Interview on Radio Enghien

Marie Rouger’s flat, Paris (France)

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Interview on Radio Enghien, Marie Rouger’s flat, Enghien, suburbs of Paris (France), September 29th, 1984, 29/09/1984

Interviewer [speaks in French]: She is known in India as the greatest woman of these days. She comes to propose to Westerners as well as to Orientals a new stage in their conscience which was promised by Jesus-Christ himself. We can ask Shri Mataji how to achieve this new state of conscience and what will it bring to us?
Marie: The question is how to reach this new state of consciousness and what will t bring us?

Shri Mataji: This new state of consciousness, to begin with, should be called as Collective Consciousness and I should be achieved spontaneously.
You don’t have to exert, you don’t have to pay for it, it is spontaneously happening, f there is somebody who knows how to awaken the residual power called Kundalini within you.

Interviewer [speaks in French]: Très bien, on peut aussi se poser la question de savoir comment se manifeste ce nouvel état de conscience si, dans le passé déjà, des personnes en ont parlé dans notre civilisation, aussi bien que dans d’autres civilisations.
Marie: Now, how does this awareness manifest itself, and what have been the manifestations of awareness in the past, now, as there have been people who have manifested this awareness.

Shri Mataji: In the tradition of spirituality, it has been happening for thousands of years. But in the beginning of time, the tree of life had few flowers which became the fruits. But I called this time the blossom time where many flowers have to become the fruits.

The manifestation of this new awareness takes place because the Spirit, that is the reflection of the Divine with you, starts manifesting in your attention. Firstly you become, again I say you become collectively conscious, means you start feeling the other people on your fingertips, their centres, the subtle centres, and you start feeling your subtle centres also on your fingertips.

Now the collective consciousness of attention is so powerful that sitting down here, you can feel the vibrations or the state of another person anywhere in the world and also you should get the power to cure the problems of the other person who is far away. Like through ether we can hear the radio anywhere, with just the subtler of the ether by which we know about anyone in the whole world any person, but not only that we can know about that person, but we can become effective, we can help this person thought the subtle side of the ether. As you start growing in the experience of the Spirit, you become so powerful that you can overcome all your problems, physical, mental, emotional, you get rid of all your temptations and get rid of your bad habits.

But this is the power of compassion and love of the Divine. So, though you become very powerful, you become very sublime, very righteous and virtuous. You do not have a mental projection about compassion but through you, you achieve compassionate acts, as if when you are with other people, they feel the peace and the bliss. And also, you can cure other people without difficulties.
You start feeling the joy and the peace of the Spirit. And then gradually you grow into a being who becomes the source of joy and peace. In short, this is the epitome of our evolutionary process which is living. Because it is a living process, it happens spontaneously. It is beyond all imaginary, mental processes.
You become very dynamic and also very knowledgeable because the Spirit is the source of all the real knowledge. Human being is a fantastic instrument and this fantastic instrument has to be worked out so that we can know how and why a human being has been created. And also through this process of evolution, one can find meaning to many things which are being denied by mental processes. Only thing is, by this happening, the instrument is connected to the mains.

Interviewer [speaks in French]: It looks really fascinating but how to believe it? It looks really quite incredible. It is true that since thousands of years, all the great personalities of humanity, the Christ, Muhammad, every one has talked about this Advent, of a new state of awareness, of perfection, but how to know, to believe that it is the event that you are talking about? That it is the truth, the achievement. How to believe it, what are the proofs of it?
Marie: It’s true that every body has spoken about this coming, this Realization. Mohamed and Christ have spoken and said that there was a new opening that something was coming, but how to believe that it’s really this, this is it?

Shri Mataji: Whatever happens to you on your central nervous system is what you achieve in your evolution. For example if there’s a dog, and if you ask the dog to go through a dirty lane, it can go but a human being cannot go because on our central nervous system we can feel the filth.
With this transformation you feel the cool breeze of the Holy Ghost coming out of your fontanel bone area, you can feel it actually. Ad then from your hands, you can feel the cool breeze flowing and all around you, you can feel the existence of the Power of Divine as cool breeze, you can feel it on your central nervous system. And many people, overnight, get transformed into sublime and good people. It is not possible, unless and until there is something like the transformation of an egg into a bird has taken place.

Interviewer [speaks in French]: It is interesting to know that Shri Mataji will give 2 public program on Friday, September the 28th and Saturday 29th, means tonight, 5 rue Lascase Paris 07, à 20h, metro Station: Solférino. And before going on with our interview, here is some music. See you soon. 16:41

Interviewer: Radio Enghien.

Another interviewer [speaks in French]: Shri Mataji, is it possible for everyone, for each one of us, to get access to this Yoga or is it for a special elite?
Marie: The question is: is this Yoga accessible for every body or is it only for an elite?
Shri Mataji: It is for everyone.Sahaja means – “saha” means “with”, “ja” means “born”. It is born with every human being and it’s within every one but every one doesn’t want to have it. That’s the trouble in this world is, that the people are running after other things which they think can give them hapiness but ultimately does not. It does not give them, only their Spirit is going to give them joy. So those who will seek will definitely find it.

Second interviewer [speaks in French]: In the world in which we live nowadays, in turmoil, where people are wondering a lot, I would like to know if there is a relationship between this Aquarian era, about which we talk in the previous broadcast, and this Advent of the Aquarius, of these vibrations, maybe of you.
Marie: The question is: I sthere a relationship between this Age of Aquarius that every body is talking bout, the coming of the Age of Aquarius nd these vibrations?

Shri Mataji: The Age of Aquarius means the Carrier of the water which is a picture of this Aquarius and according to Sahaja Yoga the abode of this residual energy, Kundalini, is the Aquarius. So this is the Age of the Aquarius means this is the age of the Kundalini. Means that this residual energy will rise from its abode and will grant Realization to people.

Second interviewer [speaks in French]: Last time, we also talked about a great incarnation who is Jesus Christ and I would like to know if He has a place in Sahaja Yoga, if He was introduced as a divine personality or as a great prophet?
Marie: In the last program, they spoke about Christ. Now, he would like to know if Christ has a place in Sahaja Yoga and what is Christ? He is recognized as an incarnation or as a great prophet? Who is he?
Shri Mataji: Christ has a very great place in Sahaja Yoga. He is regarded as the son of God as the embodiment of innocence within us. And He resides in the centre which is placed between the pituitary and the pineal body, at the optic chiasm. This is called as Agnya Chakra, which is a gate to the limbic area, which is the kingdom of God. So, the Kundalini has to pass, everybody’s Kundalini has to pass through this gate. And you have to have faith in Christ that He should be awakened there. And once He is awakened in that centre, then only you can enter into the Kingdom of God.

Second interviewer [speaks in French]: Our show is actually called “on the other side of the door” and you propose to go to the other side of the door. Would there be something that would prevent us from taking that step? You speak for example of faith: can one have faith, as one has faith in UFOs for example, or is it quite another thing?
Marie: Well, he talked about faith in Christ. To cross the door, he said, we must have faith in Christ. Now what faith is it? Is it faith like people believe in flying saucers or is it something completely different?

Shri Mataji: It does not mean blind faith at all like organised religions have blind faith and you are asked to have faith in Christ without knowing about him. It is when Christ is awakened within you then you have to have faith because unless and until you take His name, this door does not open. Now, supposing you deny that: “I do not want to take the name of Christ” then this door cannot be opened. That’s why you have to have faith that He existed and that He died on the cross, and this is the cross of the optic chiasm, and that his message was of that, of Resurection. Mentally, it is not needed. But, unless and until you take His name, or I take His name, I cannot make this Kundalini, this energy, pass through this gate. It has nothing to do with any other mental sort of things that we do without having the experience.

[Cut in the audio]

Shri Mataji: …That you just only believe in Christ, because Christ has said: “Those who are not against Me are with Me.” So one must know who are those.
[Cut in the audio]
Stops at 29:29
[End of audio]