Public Program

Hampstead Town Hall Centre, Hampstead (England)


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Public Program, “The Experience of Truth”. Hampstead Town Hall, London (UK), 2 July 1984.

I bow to all the seekers of truth. The other day I talked to you about the experience of truth. That the truth has to be felt through your central nervous system. If anything has to happen to your evolution you have to feel it through your central nervous system otherwise it is just a projection of your mind which falls off and you are surprised at yourself. Like we call somebody as a friend, a dear friend, and one day we find there is no friendship. Maybe one day the friend will try to murder you or you may try to murder that person. You just don’t understand what happened to that love. Same thing about all of our projections, we find it has no basis, it’s so superficial.
When we realise that all is so superficial, it has no basis, we just get frustrated and we start thinking, what is all this, we are playing games. One can’t be sincere. What has happened to us? Why are we so frivolous? Why are we so superficial? We may start taking interest in things which look superficially very great, but ultimately we find that it doesn’t have any depth in it and suddenly to our horror we discover that everything seems to be relative in this world, nothing is absolute. So the experience of the truth has to be absolute. Means everybody should feel that way, if not then it is something poetical because each poet sees the reality in a different way, describes in a different way. But if he is a truthful poet he keeps the essence at least the same. But when we say we have to feel the truth, by everyone in an absolute manner, what does that mean?
That means when we get our self realisation, when we think we have got a new awareness of collective consciousness, that means we are unconnected with the whole, with the absolute, then everyone of us who is like that should feel the same way. For example there’s a person who is sick and you get ten children who are realised souls, that means we say are realised souls, now tie up their eyes so that they cannot see at all and ask them what centres are catching in this person. All of them will raise the same finger. This is the finger that is catching. And if you ask that person relative to that finger, have you got this trouble, he’ll say yes, but how do you know? How do these children know? So the truth is felt by everyone the same. Then it is absolute. If somebody sees a blue colour, if somebody sees a red colour then it is not the truth. And you’ll be amazed when you become self realised, if you meet people who are self realised, you’ll be amazed they say the same thing in a different way in a different , but they say the same thing.
It is very amazing that people who were in India, who were in Lebanon, who were in China, who were in England had nothing to do with each other, had no communication what so ever and they say the same thing. So down within us there is something that is absolute that tells us about absolute. So the second experience should be of absoluteness. The Divine power that is all pervading, if it is truthful, if it is real, then all of us who are feeling that power through this realisation should receive the same message and no different messages.
This is the second proof of truth and you put this test to anyone who says that this is self realisation. This is a very, very important thing to understand that truth has to be one, it has to be absolute and if you can establish your report with the absolute you cannot have any other information but the truth. So as you ascend in Sahaja Yoga you start learning that whatever messages you are getting is the truth, that all these messages that you are receiving you can yourself perceive them, can feel them, nobody has to tell you. Even a child can say the same thing. So you move one step forward into a world called faith, which is the faith of experience. You call say this as escape, how do you know it is not artificial? It is real because you have experience of the artificial; and the real and now when you feel it you can say with faith “yes it is real”. In the same way reality can be only accepted if you go through the experience of truth and then have faith.
Human mind is a very wonderful mind. English word mind doesn’t explain much though what mind means but in Sahaja Yoga it has been very clearly explained what human mind creates. Here as you see very clearly that on top of the head there, you see a lotus. We can say how can there be a lotus on top of the head Mother, this sounds very poetic and something fantastic and is a fantasy, it is symbolic of course they express something. Of course I wish everybody had that lotus blooming. But very few have it but still they have no doubt. Now this one, when you see the lotus, before that if you see the brain in Sahaja Yoga is just shown as a hollow thing. There’s nothing like brain shown there. But there are two, blue, deep blue and the yellow [somebody should show John, will you come? somebody], two balloon like structures in the brain. Now when the first balloon only existed, when we were just animals our brain was flat, so was the Himalayas. Himalayas represents our brain in the gross life. So the Himalaya was also flat and our brain was also flat. Then man started hitting with branches when the animals attacked them, they learned how to hit back and another line started which we call as the sun line but which another side started developing and the brain got transformed into a new formation of a triangular. This triangular brain, now is like a pyramid I see and sometimes I find it swollen very much more on one side, a bit too much.
So all our problems started from that point where we decided that we can do it. We have to do it. And when we started doing it that way. This yellow stuff which we call as ego started pushing the superego in such a manner that the brain became a prism like structure. But it is was important to create this prism. Of course with this Himalayas also developed a triangular structure. It was very important that it should have happened in the human brain,
that we had developed this ego within ourselves. We could have avoided it if we had not committed the mistake at the stage of Adam and Eve, but we did commit, so now we have it.
and that short circuit got elongated and our evolution started going on a different line where we wanted to find out ourselves what is the truth.
So the journey started and started moving so fast that we remained in the state of a balloon alone
, nothing else but a balloon that existed. So we became nothing but balloons floating superficially. The balance was lost completely and the whole problem has started with this balloon, that we can put in the effort, we can find the truth, we can discover this. Like one scientist was forced by a King in (unclear:Reston?) and was in prison and was told that you should try to create gold out of Mecury, poor fellow he tried his level best he could not, but in the result he found out how to make beautiful china. That’s exactly what has happened to human beings, in the search of truth we have discovered everything else but the truth. Because truth you cannot discover it, as I told you the other day it is a state that one has to achieve, one has to achieve to receive the truth, to know the truth
So some people felt that truth is what we have found out, like blind people, whatever they have found out they called it as truth. Even in India, where people have a great sense of meditation, people committed mistakes and what they found is the movement on the right hand side and they said yes, there is all pervading power and that is formless. The left hand people found while praying to God that there are forms which guide them so they talked of the forms. Some talked of the formless and some talked of the form. The right sided people being the worshippers of the Goddess of learning wrote down everything as Vedas [most ancient Hindu scriptures] but in the very beginning of Vedas, Vedas means to know, and to know means to evolve to become self realised. It is not when I talk to you what you know, is the knowledge, is not. The knowledge is which is expressed, manifested on your central nervous system. The truth. So they wrote down what they found, that we have to first excite or initiate the nature. So they wrote (unclear), all those things, now that has become an authentic writing, big things for intellectuals, that to after many, many years people remembering it by heart. So authentically you might say that Vedas came only about 800 or 80es or something like that. So all that writing, if you go by that you’ll be lost into another wild goose chase and those who read only Vedas can never find that what is supposed to be known. In the first chapter or the first verse of the Vedas that by reading this book if you do not get the knowledge no use reading the Vedas. But there are books & books & books, libraries & libraries & libraries, all the wild goose chase. Many of the systems follow, was the system of fearing the God, then finding out the forms of God, worshipping God as forms.
The incarnations came on this earth and people worshipped them, like Christ for example. Now there is a challenge on Christ, these intellectuals will challenge everything because they challenge everything through the intellect. The trouble is that they think they are the wisest. Such wise people can not find God is impossible. You have to be a little humble. So the intellectual as usual challenged and the others who just believed without the intellectuals were the people who just believed into things without knowing. Who had just faith, as our devotional emotional songs are, devotional songs are. All these extreme movements on both the sides created two different types of people, one who we can call them as intellectuals and another as fanatics.
They did not create self realised people because ego makes a person so superficial and so stupid that he cannot grasp, it’s beyond him. He is so stupid. He cannot grasp the truth. Is a barrier, is a projection outside, he is a concave personality, is a convex personality. His brain is convex. And the other one is so concave, is so conditioned that you cannot talk to him. That’s how the quality of seekers came on this earth, who are seeking truth.
Now we should also know that God must be worried about his creation, he must be worried about the people who are created by him, who became human beings, who are seekers, special category, not hypocrites, you cannot help hypocrites, you cannot help them but those who are real seekers. There are many real seekers and he must be worried about all these seekers and he must have arranged something for them and that is how Christ came on this earth to guide you . He came on this earth to guide and tell us that you can find the truth by your second birth. You are to be born again. You are to be born again, then there are people who just believe that I am born again, you see self opinionated, I’m alright! I’ve found it! Stupid people, they just believe, certify themselves they have found it. They just give themselves a certificate, oh I’ve found it, but who is the loser? It’s not God. He is there, to reveal himself to you if you want to know him, through your evolution, through your effortlessness. But as you have seen Patanjali yoga shastra was written for the central people, for the real seekers but people took out of Patanjali also what suited them is the physical exercise, I mean just imagine, it is like a person who has been invited to dinner is doing dish-washing, it’s that stupid. And that book, even today thank God, despite all the intellectuals attacks and all nonsenses, he does talk of the formless not of the form so much but he does say that you have to neutralise your effort, (some Sanskrit words) you have to neutralise your thought which are (Sanskrit words) and in the absence of that thought only the Kundalini will rise.
Now a vicious circle is created, even when we say we should not have any thought, we fight with that thought. I will not have any thought x2. So there is thought still there. How to get rid of this thought, is the problem. How to become nirvichara? Anybody that preaches a lot, talks a lot, is actually creating the thought in the mind but some may not. But mostly they do. So something has to happen that the thought must stop. And that is what happens in Sahaja Yoga. But it is all done by God Almighty within us, that he has made these beautiful chakras. They are made from different elements, the essence of different elements and all incarnations of our ascent are placed there to guide those subtle centres, is already within us, we may not know about it but they exist within us and ultimately the residual, they call it, the residual power, that is Kundalini; it is residual because it has created everything but has not manifested itself, is the pure desire to know the truth, pure desire to know the Divine, to become the Divine, is still sleeping.
When these chakras are in proper shape she spontaneously rises just like a seed sprouts, you don’t have to do anything to reduce your efforts and your thoughts. The thoughts are created and they disappeared again they come up and disappear, there’s a little gap in between and that gap widens by the ascent of Kundalini and you become thoughtless without any effort. With effort you cannot, that’s the point is. This mechanism exists within us. Now if something happens here say for example this is working out, then we go into the mechanism of this and try to find out how this is working out. Now if you want to see, you can see the rising of the Kundalini, you can see the breaking of the Kundalini, you can feel the cool breeze coming out of you. Now how it happens? It cannot happen. Some people believe if you go to God, and if you can sing well, is done. Or if you sing some music, or you do some reading of bible or some books is done.
it is the cool breeze that emits on top of your head, is the first sign that your Kundalini awakened and then when you start feeling it all around now you are in connection with the all pervading power. Before that we are denying the truth. It’s all done by God, by his grace, he’s made it all so beautiful, so very, very beautifully, this machinery is within us. We don’t do a thing, we don’t have to do a thing, but that is the point, we cannot do, that we don’t have to do anything about it. Always they ask me, then what must we do, I said you don’t do anything, that’s the point is. It is too much to accept. But how do we become human beings from monkeys? Did we cut our tails or anything, we just became?
How does a seed sprout? By itself spontaneously. In the same way your evolution has to take place spontaneously. And every time somebody has to lead, somebody has to go forward, somebody has to be bold, somebody has to talk about. Maybe somebody else would have been better for this job, as I said the other day, I would be very happy to retire but that’s what it is, it’s true. I have to do this job, it is a thankless job no doubt but I have to do it, now what can I do about it?
That should not upset you. That upsets many people but I don’t do anything actually, it is a nature within me, like the sun shines, it doesn’t do anything does it? But when the sun shines the trees become green, just it happens, I mean the sun doesn’t take any credit or doesn’t say that the trees must offer part of their greenness or something to me. Does it? They are not angry with the sun are we? Because it tans our body. Do we? We don’t get angry with it. In the same way it’s somebody’s nature, somebody’s nature is to do that, and somebody’s nature is to ascend and to rise, is more credible to more people who achieve it that way, don’t you think so?
So, there is nothing to feel unhappy about it. This is another problem which I told you last time, that in the West it is a really big hurdle for people. You cannot pay for it, you cannot put in any effort, you cannot do anything about it, it has to work out. It cannot be guaranteed that. If it is there it will work out, if it is not there it will not work out. If the desire is pure it will work out and then you have to work it out to keep it there.
So by reading about it you will never understand, there are so many people who read bible,
so many people who read Gita , so many people in India who know by heart the whole of Gita, the meaning, everything but there is nothing in their lives, they have sickness, they’ve ill feelings, they’re unhappy or ego oriented, something wrong, somewhere. Nothing wrong with the scriptures, we have forgotten it is said you are to be born again.
So the third experience should be of transformation. If it cannot bring out the virtue in you, if it cannot give you the strength of your spirit, if it cannot transform you then it is not self realisation. But transformation can be taken like this that people can just change the colour of their clothes and say we are transformed, now we have taken a sanyasa, you see, we are all detached. All such self opinionated people. It’s not that, it’s no opinion, is to be in that state is important, to be in that state that’s the truth and that’s the truth you should ask for, and nothing else. Are you transformed by it and the first transformation you feel, before you change your temperament, before you change your habit, before you change anything is that your central nervous system acquires a new dimension of collective consciousness. Acquires! You get it. And you can verify it.
But human beings still think they are obliging me and say no Mother no much, I don’t believe in it. It’s alright, who are you, I mean don’t believe in yourself. So the first thing that should happen in this experience of transformation or evolution is that you become, again I say become, become, become collectively conscious, by which you know your chakras and you know the chakras of others, you know the subtle problems you have, the subtle diseases you have, the hidden problems you have. The whole life which is abnormal comes to normal you see because you can see abnormal. Supposing I am standing on the edge of this and there is no light, I cannot see, I may fall down. I am about to fall down I cannot see but there is light, I see. So I get into balance. That is enlightenment. If enlightenment doesn’t give you the vision of wisdom it is not enlightenment at all. You drink, you smoke, you see all kinds of things, you have temper everything exists and you say oh God I am a very religious person and the second thing that comes to you is some sort of a abuse. So your virtue, virtue must shine and that’s the time is today according to the Shalivahan? calendar this is the Krita Yoga. This is the yoga when there is, is the age when there is perfection means where, you get in contact, actually, with actuality. That means you actualise it and that is the time, today, that has come called as Krita yoga.
That means all pervading power is actualised and you feel the manifestation of that power very, very clearly, on your central nervous system. Because whatever is evolved in you, you feel it on your central nervous system. So this new breakthrough is to be seen through and not to be just accepted, not to have blind faith, nothing of that kind. Then once you come to that certain state then the subject gets deeper and deeper and much more interested, but first that state has to be established. Many people have complained to me that Mother Sahaja Yogis who are senior are rather secretive, there are no secrets, no secrets but as a boy who enters say into the first class or the first (unclear) cannot understand what (unclear?). So he might feel this fellow is trying to hide something in his books. It isn’t true. One has to grow to that point, bear the truth also to bear the truth we have to develop that power within ourselves and that state we have to achieve.
I requested last time all the people of England especially, because in the map of the Divine, England represents the heart and the responsibility of heart is the maximum and if they don’t pay attention to their heart the world having a heart attack. So how important it is that we should seek our ascent and seek the truth. Of course I don’t say, that you don’t do this, you don’t do that, nothing of the kind, that is not to be said anymore. Just first get your realisation then you look after yourself I don’t have to tell you. Then you get your light you yourself will see that you will not put your hand into the crocodiles mouth then, are you? But first you must see the crocodile, because if I tell you the crocodile in the darkness, you say let me try even if you, that’s how it works.
It’s so beautiful. There’s a very beautiful thing to achieve that’s what we say is the Kingdom of God, that’s what we say that is that resides within us, that joy, that fills the whole world as bliss, complete auspiciousness of God’s being can be ours if we decide to be there, nobody can force you. No one can. It is you who has to choose it in your own freedom only you can achieve your complete freedom.
May God Bless You.

H.H. Shri Mataji Nirmala Devi

Excerpt from the questions after the speech (42:15)

Question: Shri Mataji. What is the … [some words ambiguous] Is there a thing that is ego? Is there such a thing that has ego and where does it come from?

Shri Mataji: ‘Yeh, there is. Quite a horrible one. Ego is a myth though. But the myth is there. It’s a myth. The myth is that we believe that we do something. I always give a very apt simile for this that some villagers were ask to go by a plane and they were told not to carry to much luggage. So they got into the plane and put the luggage on their heads. They were ask: ‘Why are you doing this?’ and they said: ‘We are trying to reduce the weight of the plane. In the same way our ego works. And this ego exists though it’s a myth but the myth exists. When reality comes it disappears like the darkness exists, but when the sun comes it disappears. It comes to us from the idea that we do something. ‘I’, ‘my’, ‘I’. I can do it! And from the ‚my‘. This is my. Identity, I-ness comes. Now what happens that when we start working doing anything. See, even garbage cleaning, anything, dish washing, anything that you think is trivial. ‘Oh, what a work I’m doing? Sparking clean I have done.’ I mean anything you do, you feel: ‘Oh, what a work I have done? But what do we do?  We convert dead from dead. Like this stage they got some plastic which is dead made into this stage and they’ll think: ‘We made a great job!’ Some dead bricks the brought made this dead hall. And they will say: ‘We have done a great job!’ What do we do? Do we any living work? Nothing! Do we? We don’t do any living work. That’s another myth. We think we do living work. No, it’s only God.

So when we think we are doing something you must know what you are doing is nothing, you are just transforming from dead to dead. As a result what happens is also very dangerous. Supposing you get some bhoot because the tree is dead. Tree has to die otherwise you cannot make a chair. So the tree dies you make it more dead to make a chair. By making a chair you sit on the chair and now you cannot sit on the ground, you become dead with the chair. You cannot sit on the ground you have to carry the chair all around it becomes a dominating feature. Anywhere you go you have to carry a handy-chair because can’t sit on the ground. So it gives you something called comfort which is really enslaves you. So what do we do is nothing. We are enslaving ourselves. You just detach yourself from this modern world and see what slaves we are of so many things we have created. If the electricity goes off the whole London will topple down. We have become slaves of the matter. Just think of it because the dead has sitting on our heads.

But this idea, ‘we have done this, we have that’, creates a kind of a balloon in our head, you see here, which is mister ego. Which is the color of the bile. Such people have the right side working very hard. The right side produces the bile, because is the sunline. We work when the sun is out and as a result of that we develop this ego within ourselves. So we have ego. But when you become hollow there is nothing like ego. Then He is the Mahat Ahankara. He is the great ego. He does everything. He is the doer, He is the enjoyer. What are we?  We are part and parcel of His being. Just to see, just to feel it. So to think that we do something is wrong, but if you go on saying: ‘No, I don’t do anything!’ then another thing comes in.

That’s called as superego. We move like a pendulum from one to another. Then you say: ‘No, no, no! I’m doing wrong. I should not do like this. It is wrong. Better sit at home. Become a hippie, smoke some ganja. Finish off life.‘ Don’t do anything! Do everything that will take you away from work, effortlessness, laziness, lethargic. Because if you do work you develop ego. So become non-egoistical, but you become superego. So no escape. So what do you do then? Is a problem! You be in the center.

Just wait, don’t overdo anything. Be in the center, do everything moderation, the Kundalini rises and you become that which is beyond ego and superego. You reach that state, here (Shri Mataji puts Her right hand over Her head). That’s what you have to become, which is your right. Which you should get. For that you have become a human being. Why shouldn’t you have it? For that also is ego: ‘Why should I have?’ ‚All right, don‘t have it!‘ The best part of it: Ego makes you stupid, really stupid. This really makes you stupid. Best thing is to see an egoistical man. You’ll feel like laughing because he looks like a … [ambiguous; sounds like ‘bafoo’]. It can be very dangerous also. Like the ego of Hitler – very destructive. So the egoistical man destroys others and the superego-man destroys himself. He is all the time thinking: ‘I’m so bad. I’m no good. I’m good for nothing.’ Both are just the same in My eyes. Is again the mental projections. You are the spirit. You are neither ego nor superego but you are the spirit. Any other question?

Question: Is there such a thing like evil? Shri Mataji: Evil? Of course, there is! Evil is there. Who has told you there is no evil? Evil exists. There are people who are hurt by evil, who are tortured by evil. We see that every day. There are crooks. I don’t know how many varieties of evil there are. Evil exists. Is not only ignorance. But in the ignorance the harmful, destructive, sinister ideas that you grow. That is evil. That darkness is not so difficult but in the darkness the thorns that we grow within ourselves. Evil is there. We have to fight it. We are in the shackles of evil no doubt and evil comes as an attack, unholy attack. You had evil, say Bauhaus (note: school of modern architecture, founded 1919), I would say were evil people, who attacked you. Your architecture was destroyed, all your beauty was destroyed, everything was destroyed, now what do you have? These pigeon holes?

And now people become mad in this pigeon hole. It was an unholy attack, see it, so clear. How can you say that there was no evil? It comes as aggression, it comes as any ideas of disparities. Also it could be very sly and sinister like our gurus have done. It’s very sinister, it comes in the garb of divine, talks of God and kills you within. Gives you diseases, gives you problems – that’s evil, that’s evil! To pronounce that you are divine when you are sinister. When you are not a realized soul, is evil. Sometimes I feel in modern times evil is more powerful than the desire of man to rise above it. The desire has to grow stronger. Then what is this? What are the powers of Satan? Then nothing! They can be finished but if you want to vote for satanic law – have it! It’s your desire, it’s your decision. You have to decide now, the time has come, the moment has come for you decide what do you want. It is very painful but it exists. Those who tell you there is no evil, don’t believe that people, they must be the most sinisterly activating people. Take it from Me, those who say like that. I don’t want to be … [ambiguous, sounds like ‘skid’]. There are vultures, there are hooks and there are birds which are hurt, which are tortured, which live in fear. It exists. What to do? You have to just decide. Is for human beings to decide. You can see that clearly when you have your realization, very clearly. Any question. (54:55)