Conversation (Evening)

Gregoire's Flat, Vienna (Austria)

1982-09-27 Evening at Gregoire's Vienna, Austria, Opt version, 93'
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1982-0927 Evening at Gregoire`s flat Vienna, Austria

Many people mother were very interested and asking and Mother, many people were asking and very interested and they wanted to know more about you and they are going to come tomorrow.

Vibrations were so cool.

Shri Mataji: very cool vibrations. They had come today after ___0:29__ I must say it was very great the translation, because I speak quite complicated.

Gregoire: first of all the picture too much, too much too much. Now I translate.

Yogini: which page.

Gregoire: these days the Kundalini power will also be in Vienna awakened. And then the title, the breath of God blows over the top of the head and in the palms of the hand. Now the text, and then on your picture it is written `feminine Guru Mataji`. Then at the last a Guru who does not take any money. Shri Mataji Nirmala Devi called Mataji by Her disciples also simply Mother, is in Vienna. She is in London, married to a high diplomat. She does not need any material support, and from 1970 onwards, she teaches the world wide Sahaja Yoga then we quote spontaneous link between the everyday being, living and risen with our deeper divine being, soul of being and this comes from the information which is distributed during the seminars and the conferences which She gives. According to Shri Mataji is actualized as in the human being the sleeping potential spiritual energy of Kundalini the energy of the holy spirit will be awakened.

Shri Mataji: Is awakened.

Gregoire: Then the power serpent can be dangerous. Kundalini the power serpent who from the center under the sexual organs through the spine up to the top of the head climb and Rudolf Steiner knew about it and who said that it can be dangerous. Shri Mataji spoke from this danger to the Kurier to this newspaper and to the numerous visitors to her first program in Vienna. Kundalini is completely and totally is not dangerous at all. I am sorry Mother it is a little bit difficult to get that.

Shri Mataji: alright.

Gregoire: no doubt, the uncomplicated Indian experience when Mother work with them, up to 99% from the Indians can experience of this Kundalini. In the west, there are much less because there are some big obstacles, those are identified by these feminine guru is a confusion and cowardness which men maintain in them the obstacles to the Kundalini is the confusion and cowardness which men live and also with because of the inflated ego and because of the conditioning of the materialism and science because of the book knowledge which repress the spontaneity as also in the shameless marketing of what cannot be sold like breath and god for instance.

Shri Mataji: ___ 8:30___ should take this thing at all.

Gregoire: all those who in the name of God take money are parasites she says. But the worst are the `thief gurus` as she call them who in the western wisdom which thanks to the western wisdom can provide spiritual evolution. Would you like to translate mother.

Shri Mataji: forbidden.

Gregoire: try to fool you with these kinds of calls.

Yogini: and according to Shri Mataji lots of these gurus are devils who use unclean spirits in order to suppress the people and to use them. Maharishi Mahesh, the founder of the ___ 10:44__ and the author of the recent book about _____10:58___. Lots of people talk to him ____11:07__ sex for sex.

Shri Mataji: what?

Gregoire: and not to forget the Rajneesh who is sex obsessed.

Shri Mataji: but this is not __11:20__ to Me.

Gregoire: sorry.

Yogini: she says that we are against all these people.

Shri Mataji: she asked me so I said yes I am against this ___11:39__.

Yogini: she says it is a fact this is ___11:46__ you mother. She says all of them make a pile of money. Shri Mataji says with complete distained anger that all of these gurus eat and drink and they have women and they are really rich. And that is the best proof that they are kind no realized souls. And the realized souls are all in the Himalayas and in the jungles of India. When Shri Mataji tries to awaken the Kundalini in her listeners, and they all feel the breath of God which is the cool breeze on their hands and on their heads. And then she explains how to meditate. And actual fact is that the people who have seen Shri Mataji say that they have such experience. And Shri Mataji promises further experiences like this and increase in depth of the experience through programs. And then it says today we will go __13:15__.

Shri Mataji: good fellow.

Gregoire: sorry no no, he has said that tomorrow and Thursday at time in Urania.

Shri Mataji: you see even if tomorrow radio __13:54__ is not coming this is going to work out.

Gregoire: so I will take need a hall tomorrow.

Shri Mataji: both are big places you know.

Gregoire: I can have a big hall in a single day immediately.

Shri Mataji: in the same place.

Gregoire: in the same place in a single day, I think I have to ask you mother because if it is correct for you because it is downstairs. It is like an amphitheatre, so everybody is above you and you are like in the.

Shri Mataji: doesn’t matter.

Gregoire: doesn’t matter.

A yogi: it is a cinema.

Gregoire: it is like a cinema, yes.

Yogi: it is a cinema.

Gregoire: _____14:25___.

Yogini: and then she says and if anybody __14:44__ all they need to do is to look at the picture of Shri Mataji with a flame in front of it and wait for the vibrations. Sometimes it takes a long time, lots and lots of other problems have to be solved first before Kundalini can arise. For example, if you used tobacco, alcohol, drugs and certain kinds of sex the situation of the chakras will be destroyed.

Shri Mataji: yes, will be destroyed ___15:19___

Yogini: and when they are disturbed then the Kundalini can’t flow, and then there is no chance of realization. Shri Mataji says that the Kundalini is a lot more than this. It is the holy power of the last judgment and everybody becomes their own judge.

Gregoire: he has picked up all the points.

Shri Mataji: beautiful.

Yogi: it is the best article mother we have had.

Shri Mataji: it is one of the best I must say. Thank you very much, I was overjoyed.

Gregoire: everybody I am going to call tomorrow. And everybody is his own judge who can see himself in his Kundalini as in mirror.

Shri Mataji: because I fix him on the point of reflection. Remember that.

Yogini: it says many people who could not take part in this have to be people who are humble and if their ego is too swollen then they won’t be able to experience it. But in actual fact nobody is shut out and nobody is forbidden to have this awakening.

Gregoire: from the beginning.

Yogini: although certain numbers of people or certain groups of people for example politicians in the west have so much ego that they can’t.

Gregoire: that their spiritual lumination is almost impossible. Bolo bolo Jaganmata Shri Mataji Nirmala Devi ki jaya. Mother it’s I bow to him mother.

Shri Mataji: really very great.

Gregoire: I bow to him.

Shri Mataji: the ego of the politicians is so much.

A yogi: did he have his realization mother?

Shri Mataji: yes, he has.

A yogi: that is why he talks ___ 17:35__

Shri Mataji: beautiful, one of the best article I have had.

Gregoire: absolutely mother, and the picture.

Shri Mataji: the picture is very sweet, it is written something about yoga over here.

Yogini: yes Mother, something that has nothing to do with egoism.

Gregoire: what?

Yogi: doesn’t matter, doesn’t matter

Shri Mataji: what does he say?

A yogi: not interesting Mother.

Shri Mataji: she is good at English. You are English or you are German?

Yogini: I am English mother.

Shri Mataji: that is why you speak so good English. But how do you know German then?

Yogini: I did German at the university mother. At the university I learn German and I lived in Germany a lot.

Shri Mataji: Sofia is very sweet I tell you so direct you see.

Yogi: mother we were talking with her but may be it would be a good idea if you agree that next year she would come and join us in Germany for a while so that we could start together Sahaja Yoga. What do you think about that mother?

Shri Mataji: a very good idea and also a little English you see naturally it is a difficult subject and sometimes I use my words little freely about English I am not such a master of English but whatever I know you see she finds it difficult to, sometimes sometimes, but she helped her a lot so I was wondering how is it that she know English so much.

Yogi: she could help us a lot mother because of this.

Gregoire: mother you know how many copies of this newspaper are 800,000.

Shri Mataji: really?

Gregoire: yes, 800,000 of Shri Mataji Nirmala Devi circulating in Austria. We will need a statue tomorrow.

Yogi: there are about 1.8 million people living in Vienna. If there are 7 million people in Austria it means that actually everyone has the chance of getting it.

Yogini: Austria will be very vibrated now.

Shri Mataji: the whole of Austria or.

Gregoire: the whole of Austria. It is about the most read newspaper. The whole of Austria of course.

Yogini: Mother your blessings are coming upon this country.

Yogi: we don’t know whether we are dreaming or whether we are awakened Mother.

Yogi: everyone who was so interested, this boy you know who was sitting in front of you know that he was asking very interesting questions, he talked to me I said what is all this about. I think I felt something but I am not sure. He said but I want to know some more about the left side. I said well the left side when you feel guilty, you will feel left side and you have problem with the left side. And when you don’t forgive people, you will be left. He said oh I have two people I will not forgive. I said those two people are going to make you very ill because they are gone a sort of eat your brain these two people, you should forget them. And he said, well I don’t think so. I said, well come tomorrow and she will learn you how to forgive.

Shri Mataji: You should have told him right hand up and left hand towards Me. He is better now.

Yogi: he was better now. He was very interested about everything.

Shri Mataji: people are good here; I must say they are sound people comparatively. What Catherine was saying because I said about Freud they left Me is it?

Gregoire: what is it mother?

Shri Mataji: I think the idea was that because I talked about Freud and that is why they left.

Gregoire: I mean 1 or 2 had to leave afterwards.

Shri Mataji: 1 or 2 only that is what I felt. People left earlier and 1 or 2 left after I talked about her sex.

Gregoire: I must say humbly that I suffered with the translation. Yes, the translation was really not good you see. In ___22:04__           it was really not good. She missed many points, many points. The problem is that verbally she is not really strong enough. If she translates she has to take the mike.

Yogi: may be Mother I can try may be.

Shri Mataji: she is good at translation.

Gregoire: anyway tomorrow may be she is no more there Sofia, tomorrow evening Sofia is no more there so we need somebody else.

Shri Mataji: she can do. Give her a mike.

Gregoire: I will have to check if whether we have a mike mother.

Yogi: in the new hall if we take the bigger one they could —

Shri Mataji: you both should sit together and you can do it. You and she.

Yogi: mother I felt that when I am doing the introduction, I have spoken for about 20 minutes and it was without any difficulties as far as the language is considered.

Shri Mataji: so let him translate and she could stand there just to help him.

Yogi: yes Mother we could try mother tomorrow and if there are words that I cannot.

Shri Mataji: who will give the introduction though?

Yogini: today.

Shri Mataji: no no tomorrow.

Gregoire: introduction I, why not or anybody.

Shri Mataji: you can give introduction then they can translate.

Gregoire: who else could do the introduction?

Shri Mataji: no, it is alright you can give introduction tomorrow and these two can translate finished.

Yogi: who.

Gregoire: Arno and Madhuri and Catherine also speaks in German.

Shri Mataji: just write it down the hints.

Yogini: she is a little bit Mother she is a bit sugar ego.

Shri Mataji: how did she receive this problem?

Gregoire: Mother the cook told me, the pujari and the cook told me that the dinner is ready.

Shri Mataji: pujari, from doctor

Gregoire: mother I have to make a present to the pujari Mother so I have already something in my __ 24:19__ to bless it.

Shri Mataji: the pujari to cook what vaidya. Khansama, you see he is the cook, in Sanskrit language.

Yogi: it is something like bawarchi Shri Mataji. I tell you what it is. I have hooked it up over there.

Shri Mataji: paakashala. Paakshala they say to it, simple way paakkarta.

Yogini: excuse me Shri Mataji; you were saying something about her.

Shri Mataji: she has left side problem and heart.

Shri Mataji: why?

Yogini: she has problem with her mother and her mother had problems also and as far as I understood that her mother was also doing some kind of parapsychology things and spiritism and no, no sorry.

Shri Mataji: what is her problem?

Yogini: her mother is not enough detached too attached to her, is too possessive. Her mother is fully possessive.

Shri Mataji: father, she has no father.

Yogini: oh yes, her father is living.

Shri Mataji: what does he do?

Yogini: he is employee, he is working.

Shri Mataji: and her mother?

Yogini: she does not work, she is at home.

Shri Mataji: __26:54__

Yogini: she has one sister.

Shri Mataji: is married?

Yogini: no Mother.

Shri Mataji: but what is wrong? Is her mother is always like that? In which way, you don’t like her attachments?

Yogini: she says because it is a very egoistical attachment.

Shri Mataji: what sort?

Yogini: she says it is not pure love or pure affection. But it is a kind of interested, may be for herself for not being alone. She cannot describe it.

Shri Mataji: does she put her to ambitions?

Yogini: no her mother is not ambitious for her.

Shri Mataji: does she expect anything?

Yogini: no

Shri Mataji: what does she do for her? She cooks for you?

Yogini: yes.

Shri Mataji: does she give her money?

Yogini: yes.

Shri Mataji: then she loves you. Does she say that you shouldn`t go here and you shouldn`t go there?

Yogini: no.

Shri Mataji: but is it for bad or good?

Yogini: not for good reasons.

Shri Mataji: but there is nothing serious about that.

Gregoire: I thought you would listen to the puja hymn Mother, is it okay?

Shri Mataji: it is very good.

Gregoire: that we found such nice names for you Mother.

Shri Mataji: it is good. Would you like to ask the pujari if he, ask him, the pujari. This is what for the pujari.

Yogi: it is very beautiful.

Shri Mataji: so beautiful. This is in Vienna you got Gregoire? This is not, it is beautiful. Bahut sundar (Hindi: very beautiful)

Yogi: I got it in Rom Mother.

Shri Mataji: where?

Yogi: Rom.

Shri Mataji: it is very beautiful, Rom, I went you see, kitna sundar banaya hey (Hindi: they have made it very beautifully). Have you seen, how beautiful it is?

Yogi: yes I have seen. Very beautiful Shri Mataji.

Shri Mataji: (Hindi) for all of us is very good. You see whatever you give Me like this is going to use for Me because you put it in front of My photograph.

Gregoire: you see Mother, I owe him this because it is thank to him that my work is vibrated now.

Yogi: no, it was not thank to me.

Shri Mataji: very good ideas. Must say, two ideas he gave very good, one is about the pujan of the thought these things and the second idea was very good about is Nirmala.

Yogi: for about one year now Shri Mataji I have the desire to see you worship with all your weapons.

Shri Mataji: so your desire is fulfilled and Gregoire desire is fulfilled also. What is this? This is a bomb.

Gregoire: no, this is specific mother, it is to grain, and it comes from Nepal, to bring the grain.

Shri Mataji: grain. I think it is not that it is for keeping the, what do you call tarkas, which keeps the arrows.

A yogi: that is what I thought when I first saw it.

Shri Mataji: it is for arrows only. It is not for grain, this is for arrows, you see, to keep it at the back. You see, the arrows to take out, that is what it is. It cannot be for grinding. How can we have a thing like this for grinding, little thing? It is only tarkas, we call it tarkas.

Yogini: it is for the great bowmen.

Shri Mataji: exactly. What you say to that in English?

Yogi: qviwer, and to the string.

Yogi: bow string.

Shri Mataji: in Sanskrit it is pratyancha. Because you see when we pull it, it makes a sound pratyancha.

Yogini: Beautiful.

Shri Mataji: (Hindi) it is very beautiful.

Gregoire: you like it Mother.

Shri Mataji: very much, very divine, it is very beautiful. (Hindi) It is very beautiful. We call it as deepawali, deepa is the light, awali is the line, line of deepas. Actually in India, there is no system of Mombatti (Candle) never we had this, surprisingly. They always used with ghee or something oil but never this Mombatti we never had, never can you imagine.

Yogi: for my puja Shri Mataji I use the mixture of olive oil, ghee and camphor.

Shri Mataji: that is very good for the eyes.

Yogi: it is much cheaper than candles to burn.

Shri Mataji: ghee is regarded as the best. Most auspicious is ghee. But ____35:28__

Yogi: I don’t know it doesn’t produce. I notice that with this it doesn’t burn the impurities as much as the properly. The vibrations are not so strong.

Shri Mataji: we never used and apart from that people used, it is a kind of a fact. Also they use in some Arabic countries and all that. ___35:54___ all the light.

Yogi: in Europe before they found oil, they used to use _35:57__ candles Shri Mataji.

Shri Mataji: are you alright, he has void, I don’t know why he has void. Left Agnya, void, you went to guru or something. Never.

Yogini: he made Hatha yoga and Kundalini yoga.

Shri Mataji: that’s why. From where, who taught you here? (In Hindi) is the food ready. So Mr. Cook, is the food ready?

Yogi: (Hindi) yes, Shri Mataji, the food is ready.

Shri Mataji: so the food is ready. Now serve the food alright, then we will come.

Yogi: he is my assistant Shri Mataji.

Shri Mataji: he is your assistant. If the cook is your assistant then what is going to happen to the people who are going to eat the food. (In Hindi) Rustam did you put ghee in the rice?

Yogi: (Hindi) I added enough ghee and also butter, how to say it, (German) I do not know anymore. (Hindi) There was no cardamom, cinnamon; it was not there in the house. Then I did with garam masala.

Yogini: he used to read many books, lots and lots of books.

Shri Mataji: void is very bad. Just go on saying, Mother I am my own guru. Better, much better. Now say another thing – Mother make me my own guru. Hmm, better. Now see your vibrations. Is much better, now see your vibrations. Good, excellent. Be nice to your mother, there is something wrong with her, you see, she will be alright. She has to trust you, alright.

Yogini: thank you.

Shri Mataji: come along, let her rub a little bit, poor thing. She has been translating and doing everything for Me. But her English is so good; I was amazed I said how can Germans speak such good English. I was wondering. Today, I met another Englishmen, suddenly; he spoke very good English you see. First I asked him and said are you German or a Christian. No he said I am English. I said, oh that is why you are good, come along I have come from the same country. You know really if you know one language you feel at home suddenly. Because you don’t understand any other language, you will get lost. We went to Paris I think or on our way back. You see I was listening to all kinds of things you see this language that language, so many. Then I went to the airport, to the Paris airport, the British airways air hostess, you see she started speaking English I was ____40:58__.  She was so kind. It happens, same in Sahaja Yoga, is the language of love, where you fight the language of ___41:13__. No you are the one the way you make ____41:18__.

Yogini: yes, Mother.

Gregoire: what did they Mother, did radio interview.

Shri Mataji: everyday, I had been waiting, today it was late. You see we didn’t want to have it because of parapsychology.

Gregoire: but when I asked, is he a seeker, you see first we took the vibrations of, that’s a good lesson, first we took his vibrations, we were with the Italians.

Shri Mataji: did you have My food. then

Gregoire: then they said, it is hot and it burns and so on.

Shri Mataji: you took every one of you, see bandhan.

Gregoire: yes, no, then I said okay forget it. I ask if he is a seeker. And then cool wind.

Shri Mataji: I said about parapsychology didn’t I. beautiful; he said I will make a good story for you.

Gregoire: people here seem to be.

Shri Mataji: he started calling Me mother, that’s the biggest thing.

Yogini: really.

Shri Mataji: yes, he did say twice, thrice, mother to me.

Yogi: it is so beautiful.

Gregoire: And for those who don’t know it yet, mother, radio interview, the men who come to interview mother, are in front of Mother and does like this.

Shri Mataji: yes, he did like that. I was amazed, you know. He has been to India, he speaks Hindi and writes Hindi and he said that he is not good in speaking but he can write and read.

Yogi: Mother the people from Swiss radio should take course here in Vienna.

Shri Mataji: what courses?

Yogi: I mean to courses to how to behave themselves. They should see how they behave themselves here, these people from the radio.

Shri Mataji: gradually everybody will be alright, I am sure. Everything is going to be alright.

Yogi: but it is so beautiful when you see what the people are ____.

Shri Mataji: to begin with you see, the second question he asked was about Mahesh yogi, because he had been cheated by Mahesh yogi. He said, “I give a lot of money for a silly mantra.” He said,” For a silly mantra, I paid him a lot of money.” “Yes I was one of them”, he said. You see, how cheated they must be feeling, isn’t it. He was quite angry. He asked Me, “If he is a fake don’t you think.” I said,” Yes, he is fake no doubt about it.” And he was angry with these satanology also I think.

Gregoire: Mother can I get my car back tomorrow morning.

Shri Mataji: ___44:35__ about that.

Yogi: you are a diplomat.

Gregoire: no, I will have absolutely no problem, just pay, they cannot.

Yogini: just pay the money.

Shri Mataji: really. They cannot stop but they will charge I mean they will ___44:50__ I hope they don’t ___44:53__

Gregoire: I am absolutely entitled to leave my car where I want to. I don’t have yet the plates of Vienna so you see I have the Italian plates.

Yogi: but you can change.

Gregoire: I didn’t want to have the Viennese plate too early. Because we were putting the posters of Sahaja Yoga okay, and then Mercedes, Catherine jumping putting poster, going back into the car, people were looking and looking at the plate number.

Shri Mataji: so you removed the plate numbers.

Gregoire: I have Italian plate numbers still; I still have Italian plate numbers.

Yogi: so probably someone call and they say there is an Italian putting what kind of.

Yogi: again Italians, yes.

Yogini: there is no “I” of Italy, so people must not know of which country.

Shri Mataji: but there is no D written on that, diplomatic.

Gregoire: CD yes, but they don’t know from which country.

Shri Mataji: so now we are not alone here alright.

Yogini: yes Mother.

Yogis: chai.

Shri Mataji: chai.

Yogi: spoon, Shri Mataji.

Yogi: smells very good.

Shri Mataji: (Hindi) did you make the big one.

Yogi: (Hindi) no, the small one.

Shri Mataji: (Hindi) small.

Yogi: (Hindi) it has become very smooth.

Shri Mataji: (Hindi) it will become smooth, it was not put that long. You should keep it.

Gregoire: is it okay a present, would you like to have a candle like the one I gave you,

Shri Mataji: what?

Gregoire: would you like it, this kind of.

Shri Mataji: yes, this, I like it but I don’t want it because you keep it. Everything you want to give away.

Yogini: as long as we have so much we can give away.

Yogi: would you like to have lemon.

Shri Mataji: lemon, no not for Me. yes, start, you all have it. Good, well done.

Gregoire: those who can, yes, those who can’t.

Shri Mataji: this kind of rice if you eat Gregoire, there are never problems with rice, because we take out all the starch out of the rice. There is no problem, if there is too much of starch with the rice that you have brought, because you wash it out. They enjoyed my jokes also very much. There was this fellow sitting with a tape recorder you see, then he stopped his tape recorder and was just enjoying. _______. Most of them did feel, no doubt.

Gregoire: I think the attitude was very excellent.

Shri Mataji: the attitude was excellent.

Gregoire: I mean they didn’t leave quickly. You know, they all went in round you know.

Shri Mataji: they waited. One lady ___49:37__ she took out her necklace. Rajneesh people didn’t come.

Yogis: no.

Yogi: the once who came yesterday mother I saw them arriving in a car from outside Vienna. It was from about a distance at least 50 Km ____50:00__.

Shri Mataji: you saw them arriving.

Yogi: Rajneesh people I saw them arriving and the car plates were from quite far away from Vienna. They must have come for one of the council of Rajneesh.

Shri Mataji: oh I see.

Yogi: because it was from an area which was at least 50 km away from Vienna mother.

Shri Mataji: oh I see. They have come from where?

Yogi: they must have come from ___50:29__, because I saw them arriving from a distant place from Vienna.

Shri Mataji: they all went away.

Yogi: yes, they went just when you started realization ceremony.

Shri Mataji: is it.

Yogi: they walked out, yes. But there was a group of three who came into with fancy dresses, with shaved head; there was one with shaved head completely shaved. A woman and another one who had a beard and they were in fancy dresses.

Shri Mataji: they were wearing orange dresses.

Yogi: yes, mother.

Shri Mataji: I didn’t see them coming.

Yogi: they stepped in the end at the back. They left before you started the session of realization.

Shri Mataji: ______ that is what I said __51:19__ for Me to talk openly about the gurus.

Yogi: yes, absolutely mother.

Shri Mataji: start your food, you shouldn’t eat it cold. (Hindi) Rustam very nice, very well.

Yogi: thank you Shri Mataji, improvisation.

Shri Mataji: Indians sometimes, yours is the same style as Indians, isn’t it or is that different. Well done today’s program, wise people very wise people.

Gregoire: I really feel full of joy, mother. I really feel full of joy.

Shri Mataji: because Gregoire, it tell you, they are so close to the eastern world, eastern communist. That there is a kind of a balance in the people you see here I feel. It is a very balancing country.

Yogi: and also mother here lived the Russians for quite a long time for about 10 years.

Shri Mataji: I answered a very good question today if you noticed when he asked what about the matter why did god create? The original sin.

Gregoire: I may have been out at that time.

Shri Mataji: you didn’t hear that part. About the original sin, about eve and Adam. You didn’t hear that. The translation was not good.

Gregoire: no, the translation was really not good. I don’t want to tell ___54:38__.

Yogi: missed it that’s what.

Gregoire: I mean it’s okay. It was not the best, I am not a perfectionist that is what Sahaja Yoga is concerned, so I __54:49__.

Shri Mataji: she can try tomorrow __54:52__

Gregoire: she has gone anyway, we have to, no, you see she was saying and she was also you know who becomes, the flower becomes the fruit. And she was saying the fruit become the flower. You know things like that. There was a big mistake. People could not understand what you were saying. They didn’t understand ___55:35__ and people can hear her.

Shri Mataji: she is a very direct person you know Gregoire. She is not at all complicated. She is very safe.

Yogi: she is a jewel mother. She is a jewel I said. She is very good and very constructive in Geneva mother.

Shri Mataji: she is right sided, simple and straight forward question. She is not at all complicated. That’s why I have always said that the Germans will get it. They will have it. They just walk straight. No question. They are difficult. ___56:35__ will get them, I am sure __56:36__.

Yogi: and she played a very important role mother in Geneva. She has got a lot o authority.

Shri Mataji: if she can join you it will be a good idea.

Yogi: yes, mother. Well I guess, she is going to India mother. We all expect her to come back married.

Shri Mataji: does she want to get married.

Yogi: she was quite afraid for quite a lot of time but she said that she loved her idea and she knows that she knows to develop further, she needs to marry. And she starts feeling now problems with left nabhi which she didn’t feel before.

Shri Mataji: what has she done and what is her age first of all?

Yogi: she is I think about 30 to further one.

Shri Mataji: she is 30.

Yogi: no no she is younger 28. 27 to 28.

Shri Mataji: what has she done?

Yogi: she started university mother and she dropped it. Then she is studying music, she is playing violin. She also has done some teaching mother. She was teaching German language, yes, German and she is very much interested in teaching later in her holidays. Actually she is preparing for her exams in violin so that she could teach also music.

Shri Mataji: if she is very tall and we have to find a tall man.

Yogi: Hugo is gone mother, Hugo is gone. Hugo is married already. Hugo from Australia.

Shri Mataji: Hugo, there is somebody taller than him we have.

Yogi: and she has been very strong with her realization mother. She said for 2 days she was in a state where she cannot ____59:04___. And she took very wise steps mother, after realization, she decided that she is not going to work more than 5 may be 6 hours a day so that she can establish herself in Sahaja Yoga and keep her attention straight on Sahasrara mother.

Shri Mataji: she is very direct. I must say. She is very young you see.

Yogi: she has done a lot of work for preparing for the program in Geneva mother. She is an excellent girl.

Yogi: she went to Germany mother to help Thomas.

Yogini: she is very straight forward.

Yogi: it’s a very nice couple Thomas and Sofia if balance is established.

Shri Mataji: Thomas you see is no leader; he is just one of the Sahaja yogis as a person. Sofia said mother that she would agree to marry ___1:00:18__ vibrations wise will be very strong.

Shri Mataji: Marcus what do you say.

Gregoire: Marcus is tall.

Yogi: which Marcus, Marcus.

Gregoire: not Marcus the famous Marcus.

Yogini: the one Austrian Marcus Dawes.

Shri Mataji: what’s it. Marcus is what.

Yogi: Dawes. This is his name.

Yogini: this is his second name.

Shri Mataji: he is alright. He could come to Germany.

Yogi: he could come to Germany. They could stay in the same town as we mother. They can stay in the same town as we and for jobs it could be no problem. Because

Yogi: you can give him a job.

Shri Mataji: very good at English. Marcus is very good at account. He is very good at account. And only thing is you see, he comes from a family where they were well off once upon a time very well accountants. And his mother is still in Venice and some place like that. Such a family it is. But he is very suitable for her I think.

Yogi: it will be quite interesting to see Marcus; will be quite interesting to see Marcus was very slow very.

Shri Mataji: yes, we are done.

Yogi: he was speedy.

Shri Mataji: absolutely speedy fellow, will be a good idea.

Yogi: Marcus and Sofia.

Shri Mataji: I don’t her name but Marcus would like, will have to see.

Yogini: who was this Marcus? How old is he?

Shri Mataji: he is about 30 I think. He is 30, he is about 30 I think now must be.

Gregoire: would you like some more chicken mother.

Shri Mataji: no no, I am just trying to finish this that’s all.

Yogini: age is perfect between them.

Shri Mataji: age is perfect. When he came first to Me, he was 26. Now how long have you been with Me Gregoire?

Gregoire: how long? When I met you, how old I was?

Shri Mataji: no no, when did we go to what that place is called?

Gregoire: Scotland.

Shri Mataji: Scotland.

Yogi: three years ago Shri Mataji.

Shri Mataji: so he must be now 39 or something. 29 sorry must be 29, alright about 28-29. She is 28.

Yogini: I don’t know mother.

Yogi: she is at least 29 mother. She has a very pure Mooladhara mother. When she went to Germany first to see her brother she said that she was having diarrhea for few days.

Yogi: mother I must say that I said that I could have seen her meeting the wife of Thomas that could have been a nice picture you know.

Shri Mataji: it could be a solution for Marcus also I think. She is an accountant and everything __1:05:20__ coming down.

Gregoire: I am little bit afraid that she may be a bit strong for him because he is quite I mean his move.

Shri Mataji: he was quite strong now he has come down. A very strong in back. Extremely he had problems with lots of them, that’s our idea.

Yogini: mother you were saying that he was an accountant. He could be very useful in Rom there is a hotel to manage because in Rom, we have cooks and we have every kind of people for the hotel but an accountant we should need.

Shri Mataji: you should have an accountant.

Yogini: accountant would be very useful in Rom.

Shri Mataji: we can give him many accountant from

Gregoire: that is absolutely mother to send the English people having jobs in Europe.

Shri Mataji: he may get a job there.

Yogini: well if we receive from Shri Hanuman a hotel, a restaurant, an ashram an accountant will be very necessary.

Shri Mataji: you have many accountants. He is of a good family but his family is ruined now, finished. His mother is gone to _1:07:15___ father is something. What is it to some sort of a contractor or something, doesn’t give him any money. We have so many accountant, our john is a big accountant himself, you could have another accountant. We have so many accountants. We have this one, the one got his epileptic attack what is his name? Norman.

Yogi: Norman got an epileptic attack.

Shri Mataji: he is the one who is having a business.

Yogi: I thought he was totally inactive and he apparently was doing business.

Shri Mataji: you know he had a big business. A shop of liquor which he sold. Then he shifted to the ashram. There he started his business without telling Me.

Yogi: what business was it?

Shri Mataji: he started selling cloth; he got all the stock in the ashram.

Yogi: maybe didn’t know you see just ignorance mother.

Shri Mataji: I know I forgave him.

Yogini: do you want some more mother.

Shri Mataji: no no, out of question. I have eaten three of these. It was good.

Yogis: it was very very good.

Shri Mataji: and I have just told Rustam how to make it __1:09:05__

Yogi: very very __1:09:10__. We should learn that recipe.

Shri Mataji: he has a brain; Rustam has a very good brain no doubt.

Yogi: that is why he is doing good cooking mother.

Shri Mataji: without that how can he. Now for example if you have to do it then none of us can eat.

Gregoire: I know mother ___1:09:32__ divine, what you told that other day. I think you all know that story there was machindranath, but I have a good CIA service, so I know the story already. Machindranath was playing and he was putting a little cube in a hole. Mother said yes he is intelligent like his father he can do this he can close this little box. But I am not sure that his father can do that.

Yogini: mother if I may I want to check in the defense of my big brother, he makes excellent omelets.

Shri Mataji: I have heard that. But he has not made one for Me how am I to pick it.

Yogi: mother, I am too humble for that mother.

Shri Mataji: I tell you mostly the intelligent people don’t know how to cook, that’s one thing about them. I have seen it in India if somebody is intelligent, he will not know how to cook some or other then I sometimes think if I know how to cook that means I am not intelligent. That’s what you have to decide now. You see I have seen people like My husband he has no sense, this much. How can you teach him? He doesn’t have any sense of any kind. Only what she has got is nervousness, you see, this will burn that will burn this that, that’s all. Rustam has really done a good job. (Hindi) you also eat, you are just.

Yogi: it’s really excellent really, really excellent.

Shri Mataji: somebody has really enjoyed.

Yogi: you see, question of love.

Shri Mataji: you know Rustam did what. This I tell you.

Yogi: yes, you could tell them Shri Mataji.

Shri Mataji: Sir C.P. and Kalpana was there I think Kalpana, Aradhana, Anupama, Prabha and Me we all went to Derbyshire, and we agreed to go all of them and went out and try to somehow put this, so Rustam said I have done the biryani its left there, when you go in the afternoon, so you see we were waiting waiting for the food, My program was in the evening, so it took about 3:30, we didn’t know what was happening, Hester and Kalpana were both busy in the kitchen, so I went down and said,” what are you doing,” so Kalpana said,” mummy Rustam has cooked a biryani.” I said then you just have a look, you see, “how can we improve it.” So I went and saw, it was all rice and absolutely raw absolutely raw, and the chicken was not yet cooked, so they started cooking it, separately they took out the chicken separately and they started cooking it and the rice was left as it is you see, but C.P. was very you see, he said you don’t tell him poor thing, he has done so much and after all you are not to tell him that it is spoiled and this that. I said no no; we are not going to tell him about that. So some or other that chicken which was all raw was cooked somehow with all the mixed rice you see, and we ate something at the lunch, you know, he slept off and then we got up, and then Rustam came and said, “how was the chicken,” he said, “oh excellent, it was very nice.” But I think he went and opened the.

Rustam: I was very suspicious and I knew that it was near disaster.

Shri Mataji: so he was suspicious and he went on asking Me and asking Me you see. So I didn’t tell him that day but then I said Rustam I better tell you and he was shocked.

Yogini: mother you never told me, how was the dish that we prepared for you when the ambassador of the Spain was in your house, with the wife and the children. The __1:14:24__ with tomato and parmijana is called.

Shri Mataji: we do make the same thing. It was very well done. We make the same thing, you see, our cooking is very much the same except this pasta business we don’t have much, because we don’t eat this white flour. But we eat very thin ones like that otherwise; our style of cooking is quite the same. It was very nice you have put some cheese and all that. Very nice it was.

Gregoire: mother when you started you don’t know what Rustam has done it reminded me another story in relationship with your daughters, I don’t know if you know this story already. It was in Ashley garden, when I was leaving for Switzerland and I was leaving mother, mother was near __1:15:25__ sofa and then she walked away, and I saw her chapals there on the ground and then I said oh well I will take the chapals of mother to worship them at home during my holidays, so I took the chapals of mother which is very auspicious, and of course in my room okay, and so I put them on the table and every morning I was bowing and so on, and then after the holidays, I returned in the Ashley gardens and then I put the chapals and then Sadhana saw them on the floor and then Sadhana suddenly said, “mother my chapals are back where were they.”

Shri Mataji: he never asked Me. My feet are slightly about the same but slightly little longer. I do not have big feet.

Gregoire: I don’t have the eye of Shri Adi Shankaracharya, mother.

Shri Mataji: we had such fun I tell you. What do you call that pineapple dish that is more __1:16:46__ more dish.

Yogini: it is parmijana.

Shri Mataji: parmijana.

Yogini: yes mother, it comes from parmijana the cheese which we put on.

Shri Mataji: parmijana, from what part is the __1:17:09__ parmi or jana.

Yogini: parmijana is the name of the cheese. It is just the name of the cheese.

Shri Mataji: oh it is the name of the cheese parmijana.

Gregoire: so I think now, the pure name of the cheese is no melanzanie ala parmijana. That means obergin in the way of parmijana, the style of the place this part of the Italy is parma parmijana.

Yogini: where they make this special cheese.

Shri Mataji: parmijana.

Yogini: that we also put on the pasta.

Shri Mataji: so what do you say to this thing to egg plant?

Yogis: melanzanie.

Shri Mataji: melanzana.

Yogini: melanzana, yes mother. Italian is very easy.

Shri Mataji: melanzana. We call it bengan. Some people call it in Marathi wangi. Maharashtrian people call it wangi.

Yogini: there are few words that are the same in Sanskrit and Italian like the one that you told me in Rom chawi; it is the word which means key chawi.

Shri Mataji: chawi, chawi comes to us not from Sanskrit. It comes to us from Persian, chawi. It is a Persian word.

Yogi: basta

Shri Mataji: basta.

Gregoire: basta, bas, basta means enough.

Yogi: like bas.

Shri Mataji: bas

Yogini: it is the same.

Shri Mataji: that also is Persian. Bas is also Persian. You say basta, is Persian that’s Persian. You see because I am sure lots of Persians must have come down, Arabic people must have come down. They were ruling Italy isn’t it, some of this, basta. Ah so much food. But the way, you see they pronounced the words ___1:20:15___ style but in Europe it is I think French and Italians are known for cuisine no doubt French and Italians. That is surprising how many languages you can speak you know 3 or 4.

Gregoire: in one day if you said everybody should know more than one language. Then you said one should at least know at least English of course but then either Hindi or Marathi. German French Italian and Hindi wouldn’t exist in your counting.

Shri Mataji: because if you have to listen to me at least English you should learn. Because after all you will miss lots of points like today you know which he missed so many points.

Gregoire: this is certain mother that is one of the reason it would be very nice.

Shri Mataji: but Sahaja Yoga is a very subtle thing I tell you. And there are lots of subtle things and if you miss then you will miss the whole thing so why not have the ____1:21:51__ I have learnt English you will learn English also that is not my mother tongue or father tongue. I have picked it up.

Gregoire: but then what to learn Hindi, Sanskrit, Hindi, Sanskrit, and Marathi.

Shri Mataji: if you know Sanskrit you will learn Marathi or Hindi very easily. There is no problem, because you know the roots.

Gregoire: I would like to learn Sanskrit.

Yogi: although we could have Sanskrit courses. You said that German is very close to Sanskrit.

Shri Mataji: that is what they say but I had been only able to find one word is du.

Yogi: no mother, another word is tat.

Shri Mataji: tat means that.

Yogi: and tatsache means fact.

Shri Mataji: tat sach what.

Yogini: tatsache.

Shri Mataji: also we don’t have this `h`.

Yogi: it is like in Arabic.

Shri Mataji: Arabic yes, but sach is not a Sanskrit word. Sach is used in a colloquial way, very very rustic sach. Especially I would say Kabira has said this word sach. Sach is the essence of the sach. But sacher is a Marathi word. Sacher I think must be close to Marathi may be German.

Yogi: actually sache means a thing Shri Mataji.

Shri Mataji: thing.

Yogi: thing.

Shri Mataji: sacher and sugar.

Yogi: and sugar is Zucker.

Gregoire: because we have taken the sachertorte of the sacher hotel.

Yogi: sacher is the name of the place isn’t it. You see sacher is the name of the hotel Shri Mataji. So that is why it is known as sachertorte which is quite famous in Austria.

Shri Mataji: we had this famous cake. Sacher. Sache means vastu mean the thing.

Yogi: but where German is similar Shri Mataji to Sanskrit is the grammar. The way the verb changes.

Shri Mataji: then it is not similar. You know that way you can say that Marathi is similar to English. Yes, then it is something like that you see the grammar.

Yogi: but they have this system Shri Mataji of prefixes.

Shri Mataji: ___1:24:55__

Yogi: also they have this system of prefixes which changes the meaning of the verb. Like we have in Sanskrit like gaccham agaccham.

Shri Mataji: that is nothing similar you see that you see it is a very different language. You see our say Hindi language is same as English language as far as grammar is concerned practically.

Yogi: yes, the grammar is identical mother.

Shri Mataji: same style, but what I must be lots of words, for example is sacher may not be. These are all Persian words. Kha as you all know is not in Sanskrit at all, is against the vishuddhi chakra, your kha, gha, ga. Your gha.

Gregoire: mine

Shri Mataji: ra.

Gregoire: French ra. I cannot do the ra. None of us.

Shri Mataji: rhuth is bhooth. Rhuth we call some bhooth. Ga just like this ga special. Ga for Ganesh. In Sanskrit language this words are not there. We don’t use this part at all.

Yogini: Persian language is coming from where. The hruth of Persian language from where is it coming from.

Gregoire: where are the hruths of the Persian language coming from?

Shri Mataji: Persian language this Persian itself all the same I should say must be Italian or something.

Yogini: Latin because Italian is Latin so.

Shri Mataji: Latin language, this Hebrew is also there. You see Hebrew language is different may be from Hebrew or Persian language.

Yogi: old Persian Shri Mataji Zend Persian was from Sanskrit. But at the moment the Persian comes from Arabic.

Shri Mataji: the old Persian comes from Sanskrit.

Yogi: because in the parsis have met pravaruna and all the devas are mentioned.

Shri Mataji: ah the old Persian which was before I mean after Zorastra is definitely Sanskrit very much no doubt. But this modern Persian is Arabic. Now what is the root of Arabic?

Yogi: Arabic is a to big separate system. Arabic Hebrew they are all in this side. They all started in this side mother. They have nothing to do with Sanskrit.

Shri Mataji: with Latin.

Yogi: nothing to do with Latin.

Shri Mataji: you see because Latin and Sanskrit are sister languages, so Persian looks like latinisch but I think the modern Persian is very.

Yogi: it has nothing to do with Shri Mataji, it is Semitic may be, but Latin is similar to Sanskrit mother. Latin is very similar.

Shri Mataji: very sanskritized very Sanskrit. You see they say to center kendro.

Yogi: and also Shri Mataji to fire they say Agnes, for fire Agnes.

Shri Mataji: Agni

Yogi: so similar.

Gregoire: mother we are sorry we are just forgetting that you worked.

Shri Mataji: formally I must leave.

Gregoire: you worked so much. We just say your mantra before you leave.

Three Maha mantras

Om Twamewa Sakshat Shri Mahalaxmi, Mahasaraswati, Mahakali, Trigunatmika, Kundalini Sakshat Shri Adi Shakti Sakshat Shri Bhagawati Sakshat, Shri Mataji Shri Nirmala Devi Namoh Namah

Om Twameva Sakshat Shri Kalki Sakshat Shri Adi Shakti Sakshat Shri Bhagawati Sakshat Shri Mataji Shri Nirmala Devi Namoh Namah

Shri Mataji: May god bless you

Om Twameva Sakshat Shri Kalki Sakshat Shri Sahasrara Swamini Moksha Pradayini Mataji Shri Nirmala Devi Namoh Namah

Shri Mataji: May God bless you. I must say, I did not realize, I did not realize that I was using a colored sari till now.

Yogi: but it was very nice.

Shri Mataji: for a program. Gregoire I am going to try, so let us see.

Yogis: thank you Shri Mataji. Shri Nirmala Devi Namoh Namaha, Shri Nirmala Devi Namoh Namaha, Shri Nirmala Devi Namoh Namah