From Mooladhara to Void

Guildhall Theatre, Derby (England)

1982-07-10 From Mooladhara to Void, Derby, England, DP, 76' Chapters: Arrival, Talk, Q&ADownload subtitles: CS,EN,ES,FI,FR,HU,HY,LT,NL,PL,PT,TR (12)View subtitles:
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1982-07-10 Q&A after the Talk, Derby, England, 6' Download subtitles: EN,TR (2)View subtitles:
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Public Program, “Mooladhara, Swadishthan, Nabhi, Void”. Derby (UK), 10 July 1982.

I thank all the Sahaja Yogis from Derbyshire and Birmingham for giving Me this opportunity to talk to the seekers of this place. We have seekers in the modern times, is something very unique. We never had seekers before, at least not so many.

There used to be people who would seek money, as there are many who are seeking these days, who would seek countries after countries, the power. There were (not) many who were seeking these few pearls of bliss of God, very few. The reason was the awareness, the collective awareness of human beings did not think themselves perhaps capable or perhaps needing some seeking.

But today it’s such a beautiful combination that there are seekers of very high quality born on this earth. Those who are seeking are in masses. They are not one or two here and there sitting on top of a mountain, cave or something and trying to meditate, but there are so many who are seeking, who feel dissatisfied with themselves, with whatever they have.

They think there must be something beyond. Those who feel that they have not yet found their meaning, those who feel they have to find the purpose of their life, those who feel that there has to be something higher than what they are into, all such people are seekers, not of today but of thousands of years.

At the time of Christ there were none, I should say, because even the ones Christ took as His disciples, they were actually forced into it; and He had to go and seek them and find them out and tell them about it. So we have to say that these are very important times in the history of creation, where there are so many seekers. But the problem with the seekers today is this that they don’t know what they are seeking. They have no idea as to what to seek, how to seek, what to expect. It’s an unknown area they are entering into. It’s very unknown to them. And this unknown area which they are seeking is now represented by so many people. Everyone says, “I’m the one who will deliver the goods.” Another one says, “I’m the one who can do it.” Naturally confusion is created, as it is, modern times are the times of confusion, great confusion. And when there such a confusion comes in, then only we find out a great solution also, a permanent solution to solve the problem once for all.

There has been never such confusion in the minds of human beings as it is today as to the right or wrong. Never so much. Whatever was said, “This was not good,” they would do, knowingly that they are doing wrong. If they were good people, they would say, “All right, this is good, we’ll do the good.” But everybody knew that this was wrong or right. They may do it. But today no one knows what is wrong and what is right.

Apart from wrong and right, it’s much beyond that, you have to know yourself. Because this awareness is within us that we do not know ourselves, we do not know the absolute.

We live in a relative world. Of this everybody seems to be conscious, maybe in the subconscious or maybe in the unconscious, but definitely there’s a feeling in every one of us that “We do not know.” And it’s a very honest feeling, it’s a very sublime feeling that we have to know something more. Now when we say the word “know,” we think as if I would say, “I don’t know about Derbyshire, I have never been there.

” Now this means what? I don’t know about Derbyshire. What don’t I know about Derbyshire? I can read it in the books, I can find out. I can know all the history of Derbyshire. I can find out who were the people who, who were making beautiful porcelain here, I can find out all about their history, everything I can read about it.

Still, why should I say I don’t know anything about Derbyshire? Because I have not been to Derbyshire before. I have not been to Derby, I have not been to this area, I have not seen this place, I have not visited it, I have had no experience of this place, so I don’t know about it. This is exactly what is the situation.

The situation is that we do not know about the Divine. We have read about it, we have heard about it. So many people have written about it. Once they know there’s an enquiry about it, they come out with books. Books after books, thousands of books they have written. How many of them are true and how many of them are untrue? It is impossible to find out, because we do not actually know. Supposing somebody says that Duke of Bedford was born in Derbyshire. Alright, how will I know? I would not know till I meet somebody who is really belonging to that place, who knows about it. In the same way, the knowledge that we have also about Divine is very confusing. But this is not knowledge, this is never the knowledge.

The idea of knowledge comes to us as if it is a kind of an answer to our enquiries which is rational, which we can understand intelligently through our intelligence. But now this area is beyond intelligence, beyond rationality, beyond all that is limited – is the unlimited area. All such unlimited areas can be only known by experience of your awareness.

Now this one should understand is a very delicate thing, how to know something, an experience of our awareness.

Not an experience, they suddenly see a light, so it’s an experience. I mean, you can always see a light! So great the people feel about it that they have seen some light suddenly sparking before them. Nothing so great. There could be some area from there a sparking can come, and maybe it is of no use to you, but just you might feel that you have experienced. So one must know that seeing is not experiencing. For example, a dog sees this instrument, but what does he know about it? He sees it. Awareness, the human awareness has so many great things about itself, compared to the animal awareness. For example, we can say the awareness of beauty – animals don’t have, awareness of cleanliness – animals don’t have. Human beings have these built within themselves, they can feel it. They can feel it on their central nervous system. So whatever is your awareness, is to be felt on your central nervous system. It’s not just an imaginary thing or an intellectual discussion, “Ah, yes, yes, I know, I know” – not that way. The knowledge should come to you through your feelings, like I can feel this is hot or cold, but a stone will not feel anything. In the same way, the feeling has to come through your central nervous system. That means your awareness itself is to be going, has to be charged. It has to get a new dimension; your awareness itself has to get a new dimension. All other experiences have no meaning whatsoever in evolution, if you see.

In evolutionary process, it is the awareness that improves, receives better and better dimensions. And these dimensions have reached its maximum at the time when you become a human being, where your awareness is just ready to receive the awareness of the universal Being, of the Collective Being, so that you become the Collective Being.

Now I would like to tell you about this within ourselves, how we are placed.

For every practical purposes, you should not take Me for granted, but you should not also deny what I tell you. It’s like entering into a new university: We listen to the professor and we try to follow him. Supposing he propounded, he propounds a hypothesis before you, then you just start judging it, work it out. If it is true, then you call it a law. In the same way, we should enter into this new understanding by first seeing it, not denying it. Then if it is true, then we have to believe it. There should be no blind faith about Sahaja Yoga. Blind faith does not help at all. Neither there should be a denial. And with that cheerful attitude if you just listen to Me as a hypothesis, whatever I’m telling you, you need not accept it as truth just now.

But then the time has come for Me to prove the truth to you. And the truth can be proved to you. Time has come to prove the existence of God; to prove, not prove that I give you a big lecture or take you to course or some sort of a thing like that. But how am I going to prove it? On your awareness! It is going to be absolute experience of your awareness that you are going to feel God Almighty! Time has come to prove the scriptures, all the scriptures. The time has come to prove your own connection with God, your own relationship with Him, your own relationship with that Primordial Being, whether you call it “God” or anything, it makes no difference to God himself. Whether you call Him by any name, there is God, and that God is not the way you conceive God, it’s not the way you understand God or you know God, but it’s the God as He is.

Unless and until you yourself feel Him, you are not going to believe in Him. Even if you believe under certain circumstances, it’s a belief that is blind. It has no meaning for any intelligent person, and the day will come that such a person is going to denounce that kind of a blind faith.

So now within ourselves, as I said, is a built-in system which has come to us through our ascent in our awareness at different stages, which is like a history written within ourselves how we become human beings. Into different stages we were divided. First of all the stage of the carbon, where we became alive, the dead became the life. That is placed at that point.

It is below that great power within us which lies in the triangular bone, which we call as Kundalini. This power is the power also described in the Bible as the ‘Tree of Life’, ‘I’ll appear before you like tongues of flames’, but Bible being a very microscopic thing, it cannot be explained, the symbolism of that, unless and until you get your new awareness or the vibratory awareness, it cannot be explained.

Now this power is the power of desire, of the ultimate desire, the only desire, the real desire that we have within ourselves. All other desires become useless. See in the affluent countries now people have achieved affluence; they are rich, well-to-do; but they are not happy. People who are extremely affluent like in Sweden and in Switzerland, they’re competing among themselves, how many youths are going to commit suicide! Recently I learnt that Swiss people are “better off”- many more Swiss people are committing suicide than the people who were young people in Sweden.

This is the state where we should realise that affluence, if it was our desire, is not the real desire; because when we got the affluence we should have been very happy and joyous people. But we are not. And the basics of economics is that wants in particular may be satiable, but in general they are never satiable, means, matter cannot satisfy your wants. So what is the want, what is the seeking one has? Is hidden in this power, and that is the seeking to become one with God, the yoga, the union with God, what we call the baptism.

In the Koran it’s called as the pir. You have to become the pir, the “twice born.” It is described in various languages, but the same thing that they have described is the same in every scripture. If you try to follow what it means, you’ll be amazed that they all said the same things. Now somebody might say, ‘There might be some other methods, Mother, it can be something else that can work it out.’ There’s no other method, because this has been worked out for thousands and thousands of years within yourselves since you became carbon. And it’s all arranged within you by nature. Like somebody can say that a seed has to sprout by some other method – there is no other method for a seed. The seed has got a primule and the primule has to be awakened, is the only way it works out. In the same way it is going to work out in all of you. This power is to be shaken within you, it is to be awakened within you. If it is awakened within you, it rises. But what is this power? This power is to become one with the Spirit. So this power knows that it has to become one with the Divine.

Now we have so many other desires, so we should say, how is it related to that? It’s like this, that we have to say, ‘Come to Derbyshire and meet you all, people.’ Now we come all the way, we come up to Guildhall, come up here, and don’t meet you. Then all My coming, all My travelling is useless because I’ve not met you. It has no meaning whatsoever. In the same way all other desires are just to accomplish this desire, the ultimate desire, the desire to become one with the Divine.

Lots of things can be said about Kundalini. I must have spoken hundreds of times about Kundalini, and to know more about it you will have to get to Sahaja Yoga and know more about it. But just now I have told you in brief what is this Kundalini, and how it is placed there.

Now the, above that is the second – actually the second one we treat as the third one, it looks here – is the power of, I would say, (inaudible) this is the centre of our seeking.

This centre is called as the Nabhi Chakra, which gives us our seeking. When we are in the state of animal, then we seek food through our stomach. And you will be amazed then when we become human beings also we seek our money through our stomach. We may get little diverted here and there, but ultimately we even seek our God through our stomach.

Surrounding this stomach is the area where one has to cross. And this area is actually the area of the Masters. All the Primordial Masters were born in this area, like Moses, Socrates. There are main basic ten primordial beings, who came on this earth, who came to give us an idea as to our seeking, what we have to do. Basically they came here to teach us how to balance ourselves, how to balance, so we can ascend.

Now all these great prophets or primordial beings, we should say they were the ones who were the masters, they came to inform us that if you cross too much onto the left side or too much on the right side, then you will be falling in your sustenance, in your quality as a human being. As a human being you have to have a sustenance, and this is the centre that gradually unfolds the sustenance from animal to higher animals and to human stage, where a person starts realising that these sustenance�s exist within us. That’s how all our laws have come. The Ten Commandments of the Bible are the ten sustenances that are within us. These are the ten Gurus who came on this earth to save human beings from getting out of the middle path, going more to the left and more to the right.

Now the left side, as you see here, is the side which is the emotional side within us, is also the power of desire. Is the emotional side which gives us our subconscious, and beyond that is our collective subconscious. On the right-hand side we have another power of action, that our desire we try to put in the action, and this power of action gives us our future and sustains our physical and mental activities. As a result of that we develop an institution in our head called ‘ego’. Everyone has it, there’s nothing to be frightened of. When we do something, we feel we have done it and that is a myth, but still we carry on with the myth because we have not yet seen the reality.

The another one is the left-side power within us, by which we receive the aggression of others, by which we have our past, gives us an institution as a by-product of our activity, emotional activity, an institution like a balloon you will see there, called as ‘super-ego’. These two things meet in the head just like this as you grow, and the calcification takes place on top of your head near the fontanel bone area, and this soft area which is pulsating in childhood becomes completely covered.

Thus you developed your I-ness, you become Mr. X, Y, Z and all that. You develop your own freedom. This is the freedom that you have achieved to be Mr. X, Mr. Y, Mr. Z.

After achieving this you start using the second centre, which is the centre of your creativity, the centre of your action. Animals do not have any ego. Of course, if they live with human beings they may develop, but otherwise they have no ego at all. And if you do something wrong, you feel hurt, you feel guilty.

Animals never feel guilty because it is in their nature to kill another animal, it is in their nature to eat, so they never feel guilty. It’s only human beings who’ll say, ‘Oh, I should not have said this. I should have not done this.’ This is only human quality that we feel guilty, it is only human quality that we aggress others.

So the second centre comes into play by which you think, and you think about the future, you plan. Your physical – I think it’s too much now, can you stop it? Can’t you stop it? Better stop the light, it’s too much. I’ve been having this all throughout, it’s too much) – and you think; for that thinking you require energy, and this energy you get from the cells of fats that are in the stomach, which are converted for the use of brain. And when this conversion takes place, this poor centre has to work very hard. When you think, this centre goes into action. It has to work very, very hard for one work only, and that is to look after the supply of fat cells.

-It’s too many lights they have there. Can you put off these lights? No, no, no, these three here … Thank you … Still these are very much, these if they can put off, it would be better. No, no, these three. These three are too much. There’s no need at all, there’s three, what is there? I mean, they can�t see Me otherwise? Can you not see Me? It’s like, you feel like shooting! So this, this centre that is what we call the Swadishthana centre is the centre that gives you your future energy to think of your future, your planning; which gives you energy to bring forth the manifestation of the physical labor, of physical exercise or physical work. This poor centre has to work for one work: to convert the fat for the use of the brain. Now, if one centre which has to do many other things starts doing only one work, all other things are neglected. As a result of that you develop problems, because it has to cater to your liver, to your pancreas, to your kidneys, to your spleen, and once it goes into action for one channelized work it gets programmed for it, and then it cannot take care of these things. That’s how you develop a bad liver, you develop a diabetes, kidney trouble, blood pressures. Also you develop a very serious disease called blood cancer.

Now, Sahaja Yoga can cure all these troubles. It’s only physical, but it can cure even physical troubles, because if this centre is brought to its normal behaviour, if it is made to behave in a very normal way, you can easily cure all such diseases which come out of your over activity, over-thinking, over-imaginativeness. It’s a very dangerous thing to always think about the future. For example, now we are here sitting down, we should be comfortably sitting down and talking to each other. Instead of that we are now, we are thinking ‘What am I going to do tomorrow?’ or ‘What am I going to do when I go home?’, ‘How I’m going to cook?’, ‘What am I going to eat?’, or ‘How I am going to take my train?’, all these futuristic behaviours lead you to a very funny personality. You become so futuristic that you forget the past. I met a gentleman who forgot even his own name. He forgot the name of his father, he forgot the name of his mother and also, to the dismay of his wife, her name. And she started crying. She said, “Now what to do? He’s forgotten everything.” Now he is in a futuristic area. He just knows the future. Then he was to be pushed back again into the centre; then gradually he started remembering. Then he told Me that he’s chairman of one of the councils of a big district place in India, and he said, he was – he said, “No, I am.” I said, “That’s good. That’s better. Now you are in that state where you say “I am.” So this is what happens, and this is what’s going to happen to our societies here, which is very futuristic. So to cut it down one can try anything, you may try anything; for example you may show pictures of the past and things like that, but that is not going to bring back the horse. it’s running very fast. The only thing that can work it out is the awakening of the Kundalini. When the Kundalini awakens itself, She makes the centre enlightened and the centre itself resumes its normal shape, its normal behaviour and its normal condition. Apart from that it has got a dynamic power or manifestation that this one, this centre which looks after our attention becomes enlightened, and our attention becomes enlightened, and the attention which is enlightened becomes dynamic in the sense now, sitting down here you can pay attention to anyone – just pay attention, you don’t have to do anything, just pay attention to that person, and you can find out on your fingertips what’s the matter with the person. Thousands of miles he may be! When Nixon was having trouble, suddenly I don’t know, I said, “Find out about Nixon, how is he?” And they said, “Ma, he is in a terrible mess.” Christ has said, ‘Your hands will speak’. That’s the time has come. These hands which looks so simple; but they are so intricate, and so intricately built that the nerve endings are so microscopic that we cannot understand how much they can tell us, how far they can go.

When the awakening takes place you start feeling the vibrations around you, the all-pervading Power which you have never felt before, through these fingertips. These fingertips which we neglect, we misuse them, we use them for wrong things, these fingertips themselves get enlightened, and you start feeling them! That’s what I said, that you have to get your awareness which is enlightened. It’s the awareness which has to manifest. And that’s how you start feeling them on your fingers: It’s wrong here, there’s wrong there, you can see where is the problem. Now all these are related to your centres. These are five, six and seven; seven on the left and seven on the right. So, this is about your emotional side. And this is about your right, about your physical and your rational, or you could say mental side. So, you can make out a person how he is by just knowing whether you are getting heat from that person, whether you are getting burning from that person, whether they are getting numb, whether they are becoming heavy.

And a rapport is established with the All-pervading Power which informs you, get the messages. And the messages are so correct that even if you have ten children who are realised souls – there are many children these days are born as realised souls. We don’t understand children these days, but these days there are great children, and they are born today because the time has come. This is the time of judgment time, this is the time of resurrection, this is the time about which people have described in all the scriptures. So great people are taking birth. And these children, if you tie them up their eyes, and ask them about a person who is sitting facing them, ‘What’s the problem with this person?’, they will all raise the same finger. All of them will raise the same finger, even if their eyes are tied, even if their backs are towards the person, they can just push back their hands and say. They are so good, children are so good. You see, when they put their fingers in the mouth we sometimes think – I don’t know, Freud, whom I’d call a very half-baked person, he didn’t know much about God and life and nothing at all, he was very, little bit he knew – he says that this has something towards sex. He was nothing but a sex point and he wants everybody to be a sex point, not a human being.

So this fellow, whatever he may say, but the truth is that it has nothing to do with sex. It is that they feel the heat on their fingers, they actually feel it, and that’s how they put it in the mouth. There are little, little children, I’ve seen; we have one here who has come from England, from London, and there’s another one who is from here somewhere, and she – all of these if you ask them they will immediately tell you where is the catch, which chakra is catching. Now, children you cannot befool them. They all tell you the same thing, that this is what is happening. So your awareness is enlightened and your hands, which have got the sympathetic endings here, tell you.

We can say that now in our central nervous system we can feel about others and about ourselves. Now, supposing you are sitting here and I ask you, “What’s the problem with you?” You would say, “I don’t know what’s the problem with me is, I don’t know.” But I may be able to tell you what the problem is. If you go and see the doctor, you will see, that’s the problem. How do you know? You don’t have to go to any examination, for all pathological examination where all your teeth are taken out, eyes are taken out, and by the time you end up they tell you you are the healthiest man! You don’t have to go to all these horrible things, you don’t have to waste any money and try all these frustrating things. Just putting your hands, you will know about yourself. And the people who are sahaja yogis will tell you that this is what is wrong with you, and this is how you cure. Now the time has come – this is such a fantastic time! With Sahaja Yoga we have cured so many cancer patients, so many blood cancer patients.

Recently a girl who is a Sahaja Yogini, in New York, has cured a blood cancer patient. This boy was about to die, they had declared that he is going to die. That’s declaration they had given about, for about fifteen days, they said, he may live, and then he is going to die. I mean, that’s the only thing they could do. With all the things poor fellow had gone through: the boy had come from India, all the money was spent, and this was the certificate he got, that he is going to die within fifteen days. Now somehow these people contacted Me, and I told them to contact a Sahaja yogini in New York. And they told that such and such boy is there, his name is Rahul, he is hardly about sixteen years of age, he had blood cancer. The boy not only got cured, he came down to London to see Me, and he’s back in his home.

It sounds very fantastic that how can a person who is not a doctor, who has nothing to do with medicine, can cure? Beyond all these medicines, beyond all these things is the subtle Power, the divine Power from where everything has come out. If you somehow or other become the owner of that, or the person who knows how to handle it, you can cure anyone you want to. It’s not that I’m curing these days, My disciples are curing. I don’t know how many people this Dr. Warren, who was a doctor, has cured through Sahaja Yoga, which is not a medical science. How many patients he himself has cured, he won’t be able to count them. So the whole system is going to change. Now you are going to become the master of yourself, of your powers, and all these powers are going to be released from you. Now when we say that there were gurus who could cure, there were gurus who could stop a growth of a horrible disease and things like that, we think it’s not possible. We think it is an impossible thing. How can it be? How can we believe it? It’s a cock and bull story. But you yourself when you see manifesting it, you’ll be amazed.

Once I was travelling by a ship, and the captain of the ship, I gave him Realization. And it so happened that one of the ship’s staff got into the freezer, and he got choked up and he got pneumonia. Of course, you see, I was in a position, I was travelling because My husband was the chairman of that company. So he would not ask Me to go down, he thought it was too much to ask Me. I said, “All right, if you don’t allow Me to go down, you’d better go down to the spot where he is. Don’t send any SOS to call a doctor or anything, you just go and put your hand on his chest for about five minutes.” His pneumonia got cured completely and this captain, he could not believe it. He said, “How could it be?” I said, “It is! That has happened to you. Now you have become that – accept it!” You must assume that power, whatever has been given to you, as in Sanskrit language we say “viraj.” Assume it. You see, even if you – I have given a throne, if you don’t know how to assume the power of the throne, to believe into it, then like a beggar boy, if you put him on the throne he still sees people coming down, he puts his hand before, “Give me five rupees. Give me five rupees.” Unless and until you assume these powers you are still uncertain, but you have got them. And this is the point which is very difficult with the western mind specially, because they cannot believe that they can have these powers. They just can’t believe it! You tell them but they say, “How can that be?” But it is so.

Now for example, this instrument. If you take it to a village and tell them that this will carry your voices around, or if you take a, say, a television set and tell them that you can see all kinds of cinemas, or we can say, a drama and play or music out of this – he is not going to believe it. He’ll say, “This box? This looks like an ordinary wooden box.” But when you plug in, it shows its power. In the same way, what you look at human beings as something very, very ordinary, mundane thing – for us we take it for granted, ourselves, we don’t know how glorified we are, how great we are, how God has created us with such difficulty, with such care, with such love; for a very special purpose, that He wants to bestow all His powers upon you. He wants you to enter into the Kingdom of God and to enjoy His blessings, His love. It is something that we cannot believe; we are so frustrated, we are so disgusted with ourselves, with our societies, with everything. But it’s not so, it’s not so. It just has to happen. You are just to be plugged in to the mains and it works, and it works. It has worked. It has worked with thousands, and it should work with you.

But the absurd ideas people have, which is the conception they have that you can pay for it. I mean, how can you pay for anything that is living? Have you ever paid anything for that is living? Like, have you paid anything for getting a fruit out of a flower? Can you pay to the flower? “All right, I’ll give you one pound, give me a fruit!” Will it work out? It’s that absurd, that you cannot pay for the living God, you cannot pay for the living experience and you cannot pay for the evolutionary process. It is spontaneous, it is within ourselves, it works out.

But we understand money so much that we can’t understand that is free, though we have got so many things free. So many things we have got free, still we don’t understand the importance of free things, because we think whatever is free cannot be great. Actually, all great things have to be free, otherwise we won’t exist, we won’t live. If we didn’t get air to breathe freely, we’ll not exist. If it happens sometimes in the airplane or some place, you should see, then people realise the importance of those free things which we take it for granted.

So one has to understand the conception that we have about God, about achieving Him, about getting into ourselves, is also faulty. We think that supposing we stand on our heads, we’ll get it. I mean, standing on our heads if we can get God, then in all evolutionary process they should have stood on their heads! Or we think that by running these races we’ll get it, or by eating this kind of food or that kind of food, or by doing this or that we’ll get it – is wrong. But then you may ask that why all these people in religions said “Thou shall not commit this, thou shall not do that”? They said it because these are the things which are required for our sustenance, for our balancing as a human being. We lose our balance if we do not do these things. We have to have the balance; that’s why it was said, “Don’t do it.” Human beings have a capacity to go to extremes. I mean, you tell them something – I have known people, you just tell them that to cure this particular centre you have to do this asana or you have to do this kind of a thing. They will do it hundred times, thousand times in one day. I mean, I never asked them, I said just once in a while you do it, or once a week – they’ll do it hundred times.

We go to extremes. And that’s why, to strike the balance, these people told us, “Don’t do this, don’t do that, don’t do that.” But then in our ego we say, “Why not? What’s wrong?” All right, go ahead. When we tell children, “Don’t smoke” “Why not? All my friends are smoking, I’ll smoke.” All right, go ahead – smoke, get cancer, then you’ll have a hole here, breathe through that. After sometime this will go away, the nose will go away, and you’ll be moving like a machine looking at everyone: you can’t talk, you cannot live like a normal person. Then you, one realises that, “Oh God, I wish I had not smoked.” But in Sahaja Yoga we don’t say, “Don’t smoke”, because half of the people will walk off. We never say “Don’t drink,” never say anything “don’t.” We say, “All right, you are doing it, it’s all right.” Let this happen.

As soon as this happens you just give up yourself, because when you have found the highest, then you don’t care for all these small things. All your habits drop out automatically, I don’t have to force you for that. You have everything within you, that power, like you get lifted up. Like a lotus that rises out of the mire by its own force, you come up and your fragrance fills that mire, and you are amazed at it yourself.

First you are identified with that mire, and you think that this is what it is – but it’s not so. When it comes up, that lotus, it spreads its beautiful petals, and the fragrance gives us that personality which spreads all over. And that’s what is going to happen to you. All of you are going to be that lotus which looks hidden, which is absolutely invisible within you, which is going to open out, and the fragrance of your divinity is going to spread.

Now today I cannot cover all the centres, because if I start covering all the centres it will be a very lengthy thing. I have covered three centres as you have seen: the Mooladhara Chakra, the Swadishthana and the Nabhi Chakra, and others I’ll cover later on tomorrow. But I must talk about the Spirit, about which we are talking for ages now that we have to become the Spirit. Now English language, as you know, “spirit” can be anything. It’s a very ambiguous word: even to alcohols we call it spirits, even to the dead souls we call them spirits, and even to the Spirit that is we are, the pure being which is called as “atma” in Sanskrit language, we call the word “spirit.” Here I am saying, talking about that Spirit which is the pure being within you, which is a detached being within you, which is the witness within you, which sees you all the time, which watches you, which resides within you as joy and happiness in the heart. It resides in the heart. This Spirit is not in our conscious mind, is not in our central nervous system, is not under our control. To give it an analogy, I say that the left side within us is like the brake and the right side is like an accelerator in a car. Now in the car we are learning driving, sitting in the front seat, and there is the master watching at the back and seeing the whole play.

Now what you do is to go to the left – means sometimes you put the brake, sometimes you put the accelerator, make mistakes, and then you learn how to drive. That learning how to drive is the wisdom part of it, which comes to us through balancing our lives. Balance is the most important thing to begin with. But even if you don’t have balance – I have seen in Sahaja Yoga very imbalanced people get into the balance.

Now this balancing left and right, or say, of the brake and the accelerator, gives you a position where you can say now you have mastered the driving. But still there is the master sitting at the back. Then you become the master. The master is the Spirit within you.

You become the Spirit, and you start watching yourself as a driver. The whole thing becomes like a play, like a drama; that you separate yourself and start seeing everything happening before your eyes, everything happening just like a drama outside you, and you are not the part and parcel of it.

So you enter into the area of your axis, and the periphery loses its impact on you. You become a person who is silent, blissful, quiet, and sees the periphery, the movement of the periphery, but you are not in it. That’s how you become the master, that’s how you become the prophet. But Sahaja Yoga today has a power to make the prophets out of the men of God, and these prophets will have power to make others prophet – so says William Blake*, the great poet of this country. And that’s exactly what Sahaja Yoga is. He predicted it hundred years back. And today if you come to Sahaja Yoga, you’ll be amazed what you are. Whatever he has predicted about England being the Jerusalem of tomorrow, that tomorrow is today. This country of yours, England – which is so far, I don’t know if people understand are aware of what this country is, which is the heart of the universe, which is the most important part of the universe – has to become the Jerusalem. For that, the Englishmen have to come out of their inertia to see what are their potentials, to rise up to that point, and that’s going to work out. It’s already is working very well in London.

Of course, we can’t have too many people because plastics can be produced in the machines in thousands, but if you have to have something living it takes time. But once it takes time, once it comes to its maturity, I’m sure this great country is going to assume that status of becoming Jerusalem, the place of worship where people have to come to worship. It’s very surprising, things are happening with Sahaja Yoga, the flower daisy which never had any fragrance, if you go and see, now is having fragrance. Most of the English flowers had no fragrance, they were known by that. Most of the flowers are now having tremendous fragrance. You can see for yourself.

All these things are working by nature, are worked out, they are coming- but what about human beings? Where are they? What are they doing? Where are they lost? This is a very sad thing. I came to London just by chance, I should say, or maybe that is pre-arranged. My husband got elected to this job and he had to come. And this agency of the UN is only placed here. It’s in England. It’s nowhere else. You have only one agency of the UN, that is in England for which My husband got elected, and so I am here. Otherwise, I don’t think I could have come here like a Guru, because I don’t have any other interest but this.

And I could not have come here otherwise, because uninvited I would not come to a country, but I came here as invited person. It’s all working out. Only you people have to work it out yourself, and understand not only the dynamism, the vitality, but the greatest importance is that at this point you are standing on the verge of destruction or construction.

And the English people have a special place. They have to rise up to it, because they are the cells of the heart. I’ll have this lecture tomorrow again. I’ll hope you’ll come and make it comfortable. Sorry for My throat, I have been speaking day in and day out, every day. Thank you very much.

If you have any questions, I would like to answer them. Can I have (answers) , questions from you and then I�ll answer. You said You could cure after Self-Realization. His problem is that his mother is deaf. Can You fix that hearing problem? You see this question is such that it makes you feel that I am a person who have to cure everyone. You are sadly mistaken. It’s a by-product of awakening of the Kundalini, you get cured. I’m sorry for that, that you have this understanding that I’m here to cure all the people. I should settle down in a hospital. But main thing is Kundalini has to be awakened to get you cured. All right? If your mother was here we could work it out. But the main thing you must understand, that God has lot of common sense as we have, and He is only interested in such lights as we are, which will work out His work. Those who are, say, very sick people, extremely sick, can get cured in a second. You’ll be amazed I’ll tell you, our President of India, he went to America for his treatment and it failed. And he was going back to India. And I went to see him as Mrs. So and So. But the High Commissioner told him that I’m So and So and he had heard My name in India.

His wife said, “Why don’t you cure my husband?” And he was just on his last … they had prepared everything for his last rites in India. I just put My hand on his back for ten minutes, you won’t believe, he had not slept for days together with pain, he said, “My pain is relieved, I want to sleep”, and he got up, he was perfectly all right. He walked down, people had brought stretchers and things. He just walked down. They couldn’t believe their eyes. But this has happened because he is going to be used for the work of God.

In our house if you have lights which are never going to give light, we don’t bother about them. We sell them in the junk. In the same way, the Divine doesn’t cure people, all of them. It does many thousands but some of the people who are very sick, He says, “All right. You go through the second cycle. All right? Come back purified, rested and then it works out.” So not necessarily that everybody will be cured, not necessarily. But so many have got cured and it has worked. But that’s not our main job, is to give cures to people. No.

It is to give realisation to people and as a by-product as you said, of course if she gets realisation, her deafness will go away. Many people have cured their deafness. Not only deafness but even bald headed people have got hair. He had no hair on his head when he came to Me, but I don’t say; that after realisation and before realisation, so tremendous that it’s better to take photographs before realisation and see yourself – dump sometimes! After realisation people, see, they have got their photographs before realisation, they have thrown them away. It is different. But the main thing is not curing, it’s the Self-realization. That’s the main thing! And age has no problem. Yesterday I think in Birmingham, we gave realisation to somebody who was a very, very old man. So age has no consideration, health has no consideration, nothing of the kind. Everyone can get it and should try to get it. All right? So if you can get her, we’ll work it out. But I don’t promise anything. All right? May God bless you.

Of course, Self-realization I promise! That I promise. If you have patience with yourself as I have with you. You have to have patience. Any other question please? He has had chest problems for last four or five years. Is there any way You can help him? Of course, that can be helped. Yes, chest problem like breathing trouble or what? Breathing trouble? Is he an Indian? Asthma. Are you an Indian? Ahh, Indians you know. They take so much bath. They still think they are in India. Everyday take bath in the morning and then go out. Isn’t it? That should not be done. This is England. We should take bath in the night. We should live like English people. They are great bathers. Indians are great bathers, you see, they must have bath every day whether it is zero degrees or minus twelve degrees. They must have bath, you see, it’s a habit formation they have got. They don’t feel all right without a bath and that’s how they develop, but in any case we’ll cure your asthma. All right? It’s not so difficult. But one should not take too much bath in England. I would suggest that if you want to take bath, take it in the night as the English people do, because it’s a very treacherous climate. And if you take your bath and get out of your bath, you are definite to catch these troubles in the chest. Not only that but arthritis and all these things come out of this. This is very indiscriminating in this country. The climate is such you have to be careful. I mean, one should not postpone bathing forever. Because, you see, when I say something I must give the other extreme also.

But we are great bathers, no doubt you see. Personal cleanliness is too much with Indians, too much. But general cleanliness or you can say the collective cleanliness is more here, you see. Like mowing the lawn and looking after the cleanliness of the roads and all much better. I mean, we have to combine these things. It’s important. That can work out. All right? Asthma is not such a problem. What else? In what way does it work out? We have a centre within us which is the centre of Shri Rama on the right hand side, we call it the right heart. And, if we can cure that centre of yours, you’ll be all right. All right? We’ll work it out. We’ll tell you how to do it. How many thousands of years does the yoga date back from?, she said. Which yoga you mean? Yoga as being the spontaneous Yoga has been there throughout. You see, what is spontaneous is living. And the living process has been there throughout. So we cannot say when it started. We can say when it got separated. When God and His Power separated and God started watching the whole thing as a witness, the God Almighty, and His Power started working it out, it created all the universes, it created our universe out of which it created now human beings. And now, it has to become one again. That creation has to know its Creator.

One, two, three, four – there have been always few people getting this connection, but today is the time for en masse evolution. So, for a growth of life you cannot give any time. You can’t say when it started, how many years back it has been on. But today is the blossom time when many have to get the blessings of yoga. All right? Thank you.

What is it? You spoke about Kundalini. For the ordinary person, it’s very difficult to awaken. Ah, who’s told you that? It’s not so. You see it is these abnormal people when they talk about Kundalini they call it abnormal because they don’t know how to do it. It’s the easiest thing to do. It’s the easiest thing to do if you are an awakened person. Even a child can do it. It’s those people who say that Kundalini is very difficult are the people who have no idea of Kundalini at all. They are not masters. For a master what is difficult? And even an ordinary can become a master, then what is difficult? These are not masters. These are people absolutely naive, money makers, useless people. They write books without knowing anything about Kundalini.

They are the misguiding people. It’s the easiest thing to do. Just under your hand it will move, you will see it moving up and you will see it pulsating on the head. It’s not at all difficult. I told you it’s the most vital thing that has to happen and all that is vital has to be free and easy – sahaja. Why? In India we had Nanaka who said, “Sahaja samaadhi laago. Sahaja samaadhi laago.” Nobody said it is difficult.

Kabira never said it. He said, “Paacho pachiso pakar bulau ek hi dor bandhahu.” I’ll get twenty-five people together and put them onto one thread.

Those who had the authority always talked like that. Nobody said it is difficult. It’s only these people who do not know the job, who have no authority, talk like that. Don’t believe them. It’s the easiest thing to do. You will see yourself. But supposing it is easiest, then why should we deny it? Supposing I’ve got the diamond for you free, won’t you see it, won’t you have it? Or are we going to feel, “Oh it’s very difficult. How can we do?” When I am saying it is easy. You don’t have to pay for it. All right? What’s it? No, that’s correct. Sit down, sit down. All right, all right. Please sit down. I’ll tell you. That’s the method people tried. It doesn’t work out that way. Say, your car, is something wrong with your car, all right? Now, can you clean it from sitting inside it? Can you put it right? You have to get out of it. So first the Kundalini rising has to be done. You see, people have confused everything. Even in Hatha Yoga where there are ashtangas, first thing is Ishwar Pranidhana. First is the establishment of God! First you have to be connected with God.

Even in Christianity you have to be baptized first. Of course, it’s an artificial one, forget it, but you have to be baptised. Even as a Hindu you have to be christened in a way what you call a Yagnopavita, is done at the age of eight years. That’s what realisation is. Or Mohammed Sahib and all these people use Sumta (no thoughts), that’s the same thing. So the first thing is to get your realisation. It doesn’t mean that you become a master. But awakening of the Kundalini and then with the growth of the Kundalini you become a master. This was the real process but they have put it upside down now. How can you cleanse yourself unless and until you get out of it?

Supposing My sari is spoilt, I have to take out My sari and clean it. Isn’t it? And that’s why it is difficult. That is it. It’s a confusion they have created. And don’t believe in all these stories. If you try to suppress your ego, it will sit on your head. Never it will run away. If you try to suppress your super-ego, it will never help you. But here automatically it happens, and how it happens I’ll tell you tomorrow. By awakening these deities within yourself these things are sucked in. Kundalini awakens and does it. And last of all, if you want Me to confess, there is something special about Me that I can do it. Must be something. If you don’t crucify Me, I’ll say that much, not more. You better find out. Otherwise the first thing you will do is to crucify Me. I don’t want it anymore. All right? May God bless you.

Yes, My child? It’s not any surgery needed for that. In Sahaja Yoga, we have techniques, divine techniques by which we open our heart. The confusion is on another line also, and this confusion has led us into problem.

You see, the confusion is about how our relationships should be to ourselves, to others and to the society. There’s a big confusion that started long time back. When the Smritis were written, or we can say when the religion was practiced it was just the other way round.

We started doing everything and that’s how we have lost that capacity.

The attitude towards ourselves should be that we should try to perfect ourselves. It’s absolutely tyrannical I tell you. When I tried to perfect Sahaja Yoga, I am tyrannical towards Myself.

The amount of work I take out of this body and the amount of exertions I can put in out of this body, the stretching of My complete patience to a great extent – I work it out.

I mean, normally you know, people get just clenched up, “Oh Mother, this is too much. We can’t bear.” You have seen it yourself. But you have to be really tyrannical to perfect yourself. That should be the way we should work it out towards ourselves. And towards others it should be an ideal relationship.

Like now you have a brother, he is your brother – should be ideal brother. If he is your father, he should be an ideal. But such a confusion! The more enlightened, so-called, you become, the more elevated you become, the confusion is: who is your sister, who is your mother, who is your father? Then the relationship between the Sahaja yogis also becomes confused.

You are Sahaja Yogis, you are all prophets, you must respect each other. You are all prophets, you speak the same language. You have to love each other. It’s not rational, it has to happen to you because the relationship has to be established, that relationship, that ideal relationship. So many people now you have known that get angry with Me, “Mother, You are too patient with the Sahaja yogis.” But they are My children. I have to perfect Myself, and My relationship with them should be ideal. I have to go to a great extent forgiving them so that they come up. So relationship with others should be ideal. Are you an ideal father? Are you an ideal mother? Are you an ideal sister and a brother? Are you an ideal citizen towards others? But the society has to be pragmatic. The society has to work it out pragmatically, and the pragmatic working out comes by changing.

Supposing today I would say that for India we don’t need vegetarianism. For England we need vegetarianism. It’s all pragmatic. The society has to be pragmatic.

Here, we are pragmatic about ourselves, not about the society, we are pragmatic about ourselves. Everything works out. “What’s wrong?” A woman who has children will run away with another man. “What’s wrong?” Or a woman who has children can sell the country for the sake of her children. “What’s wrong?” So this confusion within us creates this problem, and that’s how we do not know how to open out ourselves. If we could get rid of our confusions, it could be all right. It can be done through Sahaja Yoga. All these confusions have been created by half-baked people I would say.

Like there’s nothing wrong with the incarnations, with the prophets, nothing wrong with them, they are perfect people. What is wrong with us is our attitude. And if we can discriminately use our attitude towards ourselves, towards others and towards the society, everything will work out. It’s going to be beautiful.

Because of this confusion our heart is closed. We are frightened of others. What is there to be frightened? Relationship is ideal. What can we do? Your relationship as far as they are concerned, your relationship, your heart is ideal. Whatever they do is not the point. Whatever I do for them has to be ideal. I have to go on loving them. I have to go on admiring them, encouraging them, sustaining them and giving them what I have to do as My relationship has to. Say for example, a source of water that is under the Mother Earth – does it think what kind of a tree it is, what sort of things it is doing?

It just gives its source, its water. In the same way, because you are the source, so the relationship has to be ideal. These confusions have worked out and rationally we have accepted all these confusions. And this has led us into this kind of a trap that our hearts are closed.

All right?

Yogi explains the question of a seeker: Can you explain the difference between Sahaja Yoga and Kriya Yoga?

Shri Mataji: Oh! In a way it is just the same or in a way it is juxtaposition.

Like I would say with you real Realization or real baptism through Kundalini awakening while there are priests who give baptism, too. This baptism and that baptism is in juxtaposition.

In the same way when Kundalini rises, Kriya Yog takes place within ourselves. Something goes into Kriya, into action. The action is that when Kundalini rises, it’s a tremendous force that is rising and it’s a very unique happening and the whole body is prepared for that.

And when it rises, a kind of a wave of action takes place in the body. Like peristaltic movement we have when we digest our food, in the same way.

When Kundalini rises a some sort of a muscular contraction takes place which keeps the risen Kundalini upward and then it dilates, it opens out and then it contracts. All these things take place automatically within ourselves. As we start the car, every machinery starts working.

In the same way the Kriya takes place actually within ourselves. So the Kriya takes place within us in Sahaja Yoga. All are subsidiary to Sahaja Yoga, means the Yoga itself. But all these things take place inside ourselves.

But on the contrary we can do one thing: without starting the car we can start moving the wheel. That is Kriya Yoga, so-called. So that is at juxtaposition with the real Kriya Yoga which is spontaneous, built-in within us. You don’t have to do anything, you are meant for it. I have seen people. Their tongues are cut. They are wagging their tongues. Very old people in India have got this from somebody from America. Horrible fellow. They cut their tongues and their tongues are wagging like this. They are useless people. One doctor was like that, one doctor. A seeker, imagine a seeker being ruined like that. I said, “Why? Why did you do that?” He said, “We are supposed to do Khechari.”

Khechari is a thing where you cut the tongue, put it back and try to touch this back side with the tongue tip. Can you imagine? As it call as dawedi raveni pranayams – these are of no use.

These things have ruined the path of Kundalini. I have seen the Kundalini being hurt, wounded. She just tosses Her head all sides. This is the ego of man, he thinks, “I can do it and I’ll go to any extent to do it.” Forget it. It’s so simple. Just like an enlightened light, enlightened candle can enlighten another candle. It works out that simple ways. Don’t do all these things to yourself. If you are a real seeker, just forget it. Don’t ruin yourself.

There’s nothing you did to ruin yourself. This is done because they are earnest seekers. Their ego is pampered that you can do it, they do it.

In Sahaja Yoga, you don’t have to do anything till you are Realized. Like the people who don’t know how to swim are told, You keep silent. We’ll try to bring you to the shore.” So they are brought to the shore, they are taught how to swim, how to save people and then they save the people. You don’t have to do anything till you get your real Realization and the mastery over it. Unless and until you become the master you are not to do anything. You have to become the master first. It takes hardly any time to become the master. It’s too good to believe, but it is true. Everything that is perfect looks like that. Isn’t it?

[Someone in the audience says something that is inaudible.]

Shri Mataji: Yes, now for shoes. I mean, even there people have an argument with Me, “Why shoes?” So I better give explanation otherwise again they will stand up and say, “Why shoes?” Because shoes, we are so identified with them.

You see, shoes these days, in modern times especially, they make, you see, the soles with not leather but something else and they insulate you. As it is, shoes do insulate you from the Mother Earth. And to take the help of Mother Earth, we have to take out the shoes, but even that upsets people, you know. Can you imagine? But if you ask them to cut their tongues they don’t mind.

They want it to be absolutely Sahaja. When it is Sahaja, it has to be extremely Sahaja, that why take out the shoe. Isn’t it interesting the way we are? It is such a play, such a beauty. All right, let’s take out our shoes and be in cheerful mood. There’s nothing serious going on here.

Just take out your shoes, that’s all. Now put your hands towards Me please, just like this. Both the hands and close your eyes. Please don’t keep your eyes open. That’s important. Again, the same Kriya Yoga as you were saying, when the Kundalini rises, first time when She touches this center here. This center is placed on the optic chiasma. There’s a dilation of the pupil and that’s why if your eyes are not closed, it won’t rise. It’s just other way round in hypnosis. So please keep your eyes shut, please. And, be kind to yourself, be kind. Don’t judge yourself by thinking you are guilty. This is the first mantra we tell people, in the West especially where everybody seems to be guilty about something – I don’t know what, something unknown. It’s catching on this finger as they say. Please, before starting anything, just say in your heart, “Mother, I am not guilty.”

There’s nothing to feel guilty. After all, what guilt can you have? What wrong can you do which cannot be engulfed by love of God? So just don’t feel guilty for anything.

Maybe in My lecture I might have said that this doing is not good and that – doesn’t matter. It makes no difference to Me. Whatever style it is, I know how to do the job. So just don’t feel guilty at all. Just say, “Mother, I am not guilty.” That is very important because it blocks this horrible Vishuddhi. With this guilt you develop all this spondylitis on the left side and all kinds of problem. So better say, “Mother, I am not guilty.” One simple thing, “Mother, I am not guilty.”

Now close your eyes.

Please do not feel guilty, please. Say again and again that, “Mother, I am not guilty.”

Please don’t open your eyes, just don’t open your eyes, please.

Please put your right hand, don’t open your eyes and put your right hand on your heart. Then ask a question in your heart, “Mother, am I the Spirit?” Ask the question. It’s very simple question but this question will establish itself. Just ask the question in a humble way, “Mother, am I the Spirit?” Please say it twelve times.

This answer itself will give you a cool breeze in the hand flowing.

[Shri Mataji blows thrice in the microphone]

Now you put your hand on top of your head where the fontanel bone area is, where you had a very soft bone which is called as Taloo.

Just see if there’s a cool breeze coming out of it. You may ask one question to Me, because I cannot force it onto you, you have to ask for it. You have to ask for your Realization saying, “Mother, please give me my Realization.” I cannot force it to you. Your freedom is to be respected. If you want to go to hell, you can go. Or, if you want to go to heaven, it can be worked out also. So, please ask Me for Realization. Actually, I don’t give it, but this works out that way.

Recording ends here

Shri Mataji Nirmala Devi

*(about William Blake)