then new styles come up. It’s such an artificial thing, all man-made, artificial.
From your democracy, your politics to your economics, to all your so-called ideas of creativity, everything becomes so artificial. Now people can’t paint. What they paint, if you see, you are just aghast. You don’t know what is this supposed to be. And it is supposed to be so that it looks, “There’s a hand, isn’t it? Can’t you see that?” “Yes, I can. It’s a little bit showing.” They can’t do anything. We can’t have Shakespeare, we can’t have Gauguin, we can’t have anyone of that type. We can’t have, say, Abraham Lincoln. You can have only machines, you see, bolts and nuts, fitted nicely. You’re fixed, you’re fixed, you’re fixed, you’re fixed. Everybody fixed nicely. Where do, I mean, this brain go? Where will this heart go? What will it do then? It cannot collapse. I mean, as long as you are existing, the heart has to beat. 01:09:53 So all this artificiality has to be overcome by Sahaja yogis. The responsibility is so great. Such a big building you have to bear on your shoulders, and the foundation stones have to get up in the morning to be chiseled out properly.
So, I end up My lecture today.
May God bless you!
Now I am getting self-conscious. Will you please put it off? All right. Now, today I have come specially to discuss about…
H.H. Shri Mataji Nirmala Devi