Villa Sassi, Turin (Italy)

2000-09-08 Interview Turin Italy DP-RAW, 60'
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(Conversations with sahaja yogis in a hotel)

Shri Mataji to a child: I’m talking about you! Ah! One child is enough!
Guido: To change the atmosphere.
Shri Mataji: Absolutely. They try to please you all the time. You should take to small children, then you won’t age much. I think one of the things.
Guido: Vibrations.
Shri Mataji: Vibrations, and also you become like a child, with them, that enjoyment of the children. You cannot get old. Very difficult. They do not have reactions. Singing now.

This gentleman, how did he know Me?
Guido: He (indicates Aldo) contacted him.
Shri Mataji: So what did you tell him?
Aldo: I told him all about Sahaja Yoga, but he…
Guido: He gave him a leaflet about Sahaja Yoga, so he invited you to come.

Interview to Shri Mataji to an interviewer in the hotel.

Question: What is love for you?
Shri Mataji: Love? Love is the power of divinity. It’s the Divine. And that’s why this whole world was created out of love.
Q.: So everybody has an inner instrument, but mostly they don’t use it. Why?
Shri Mataji: Because of ignorance. Ignorance, you see, every human being is not equally aware.
Q.: Is it possible to change this condition?
Shri Mataji: Yes, it has to.
Q.: In which way?
Shri Mataji: By feeling the vibrations of that person on your fingertips. From the level of spirituality.
Q.: Which is your mission in Italy?
Shri Mataji: Everywhere, it is not only here. Because Sahaja Yoga is now in 86 countries, alright? And My mission is to create a global unity.
Q.: To improve the life? To make life better?

Shri Mataji: Of course, of course, what we have to do is to understand that most of the problems that we have are coming from human beings, because they are imperfect. There are problems with them. But if they are transformed, and if they become saintly, beautiful, spiritual, all our problems will be solved.

Q.: The Yoga is one way to change this situation?
Shri Mataji: The only way, this Sahaja Yoga, is the only way so far I know, which has changed people, which has transformed. Because is based on the actually, on the Kundalini which is the power in every man’s triangular bone.

Q.: And you think that is possible to move the Kundalini?
Shri Mataji: If that is awakened, if that power is awakened, it passes through six centres – ultimately the last here, and by which you become connected to the all-pervading power, which is very subtle. And you become the owner of that power, which flows – that’s love, that’s compassion.
Q.: When you practice the meditation, where you go with your heart, with your mind?
Shri Mataji: I go nowhere, I go inside. I know about My centres. I don’t go anywhere out, I’m inside. Inside Myself, and I know Myself. First we must know our self, otherwise we cannot know God, we cannot know anything.

Q.: And what is it in your heart?
Shri Mataji: What is it in your…?
Q: …in your heart.
Guido: What is residing in your heart.

Shri Mataji: In My heart resides God Almighty.

Q.: OK. The last question for you: where the world goes?
Guido: Where is this humanity going?
Shri Mataji: It is going into the Last Judgement. Whether they take to higher life or to baser life. This is the Last Judgement.

Q.: There is one thing that you want to say for the people, for the…
Shri Mataji: Yes, of course! The message is that within you is this power, and this power is your own Mother, your individual Mother, and She knows everything about you. And She is anxious to give you your second birth. She takes up all responsibility, only thing you should want it, it cannot be forced. That’s it.
Int.: Thank you.
Shri Mataji: And you can’t pay for it. It’s the evolutionary process now. Is the end of the evolutionary process, that you jump into new realm, and that by that you develop a new awareness of collective consciousness and thoughtless awareness, to begin with.

Q.: What is for you the wellness?

Guido: Awareness.

Shri Mataji: Awareness is to be conscious that something has to be done, there’s a seeking, that’s awareness. According to Me, the real wealth is your Spirit, that you are the Spirit. That’s your real wealth.

Q.: We are only Spirit?
Shri Mataji: Of course. You are not this body, this mind, and you are not this intellect. You are the Spirit.
Int. Thank you.
Shri Mataji: That should happen.
Int. Thank you.
Shri Mataji: May God bless you. He’s very subtle.
Int: Thank you.
Shri Mataji: That’s all (She smiles).
Guido all’intervistatore: Vuol provare l’esperienza?
Int.: Di che genere?
Guido: Il risveglio della Kundalini.
Int.: Si può?
Shri Mataji: You are a very subtle person, I must say. You asked Me very subtle questions.

Int.: Va bene. Come si deve fare?
Shri Mataji: Alright.

(After Kundalini awakening)
Shri Mataji: You are already a realised soul. Got it. Are you feeling the cool breeze?
Int.: I feel, yes.
Shri Mataji: That’s it! Now you have become. Very good. What I must say that journalists are the most powerful people in modern times. And it really depends on you how you are going to lead or mislead this world.
Int.: For me is very important to show the real nature of the man.
Guido: He says it’s very important for him to show the reality, the inner reality of man.
Shri Mataji: Of course. But the reality is that you are the Spirit.
Int.: Is little difficult for people understand…
Shri Mataji: No, that’s all, what you call, a camouflage. It’s not real. The real is that you are the Spirit. That’s real.
Guido: He says it’s little difficult to make people understand this.
Shri Mataji: No, they will. See now, I’ve been doing that, and I’ve seen people understand. Is the best way to tell them…You have to tell them everything frankly, because they are misled. They’re on the wrong track. So we have to save them.

Guido: Very strong vibrations.
Shri Mataji: He’s very good, he’s very good. Very good, excellent.
Int.: I hope that tomorrow evening I go to you to Teatro Regio.
Guido: He would like to come tomorrow evening to meet You…
Shri Mataji: Please, do, and bring all your friends! And all your family!
Guido: E porta anche i tuoi amici e la tua famiglia.
Shri Mataji: And all your family.
Shri Mataji: Excellent.
Guido: He’s feeling also.
Int.: I am in heaven now!
Shri Mataji (laughs): This is the paradise created by your Spirit, in the state of realisation. It makes you peaceful, joyful, wise, and enjoyable everything.
Int.: Without ego!
Shri Mataji: Without…?
Guido: Ego!
Shri Mataji: (laughing loudly) You don’t have.
Int.: No? Thank you!
Shri Mataji: You don’t have.
Int.: Finally one person that tells me I have not a ego.
Shri Mataji: Ah (laughs).
Guido: He says you are the first person who is telling him that he has no ego.
Shri Mataji: No, he hasn’t. He hasn’t got ego. You see, all those who have ego always think that (laughs) that others have ego. Do you understand? (laughs) (Int.: Eh. Vero.)
If you had ego, you could not have got it so fast. But I think he has little sinus.

Int.: Yes.
Shri Mataji: He has.
Int.: Yes.
Shri Mataji: Alright? Now, for that a simple method is to take onion, two onions, and put it on the fire, it becomes black. Then cut it half straight, I mean, standing, and then foment it with that (lower part of forehead). Very simple. And here also (sinuses).

Int.: And don’t eat cheese.
Shri Mataji: No, no, cheese is alright.
Int.: Yes?
Shri Mataji: Yes, it’s nothing to do with cheese. It is because hot and cold, the difference between hot and cold – say, something you take hot and then you take cold, you see, like coffee and then ice-cream. Or you suddenly expose yourself from a hot place to the cold, or cold to the hot. It could be cured.

Int.: I feel my hands (laughs).
Shri Mataji: I know, I know (laughs). But this can be easily cured, you try that, maybe with two, first about, say, ten minutes. Then again if you get sick, then you should try after five minutes. It will go away.
Int.: Thank you.
Shri Mataji: May God bless you. What’s his name?
Int.: George.
Shri Mataji: George! Oh dear. George is the name of Mahavira, He’s an angel, on the left hand side. Left side, yes. There’s right side is Buddha, and the left side is Mahavira.
Int. Ah, the right is Buddha and the left is….
Shri Mataji: Yes. So He guards you from all the left side problems.
Int.: Emotions?
Shri Mataji: Yes. George. And Michael is the same. And the right side, and Hanumana and Gabriel the same. You’ll know everything – it’s all united, they’re all joined together. It’s not that this is Indian, it’s Italian – it’s wrong. Inside they’re all one.
Int.: Sarebbe bello riuscire ad integrare tutto.
Guido: Questo è quello che succede con Sahaja Yoga.
Shri Mataji: And that Christ is sitting here in the centre, on the optic chiasma. So, what you have to do is to forgive. Forgive everyone. Then it opens out petal (?).
Guido: L’importante è perdonare. Per aprire questo centro…
Int.: L’importante è perdonare. Certo.
Shri Mataji: Torino is good, that way. But I think in Torino there has been some black magic and things like that.
Int.: I feel this situation. There are many people that practise…
Shri Mataji: Must be from Egypt.
Int.: I don’t know why. (…)

Shri Mataji: That’s very dangerous. That causes cancer. In Sahaja Yoga you can cure them, because you come in the centre, nor on the left, neither on the right. You pass through that (run with the hand the central channel). And here is the place (She touches the fontanel bone area)…Yes, yes. Passes through this (She touches the ego and superego) ; through the limbic area (She makes the gesture of the Kundalini passing through the fontanel bone). And here is the place (She touches the fontanel bone) of God Almighty, which is reflected in your heart as the Spirit. You will know everything. You master it. Yes, of course. Within one month’s time you will be master. Very simple. Give him My book. He can read English. He’s very good.

Int.: Ok. Thank you.
Shri Mataji: All right. May God bless you. Thank you very much. Thank you. Very nice to have met you. Thank you.
Int.: Thank you.

Shri Mataji: Very nice.
Int.: Wonderful.
Shri Mataji: Alright. Thank you.
Int.: Thank you very much.
Guido: See you tomorrow night.

Shri Mataji: He’s coming, coming.
All this is very nice.

(More conversation with sahaja yogis in the hotel)

Shri Mataji: We have to revive our old classical music. We have to.
Guido: Western classical?
Shri Mataji: Yes. We have to revive, whether in Italy, wherever it is.
Guido: Maybe Austria.
Shri Mataji: Austria, Austria is, see, becomes localised. But in a place where they can all come, stay, work it out… We should have. Thank God in India it has revived. India it has revived, otherwise we were worried that Indian music would be finished. It’s come back. But still there are groups in India who take to Western pop music.

G.: Ah, pop music.
Shri Mataji: And then there’s jazz. That’s something like Indian style.
G.: In between.
Shri Mataji: In between (they laugh). There are many Indians who’d like to learn piano. Specially in Calcutta. All the rich people used to have a piano in the house. Very common. Because Indians have a special ear for the music. Also in our cinemas they use piano. For the music, for background music. They use. Babamama started with the clarinet. He made people play on clarinet Indian music.

G.: Yes, the first time he came to Ganapatipule he brought somebody with…
Shri Mataji: Also violin of course, but piano so far not. But we can have it, is like harmonium only, piano. Now this Dhumal is coming. And Ali’s coming. And Sandesh. Dhumal is another genius.

Jazz music is alright, but this another one is like a satanic stuff.
G.: Is techno, they call it techno.
Shri Mataji: Techlo?
G.: Techno, is technological music.
Shri Mataji: Techlo, yes. Is techlo or (something). But people are mad. Starts from America.

An interview made by a young journalist.

Question: Shri Mataji Nirmala Devi è portatrice di un messaggio universale di profonda spiritualità. Negli anni ’70 Lei ha introdotto il Sahaja Yoga, oggi praticato in tutto il mondo. Di che cosa si tratta?

Shri Mataji: In English? Alright. Sahaja Yoga – Sahaja means ‘born with you’. Also it means ‘spontaneous’. And Yoga means the union with the Divine.
Q.: Qual è la differenza con lo Yoga tradizionale?
Shri Mataji: There is no difference. Because this traditional Yoga was done thousands of years back, when they first wanted to cleanse the body, then the mind, then the intellect, and ultimately they wanted to do Sahaja Yoga.
Q.: Sahaja Yoga, realizzazione del Sé, benessere ed equilibrio interiore.
Shri Mataji: Of course. It is so. It is for complete inner balance, for your peace of mind, also, the joy of your Spirit.
Q.: Qual è la missione di Shri Mataji?
Shri Mataji: To bring global peace by transforming human beings.
Q.: La Kundalini che cos’è?
Shri Mataji: It is a force within us, in the triangular bone, called as ‘sacrum’ – that means the Greeks knew it’s a sacred bone. And this energy is kept just like waiting for you to be awakened.

Q.: Perché è così importante?
Shri Mataji: Because you have to have your evolution. All our problems come from human beings, because they are not evolved, they are not enlightened. So, if they are enlightened, all these six enemies we have of anger, greed, all kinds of things that we do, violence and all that, will just drop out.
Moreover, moreover, in all the scriptures it is written “You know your Self, then you will know God”. So, how will you know your Self? You have to know your Spirit. Only through awakening you’ll know it.

Q.: Parlando ancora del Sahaja Yoga, è praticabile da tutti.
Shri Mataji:: Of course.
Q.: Ma come avviene, come viene praticato questo Yoga?
Shri Mataji: There is nothing to be practiced. It just happens in us (…). But only thing is people have problems on their centres through which it passes, so you have to just correct them, and you have to master the knowledge, which is absolute.

Q.: Come è nata la Sahaja Yoga?
Shri Mataji: See, when I was born, I knew I was enlightened, Myself. But I thought it should go to the collective. People should get it in a big way.
So I little bit, I should say, experimented with human beings, and I tried to find out what is the problem is. Then I worked out all the permutations and combinations of problems. And I found out a very easy method of giving self-realisation.

Q.: Shri Mataji è anche a Torino per portare un messaggio.
Shri Mataji: Yes, of course. Torino is a very artistic place and with people with very large heart, and I’m sure they’ll work out very well. All right?
Interviewer: Thank you very much.
Shri Mataji: May God bless you.

The young interviewer receives Realization.

Shri Mataji: (to Guido who raises the Kundalini of the girl and works on her) Put the left to the right.
Now. Very good. Are you feeling cool breeze? Ah. This is actualisation of baptism. Just happens. You yourself will become master. And you can create also. That’s how Sahaja Yoga is spreading in 86 countries.

Interviewer: Benissimo.
Shri Mataji: It’s your right to get it. It’s your evolutionary process, you see, last epitome of the evolutionary process. All right?
Interviewer: All right.
Shri Mataji: May God bless you.
Interviewer: Wonderful. Thank you very much.
Shri Mataji: Thank you very much. May God bless you (they shake their hands).

Press conference with a female journalist and two male journalists.

Guido to one journalist: Cosa vorrebbe sapere su Sahaja Yoga?
Shri Mataji: My family…
Guido: Your history…
Shri Mataji: I was born in India, at the time when the British were ruling us, and My father and mother both were very patriotic people, very well-educated, and I was born in a Protestant Christian family.
Then in My childhood what happened was that because of this patriotic feeling within Me also, in the college I studied there, and then there was, we had a called “Quit India Movement”, that My father was arrested, mother was arrested, and I took part in the youth of those people.

Q.: Le tecniche dello Yoga, invece, per quanto concerne questa tecnica…
Shri Mataji: That was much later. Because I did My medicine, studied medicine, and then when you see, I felt always from My very childhood, that I have got Myself self-realisation, what you can call enlightenment, so everybody should get it. And because of that happening, the whole world will change.

Other journalist: Qual è il messaggio del Sahaja Yoga e quali sono i benefici di questo…
Shri Mataji: The message of Sahaja Yoga is that human beings have to jump one more step, to become a realised soul, an enlightened personality, by which you solve all the world’s problems. Because all the problems that we have in this world, most of them, apart from the calamities, they come from human beings. But if they are enlightened, in the light of their Spirit, they’ll understand their value, they’ll understand the value of others, and the whole change will be there, lot of change will take place.

All the scriptures have said that you have to know yourself. But how do you know yourself is the problem, because you have to go inside. And for that there is already a power placed in our triangular bone. Now this power, which is called as Kundalini, is placed in the triangular bone called as sacrum. That means the Greeks knew it’s a sacred bone. And this power, when it rises within us, is awakened, and passes through six centres, subtle centres, and pierces through the last centre, what we call as the fontanel bone area. That’s how you get the actualisation of your baptism. So, as a result of that, we do not react, because we become thoughtlessly aware. We become a witness of everything. And secondly we become collectively conscious.

J.: Thank you very much.
Shri Mataji: May God bless you. (They shake hands)

(The journalists receive their realisation)

Shri Mataji: You’ll start feeling the cool breeze on your fingertips, in your hands. This is the cool breeze of the Holy Ghost. All right? Are you feeling?
Female Interviewer: Yes.
Shri Mataji: It’s spontaneous, that is spontaneous, Sahaj. Now see on top of your head, yes. Here, here. Fontanel bone (She touches Her fontanel bone) which was a soft bone in your childhood. Ah. Little higher. Get it? Little higher, take your hand little higher, above. Higher.
They’ve got it. Now, put your right hand towards Me like that.
Got it! Alright? You too. It’s worked out. So spontaneous. Now you have to just know the centres that you have. They are, you can feel them on your fingertips, your centres. And you will know what’s wrong with you on the centres (She touches the fingers of Her hand).
It could be the left, on the left side are these five (fingers – centres), six (base of palm), and seven (centre of palm) centres. The right side are these five, six and seven. Seventh (centre of palm). (Shows base of palm of right hand) This is the first one.

Altogether there are seven, but this seventh (shows base of palm of right hand) is not above Kundalini, is below. This one, the first one.

Now. So you start seeing what’s wrong with you on your fingertips. Also you can give realisations to others. And you can also feel their problems on what centres they have. And these centres look after physical, mental, emotional and spiritual being. Spiritual being. So physically you feel alright, your health is alright, it can cure cancer and many other such diseases, for no money at all.

Mentally – many people are psychologically upset, they can get the balance, they’re alright. They become very strong within.

And intelligence, which is running all over, stops, and you start seeing the truth. And the reality. If it happens to many people, then global problems are solved.
And media is very important. You perhaps don’t realise how great you are. What you can do to transform this world, to bring peace, and joy, and togetherness.
So enjoy your peace now, enjoy yourself. And we have a centre here, you can know everything. Is the absolute knowledge, absolute.

Interviewer: Chiunque può fare Sahaja Yoga?

Shri Mataji: Of course, of course, is for everyone! Everybody is in problem, everybody needs it! There are no boundaries. We have in South Africa, we have in Benin, where all the people are black, you know? We have seven thousand people in Benin. And Ivory Coast: the President of Ivory Coast is a sahaja yogi. In Eritrea also. So we have Sahaja Yoga everywhere now spreading, because everybody wants peace. Russia is the best. Thousands and thousands are there. Because of communism, they were thinking inside, they were going inside, they became very deep. While in democratic countries, see, they offer so many chances for us to get lost. We are free, but no real freedom. This is what is the problem of modern times.
And Sahaja Yoga was the need, need of the hour. Is predicted by many saints that this time will come, when so many people will get their self-realisation. That’s the solution for all our violence, for all our problems.

If they have to ask any questions…

Female journalist: Prima avete parlato del fatto che, con questa tecnica, si riesce a risolvere problemi di salute di un certo tipo, quindi anche malattie che per ora sono mortali. Ma siete riusciti a risolvere casi del genere… Dato che comunque la nostra televisione interessa soprattutto il Piemonte, siete riusciti a fare cose simili anche nella nostra regione?
Guido: Non so, Aldo, c’è stata qualche guarigione clamorosa?
Female journalist: Può parlare magari di un caso?
Guido: In Italia moltissimi. Tantissimi, sì. Casi di leucemia, problemi coronarici, linfatici… Una persona aveva un cancro al cervello, ecc. ecc.
Sahaja yogi: A Milano.
Aldo: Qua più che altro problema di dipendenze tipo alcool, droghe. Sahaja Yoga è proprio l’eliminazione di queste dipendenze.

(Guido tells Shri Mataji that the journalist asked about the diseases cured by Sahaja Yoga).

Shri Mataji: Many, many, thousands and thousands. I have one hospital in India, very big hospital, where we are getting people from all over the world for getting cured. So I mean, I cannot give you the list of things (we have cured).

Female journalist: Addirittura un ospedale?

Guido: Sì, sì”.
Shri Mataji: And you cannot pay for it.
Female journalist: Ah no?
Guido: Questo non si può comprare, perché non ha prezzo.
Shri Mataji: Only for their stay and food, that’s all. We have qualified doctors who have taken to Sahaja Yoga. Also in America, the National Institute of Health, N.I.H., has now accepted Sahaja Yoga. Even a person, a lay person, can know what’s wrong with another person.

In N.I.H. there was one doctor who wanted to test the sahaja yogis. He asked: “What’s wrong with me?”. He said: “Heart”. And he had a by-pass about a month back. On the fingertips. On fingertips (…) feel on the fingertips. Don’t have to go for the rigmarole (…).

We are having now in India in jail people are getting transformed, in the military, administrative system, in (senior?) administrative service, and bureaucrats – most difficult! And we also have with the people who are doing (…) units, taxation and all that, finance. Big use (…).
Q.: Fuori dall’India ha invece incontrato diffidenza?
Shri Mataji: Not Italians. Because they have a large heart. But Germans are dry, English are getting no end of themselves, so rather good but not much. So they are difficult.

Q.: Grazie.
Shri Mataji: Also about drug addiction, alcoholism, gets cured. Completely. And I bought a place for that in Italy. But so far we haven’t got the permissions.
Sahaja Yoga can definitely cure drug addiction and alcoholism. Can definitely cure. That is one of your great problems. Also cancer. Cancer is a very big problem. You have AIDS, but AIDS patients are very arrogant, and they won’t listen to anyone. And they think they are going for martyrdom. So impossible, you can’t manage them. Same with Alzheimer’s: they are very hot-tempered, they abuse you. Otherwise everything is alright.

Other interviewer: Che tipo di relazioni ci sono con le religioni?
Shri Mataji: You see, religions are just the same, every religions is the same. But people who have taken it over either they become money-oriented, power-oriented, they want land…and all kinds of problems. That’s not religion.
But religion gives you balance, the chakra here (touches Nabhi). Not to fight, not to have greed, lust – all that’s out of question. That’s why all religions have failed.

They have to take to reality, to the Absolute. Then it will work out. The problem in all these religions is that there’s a book for each, and the way they, the way they sort of interpret the books is difficult. And you cannot correct them also. So all kinds of complications are there. For example, in the Bible …

(End of videotape)

Int.:I am in heaven now!
Shri Mataji (laughs): This is the paradise created by your Spirit, in the state of realisation. It makes you peaceful, joyful, wise, and enjoyable everything.
Int.:Without ego!
Shri Mataji:Without…?
Guido: Ego!
Shri Mataji:(laughing loudly)You don’t have.
Int.:No? Thank you!
Shri Mataji:You don’t have.
Int.: Finally one person that tells me I have not a ego.
Shri Mataji: Ah (laughs).