Public Program Day 2

Madrid, Colegio Mayor Roncalli (Spain)

1988-05-18 Public Program Day 2, 94' Add subtitles:
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Public Program Day 2, Madrid, Spain, 18-05-1988

… So just now it should be taken as a hypothesis. And if it works out then you have to accept it as final truth. In your human awareness whatever we know is through our central nervous system. So for example, if you have to go through a dirty road you cannot go because there is dirt, you can smell it and you don’t like it. But a dog or a horse can easily go through without feeling anything about it. So we are evolved in so many ways up to this human awareness. But still we have not reached the state where we can say that we can know the absolute truth. To reach that state we have to have Self-realization because your Self, the Spirit knows the absolute.

Like yesterday you all felt the cool breeze in your hands, the cool breeze of the Holy Ghost. This is the All-pervading power, everywhere it acts in a very subtle manner. But yesterday for the first time you felt that it exists. So you reach a state where you have become a subtler personality. And you’ll be amazed, those who felt it can feel the centers of another person, they can feel their own centers. Say for example a person gets cancer, he does not know he is about to die. Or he has to go through various tests, things, some horrible tests and sometimes still they cannot find out. But on your vibrations, this cool breeze, you can understand what’s wrong with you and what’s wrong with others. 

All these centers relate to the plexuses within us. If you want I can give you the medical terminology but it’s [UNCLEAR] for normal people. For example the first center is related to the pelvic plexus which [UNCLEAR] your excretory system. That is only on the physical side. On the left hand side, as you see, is the emotional channel which deals with your past and also with your past which was previous lives and the collective subconscious mind. Then the right channel, you see the yellow one, is your physical and mental side and it also relates with your future and what we call as the supra-conscious, and then to the collective supra-conscious.

In human awareness we can only go to the left or to the right. That means we can only work out our left or right sympathetic nervous system. In emergency, supposing you run, you can increase the beats of the heart with the right sympathetic nervous system and in fear you develop from the left sympathetic nervous system the beats of the heart. But automatically it relaxes and comes to normal. The normal rate of heart is established through the parasympathetic which is in the center. So when we go to extremes in anything we develop these problems which are physical, mental, emotional and spiritual. 

The second chakra is the Swadishthan chakra which is the yellow one there. It is related to the aortic plexus in our body. And it moves in the Void, in the green part that you see in the abdominal area, it moves like that and supplies our liver, our pancreas, our spleen, kidneys and also part of the intestines. Also has important work to do: it converts the fat cells for the use of brain which we are using all the time for thinking. So the people who think too much, who are very futuristic, who go on planning morning till evening start using this center bit too much. When you use this center too much then the other jobs of the center are neglected. And all other organs go into over-activity. 

Such a person becomes extremely speedy, hot-tempered. He suffers mainly from liver trouble, over-activity of the liver. Thy symptoms of the over-activity of the liver are like this: that the heat of the liver melts the phlegm in the body. Such a person gets all the time cold, such a person keeps very [UNCLEAR] and the attention is not good. Also such a person might later on develop asthma. Such a person might feel very cold all the time because there is so much heat inside so outside he finds it’s very cold. And the worst of all is that such a person can get a massive heart attack due to too much heat in the body. Especially when at young age if they get this kind of a heart attack it is fatal.

Now when the pancreas is out of gear it gives the problem which we call as diabetes. Diabetes is not caused by sugar, it is a wrong idea. In Indian villages people take at least five spoons of sugar in tea, the villagers. They have to make the spoon stand in the sugar but they never get diabetes. The reason is they don’t think, they don’t plan, they live spontaneously. But the same person if he goes to the city and he starts thinking too much can get diabetes. 

And the third one is the spleen. Spleen is the thing that is the time-keeper, keeps our time, rhythm. But a person who is very hectic and too much thinking type also gets into the trouble of the spleen. Like hectic in the morning we get up, first we sleep very late in the night, then we get up early in the morning with a great hurry, then we read newspaper – that’s modern life, so we get a shock. Only bad news in the newspaper, never good news. Then we get into the car in a hurry and there is a street jam on the way, then we drive again to hurry up. All this hecticness is not meant for our human body. This body has a rhythm; it’s beautifully made and very delicately created. We are not machines but the way we use our body is worse than a machine. Under these circumstances the spleen gets hectic. 

Now the job of the spleen is to produce red blood corpuscles when there is an emergency. In a hectic person there is always an emergency and the poor spleen gets crazy, it doesn’t know how to act. So then we become vulnerable to leukaemia, blood cancer. But the triggering comes for the left side, from the subconscious, from the collective subconscious. And when that triggering takes place people get leukaemia. Now the doctors have gone up to a point to say that it is caused by protein 53 and protein 58, just a name they’ve given, through the entities which cause or which trigger the cancer. But they say that this comes since we were created from that area: means from the collective subconscious. 

What kundalini does when she rises she puts you in the center. Now you have gone too much to the left or to the right and you break your connection with the whole and you start working on your own, every cell becomes egoistical and starts working on its own. So supposing there is cancer of the nose, the nose will start increasing over our eyes, everything, no relationship to the integrated growth of human being. This is the reason why today we hear of cancer, people didn’t have cancer before.

It’s the modern life that has brought forth all this kind of a hectic and life of pressure. Now how to get out of this? Like you are on the periphery of a wheel and on the axis everywhere there is movement but the central point has to be quiet, it should not move. So we too have that central point within us. If we can bring our attention in the center then we just become the witness of the whole play. Despite everything going outside us we at peace with ourselves. We develop a state, a state as what we call a witness state. 

Now supposing you are watching a drama you think you are involved in the drama: you cry, weep with the drama, sometimes you think you are a Napoleon. But when the drama is over you know that it is a drama. So all this madness becomes a drama for you. And you establish that peace because your Spirit is a source of peace. 

When you become the Spirit you become the peace. Not only that you have the state of peace but you emit peace to other. You emit peace and that peace acts to make others peaceful. So when this All-pervading power starts flowing through you, you become an auspicious personality. Whenever you go you create peace. Wherever you go there cannot be accident, there cannot be misery and people – those who have it, are a source of joy to everyone. 

So the Spirit is the source, first of all, is of the knowledge. Knowledge is not that you get it in the books but the knowledge which exists in ourselves. Like you can feel this is hot or cold [Shri Mataji touches the rod of the microphone], it’s built-in. In the same way we can feel what others are or what we are on our fingertips. 

All the great saints and prophets, and incarnations have talked about it. Mohammed Sahib has said that at the time of Resurrection, Qiyama he called it, “Your hands will speak.” and that they will give witness against you, they will tell you what’s wrong with you. Now hands are not going to speak but you are going to feel the centers on your fingertips. And once you know the art of decoding it and the art of correcting it you become the master.

Like this all other diseases are basically due to the over-activity or inactivity of these centers. On the left hand side is the inactivity, on the right hand side is the over-activity. So when these things work within us we do not know how far we have gone towards death or towards our destruction. And we do not know how to be alright, physically or mentally. 

All mental problems come from the left side. A mental patient will never get a heart attack because he is inactive, his heart is inactive. The people who are suffering from angina have a combination of the over-activity plus the guilt. 

When a person becomes very right sided he develops an ego, there is the ego – the yellow one [on the chart]. And the left hand side activity too much means you are too much conditioned, then you develop a superego. And both of them form a crust on top of your head in the fontanel bone area as you grow. So when the kundalini rises and crosses this center which is called as the Agnya which is placed in the optic chiasm where the optic nerves cross, then these two things, ego and superego, these two balloons come down like this and the space is cleared. 

Now Christ is placed on this door, this door of cross and he is awakened when the kundalini passes through. That’s why he said that he died for our sins. That means if Christ is awakened in this center then our conditioning and our ego both get sucked in. But his Crucifixion is not the message, his Resurrection is. That means we can be resurrected also. He has suffered for us but it’s a wrong idea that now we have to suffer more. It is a wrong Christian idea. He has already suffered. Are you going to suffer more than him? Has he left something undone that we have to suffer? 

Recently they have discovered a very beautiful writings of Saint Thomas. Long time back he travelled to India via Egypt. And in Egypt he put it in a big jar of brass all his writings which was discovered by a Muslim in Egypt and was handed over to one great scholar. After working on these for so many years he has now come out with the idea that Thomas has clearly written that you have to have your Self-realization and you have to have your experience of Self-realization. And also he has said that those people who get their Self-realization will be called as Gnostic. In Sanskrit language “gn” means “to know”, so the one who knows is a “Gnyani” in Sanskrit language. Or the Vedas also, “ve-da” means the one who knows on his central nervous system. Even in Islam they call to be the Peer. In every religion such a person is described but the people who followed the religions just went off tangent [UNCLEAR]. Now to say that Christians must suffer is absolutely wrong. This is also said by Thomas that God Almighty is your father who is the most loving father and he wants you to enjoy life, but the enjoyment of the Spirit. 

The Spirit is the source of joy. Joy does not have two things like happiness and unhappiness, it’s absolute. Like people like to drink, for example, for happiness and second day they’ll have hang-over and after few years they have liver, then they get habituated, this is no joy. Joy is something that acts and that works. But with human beings always something absurd appeals more. 

Now I say that it is very simple; it’s all placed within you very nicely; you get it very easily – you don’t like it. But if I say, “You stand on your head for 25 minutes.” people will do it. Human beings are always at themselves. You have to understand that you are the epitome of evolution. You are just ready instrument now to be connected to the mains, that’s all. What did you do to become human beings from animals? Nothing, spontaneously. A seed becomes a tree spontaneously and tree does not do anything to have to bear the fruits. If it is a living God, if it is a living process why should we try to put our effort into it? Human effort, poor human effort. 

We cannot do anything living but after Realization you can, you can do living work. You can raise the kundalini of others. You can give them Realization. You can cure people. You become so dynamic. I have known people who did not know how to sing have become great singers; those who did not know how to paint have become great artists; not through any possession but by their own manifestation.

So, so much energy is within you, this vital energy is within you. Only thing is that you have to be the Self and then I don’t have to tell you, “Don’t do this.” and all that, nothing, no Ten Commandments, you automatically do it. Like if you are holding snake in your hand and if I tell you, “Throw the snake.” you will not because it is dark. If you tell somebody, “Don’t do it.” then they’ll do it more. But if there is light they’ll throw it away, I don’t have to tell them. This is how it works. There are so many things I can go on telling you. I don’t know how many, thousands lectures I’ve given so far. 

Only thing, I’ve not [done] so far is giving you books. Because books also, you go on reading books, you see then I don’t know what happens to human beings. They always read something the other way around, they never see the truth. So, so far I’ve not written any book. But we have some small booklets in which you can find out what is what and what I’ve told you about. And also we have a big book in French and in English language, somebody has this. 

But any amount of reading is not going to give you spirituality. You have to grow into that state and for that you must learn how to grow. Like the lady yesterday came and said that, “Mother, I got it and I lost it.” because she did not follow it. So you have to go to our center which is not a very elaborate place because you know we do not have much money. We have a humble place and with humility you go there and learn about it and you master it. 

A saint is not sort of an over-dressed person or a [UNCLEAR] person but he is a simple person. He doesn’t do any dramas or anything, he is a simple person and you should try to understand him. We have some saints here and you can go and meet them and you all establish your saintliness. Because the time has come to become saints.

May God bless you.

Now again we can have some questions but not too many because tomorrow morning I have to leave at six o’clock. 

Question: Do we have to go away from the society because of its negative energy? Can we get Realization now, here?

Shri Mataji: Yes, you will mature here also. You don’t have to go away, don’t have to leave your family, nothing. You have to stay in Spain, with your family, in the same way as you are living, in your job. You have to get your Realization and you will be looked after. 

Can you get up, I can’t see you there. [the next person asking a question]

Question: It the relationship with God personal or impersonal?

Shri Mataji: It is both. The relationship is this way: God Almighty is reflected within us in our heart as the Spirit so when you become the Spirit you become the reflection of God. So what happens that you imbibe, or you receive, all the blessings of God’s benevolence; you become not God but you become part and parcel of God. 

It is better to experience and see for yourself. It is so abstract that cannot be described. But you enjoy it within yourself and you all have the powers within you also. Now, what will you say, what is the connection between this instrument [the microphone] and the electricity is it personal or impersonal? That’s it, it’s just a connection. It’s everything. We are actually the Spirit. This body is like a lamp and the Spirit is like the light. And this light is the manifestation of the light of God Almighty. 

And if you become the instrument of God then it is personal. But when you receive all his blessings and his benevolence then it is impersonal. It’s very interesting this question because when you get lost in the ocean of love you really don’t think of these things, you just enjoy. I would say a drop becomes the ocean, part and parcel of the ocean. And with the waves of the ocean rising and falling and rising and falling, you enjoy yourself. 

But it is not individual relationship, it is a collective relationship. Like supposing he is a realized soul and there is another realized soul, another realized soul, they are realized souls like that – they all know each other very well. 

I’ll give an example: there was in my country a poet who was a tailor, he was a tailor – Namadeva and there was another called Gora Kumar who was a potter. So this tailor went to see Gora Kumar. As soon as he saw him he said that, “I came here to see the formless, the vibrations, to see the formless but I see this is form that is you.” What an adoration of one human being of another. In the lower level they are only jealous. 

So it is to be experienced.

Question: Where are the Sahaja Yoga centers?

Shri Mataji: We have three. One center in Spain is here, in Madrid; we have one in Barcelona and one in [UNCLEAR]. But we have all over the world. Now I must give you one good news: that we are going to have a seminar, a very [UNCLEAR] seminar very near – Andorra, so that you people can come also. So far Spain has been little cut out.

Question: Are there Sahaja Yogis in Holland?

Shri Mataji: Yes, of course, many. In Holland we have; everywhere we have quite a lot of Sahaja Yogis. In England, Hungary, Spain, France, Austria, India, Switzerland, so many places, everywhere practically, except for Sweden and Norway. These two countries we’ve not tried, the rest we have. And Greece we are going to; in Greece we have but still I’ve not been to Greece. We are even in Bogota, in America. 

Question: What is the effect of food and breathing?

Shri Mataji: The food is whatever suitable for a person has to have. For a person who is right sided, who is very futuristic, he has to have more carbohydrates; a person who is left sided has to have more proteins, it is according to the person. 

Also the breathing. Breathing also is very scientifically done. If you have to have breathing of a particular type then you can have it. But unnecessarily to do too much of breathing and all that is not good. 

The way we diet sometimes, the way we diet, we do very wrong dieting without understanding how it is going to help us. We must have a diet which will suit our personality, our temperament and our whole being. 

I would say Hatha yoga for example people do just like blind. They can get heart attack, they can become very dry people, they will have divorces, they will never marry. 

So one has to understand that you have to be in balance. It is not taking all the medicine from the medicine box at the same time. But unless and until your kundalini moves how are you to know where is the problem, in what center? Then only you find out that not much is needed to be done but to be more particular about your own self and to understand what is needed for your own being.

Yesterday I found that most of you needed to forgive everyone. That’s no food, no breathing but they had to forgive. Some people were thinking too much, all the time thinking, thinking. So I had to little bit relax their thinking, that’s all. So it is not any hard and fast thing, no discipline but you in yourself discipline yourself. Because if you do something against yourself you lose your vibrations. But you have to master it, you have to become yourself a master. But sometimes people find it very difficult to unlearn what they have put in their heads.

Question: Do we need any mantras?

Shri Mataji. No, no mantras. I don’t give any mantras. Every chakra has a mantra. For example for this center is the Lord’s Prayer. For this center it is “Allah hu Akbar.” means “The God is great.” So for every center there is a deity, there is a deity and the mantra is according to the deity in all the religions. Christ has said that, “Those who are not against us are with us.” Who are those people? These are the deities. He has also said, “You’ll be calling me ‘Christ, Christ’, I won’t recognize you.” Lots of things he has said, we just overlook. 

Question: The master teaches the disciple or the disciple teaches the master?

Shri Mataji: We have no masters. I’m your mother and I feel all of you. My heart is open for all of you. Everyone I allow to come, there is no restriction on anyone whatsoever. So the child is your own so there is no need to have any master or anyone; you become your own master. But of course mother is a master; mother teaches the child when the child is small, isn’t it? But she does it out of love. That’s what it is. 

The so-called masters have just minted money. They have done no good and made people much worse than what they were.

Question: Does the Realization bring transformation in our life?

Shri Mataji: Completely. Even on your face, you look at least ten years, twenty years younger and you look very active. Very active you become, you work very hard and don’t feel tired. I’m 65, travelling every day, going all over the places, working every night, day, every time. I never get tired. 

Question: [UNCLEAR, about medical condition of heart?]

Shri Mataji: On the left or on the right? Alright, it would be alright.

Question: Shall we eat fish and meat?

Shri Mataji: Yes, it’s alright. Not for you but for me. You have to take more carbohydrates. 

This vegetarianism has also gone to the extremes now. By eating vegetables if somebody is going to go to God it’s very easy. Actually it has gone to such an extent in India in certain communities that they don’t even want to kill bugs and mosquitoes. Animals are not more important than human beings. If some people need proteins they have to take proteins and in evolutionary process that is how you grow. Big fish eats the small fish then the muscles of the small fish develop in a better way so it evolves. But as I said everybody does not need actually the same things but different, different. 

Especially in the West people are eating too much of meat and fish so they should take more to vegetarianism, it is alright. But in India or people when they are vegetarians they are extremely suppressed people and frightened people and if their muscles do not grow they will not be alright. So they have to develop their muscles, makes no difference. But one must to act scientifically, it’s not something of head, kind of ideology, it’s a scientific thing. It’s not just an ideology, it’s a scientific thing. 

[A lady explains deeply moved how she felt after Realization and thanks to Shri Mataji.]

Thank you, madam. She is in balance, that’s why. Very kind, I can feel your heart. 

One has to know that it is not the ego that is going to help or our conditionings, it is our state. First thing you must have desire to ascend, it’s important, actually pure desire otherwise I can’t help you. If you are just an intelligent, intellectual things you are having, just acrobats with intellect, you are just wasting your time and my time.  

Alright. So now let’s have Realization.

Now those who do not want to have should go away. But those who want to have should sit here and the way I’ll tell you, we have to work it out. It will take hardly ten minutes.

Very sweet. [to comments from the audience]

First of all, it’s very simple, it is spontaneous, it works spontaneously. You don’t have to …

You are alright now? You are looking fine. Sit comfortably, comfortably.

Now we have to take the help of the Mother Earth and all the elements. This you will know later on. So I would request you just to take out your shoes if possible and to put your feet right on Mother Earth, away from each other. 

As I told you the left side is represented by your left hand and represents your power of desire. So please put your left hand like this. And with the right hand we’ll be relaxing our centers. This I’m just telling you because you can do it later on also. You please put your left hand like this and now I’ll show you how the centers you are going to relax. First we put our right hand on our heart because in the heart is the reflection of the Spirit.

If you don’t do it you won’t get the experience and then you will ask me the questions, also very personal. Let him go away. Better you go away then. Then if you are confused stop being confused. You put left hand like this. You must have the experience I was telling you, so let’s have the experience. You can come in front. Must be he can’t see me. Can you see me now? Left hand like this. He’s showing, you see.

Right hand on the heart. Here resides the Spirit. Now the second center is on …. Everything is on the left hand side. The second center is in the upper part of your abdomen on the left side. Then you should know that this is the center of your mastery; by this center you become the master. Please put your right hand in the lower part of your abdomen on the left hand side and press it hard. 

[People in the audience are told how to put their hands.]

This is the center through which the Divine laws work, so this is the center of pure knowledge. Now we go back again in the upper part of the abdomen on the left hand side, then again on the heart – this is the way the kundalini rises. You put this right hand here on the neck, in the corner here from the front side. Now this center catches when you feel guilty and gives you all the problems of spondylitis, angina and all that. Turn your head to the rightfully. Then you stretch your hand like this, put it on your forehead and press it on both the sides. This is the center as I said of Christ who has asked us to forgive everyone. And the same center we’ve got on the backside, you put the hand like this and allow your head to rest on it. This is the center where we ask forgiveness. We stretch our hand and the center of your palm you put it on the fontanel bone area where there is a soft bone in your childhood and press it hard and move it seven times. Stretch your fingers and press it hard, the scalp, and move it seven times. That’s all you have to do. 

With right hand, with right hand. It’s alright, we do it again. We are going to do it again.

Now we close our eyes. We don’t open our eyes till I tell you. Please keep the left hand like this, feet are separate, this hand should be used [the right]. 

Now please put your right hand on your heat. And close your eyes. Here you have to ask a very fundamental question. Ask the question to me, you can call me “Shri Mataji” or “Mother”, whatever suits you, “Mother, am I the Spirit?” ask this question three times sincerely.

If you are the Spirit you are also your master. Please bring the hand and put it on the upper part of your abdomen on the left hand side and press it with your fingers. And here your ask three times again a very fundamental question, “Mother, am I my own master?”

Now take your hand in the lower part of your abdomen on the left hand side and press it hard. Now here you ask me because I cannot take away your freedom, I cannot force you so please say, “Mother, may I have the pure knowledge, pure knowledge of the Divine.” Say it six times because this center has got six petals. With this asking the kundalini, which is the pure desire, has started rising. 

So please take your right hand onto the upper part of your abdomen on the left hand side. Here you have to say with full confidence to open this center, “Mother, I am my master.” Say it ten times, with full confidence. 

Now raise your hand on your heart again. With full confidence again you say, “Mother, I am the Spirit.” which is the truth. Please say it twelve times.

Now we must know the Divine is the ocean of love and bliss; it is the ocean of joy but above all it is the ocean of forgiveness. And what mistake you can commit that cannot be dissolved in this ocean of love? So please forgive yourself and be pleasantly placed towards yourself and understand that you are the temple of God.

Now raise your right hand and put it in the corner of your shoulder and your neck and turn your head to the right. So at this center you have to say, “Mother, I am not guilty.” Say it sixteen times. 

Now please put your hand on your forehead across, with the left hand towards me, and press it on both the sides. Here you have to say, “Mother, I forgive everyone.” Say it from your heart, how many times is not the point. Many people say that it’s difficult to forgive but actually we do not do anything when do not forgive or we forgive. But when we do not forgive we play into wrong hands. 

Now please put your right hand on the back of your head and put your head on that. Now for your satisfaction, without feeling guilty you have to say, “Oh, Divine, if we have done anything wrong please forgive us.” but only for your satisfaction. 

Now stretch your hand and put the center of your palm on top of your fontanel bone area, press it hard and move the scalp seven times with your fingers stretched out. Here also, I’m sorry, I cannot force Self-realization on you, you have to ask for it. So please say seven times, “Mother, please may I have my Realization. Mother, please give me my Self-realization.” Seven times. 

Now take down your hand. Open your eyes please. 

Now please put both your hands towards the sky and your head and ask one question, “Mother, is this the Cool Breeze of the Holy Ghost?” In the Sanskrit language Holy Ghost is the Adi Shakti. Ask this question three times. 

Please put down your hands. 

More than yesterday? Very good.

Now those who have felt cool breeze in the hands and cool breeze out of their fontanel bone, please raise your both the hands. 

[Shri Mataji asks the people in the audience if they felt the cool breeze.]

Again, may I see how many of you felt somehow something. Those who have felt anything, raise both your hands. Good.

Doesn’t matter. There is little problem that’s why some people have felt less in this or less in that one [hands]. Doesn’t matter, these problems are to be corrected. Supposing you have felt it on the left hand and not on the right hand then you put the right hand towards me and left hand like this [up in the air]. If you have not felt on the right hand please put like that. Better?